They look like this (with a logo on it):
image

Or maybe these?
image

The Hicadoolas

Last edited: Oct 15, 2011 13:16:43

I just read this thread. I bought the Brave new Surf a few weeks ago. I have downloaded all the sites podcasts. I enjoy all of it. From what I see happening in the music business, the best way for a band to make money is touring. I agree with the statement that surf is a small genre. I don't believe that most listeners are techno dinosaurs, though. I'm very involved in the hotrod world. Most of us old guys found the computer to be a tool. We like tools and strive to be more capable with all we own. I think a lot of the surf fans will be the same way. I don't have any good answers to this. I'm aware that "economic progress" can put you out of business while you're working your hardest to be the best you can be. I'm sure aware of how the music business has changed on the consumer end.

I don't deny that lots of people have switched over to buying/stealing music online.
But I find it very sad when people keep saying that the hard copy of recorded media is over.
I don't think its over, its just an option.
I still know, and see people buying cds, dvds, lps all the time.

Jeff(bigtikidude)

It only makes since when you think about carrying around 100 CDs vs 1 MP3 player (or a smart phone for that matter).

Then you have an app like Google Cloud for storing all your media.

Yes,..I think it's safe to say "hard copies" are going the way of the dinosaurs.

You can't put this genie back in the bottle.

METEOR IV on reverbnation

A lot can be said for the reality of physical media by simply visiting your local Walmart or Target. Walmart, in the 1990's was the largest North American music retailer. Yes, that sounds rediculous, but they had the largest collective music sales numbers in the country. Go into one of these stores now and see how much less space is being devoted to physical music. The current sales numbers don't justify them using up the space.

I am also noticing that the amount of space that stores are dedicating to DVD's is slowly growing smaller. Damn you Netflix...I do love my Netflix but I pains me to know that it really has killed any chance of Bluray catching on on a mass scale. Such a great format for us movie lovers...

THE KBK ... This is the last known signal. We offer Sanctuary.

www.thekbk.com
http://www.deepeddy.net/artists/thekbk/
www.reverbnation.com/thekbk
www.facebook.com/thekbkal

Physical media may indeed become scarce or disappear altogether. But think about what is lost. I was looking at a Kindle yesterday, and thought of a first-edition (1915) American history I own, inscribed by the author in his own hand to his friend, whom he gave the volumes. Where would he have written that message on the Kindle? I have an LP with a personal note on the front of the album jacket thanking my dad, written by Paul Anka, for whom my dad hired the strings and played when he came to town.

The part of history that is what we hold in our hands is vanishing. In many cases, it’s the only evidence that some things ever existed. While vinyl records and tape recordings are archival media, cds, dvds and memory cards aren’t.

This is Noel. Reverb's at maximum an' I'm givin' 'er all she's got.

Last edited: Dec 27, 2011 21:50:13

They are past the whole long term storage of your digital media already. Your purchases are either cloud stored under your account or you have a digital receipt in your account that allows you to re-download your files.

Streaming from a cloud is almost certainly going to be the future. I would think they would cache the files on your server to save on bandwidth for future listenings/watchings.

Will our descendants be able to listen to our favorite music in 2-3 generations time? Probably, the first responsibility it to the listener/owner to ensure the future of their "possessions". If file system formats change, then find a way to convert them, get them to the new file system.

Do I like this future? No, not at all. I like physical media, but that format is going to go away. It is going to happen sooner than we all think. My grandchildren(I'm 27) probably aren't going to own physical media. CDs really suck, video formats change too often(4k is on the horizon), books can be too expensive.

Positives of the cloud(I hate saying "the cloud", it makes me feel like a middle-aged Apple fanboy).
-You can grab anything you own at any time on your device or at any of the devices in your home(laptop, TV, tablet, phone, gaming system).
-If you buy a movie, you should be able to own it for life, in SD, HD, 3D, 4K(when applicable). This isn't a guarantee, but it should be the case.
-No hard disk management. This world has created too many technically incompetent people. Backing up, handling disk space is just not an option for most people.

Negatives
-It could allow for monopolies(iTunes as a one-stop) Ideally, any digital store would feed to a central media server program of your choice that developed data connections with the store you bought it from. However... we know Apple are going to be huge assholes on this and insist on iTunes usage, Amazon has their own player. For digital media, everything really really really needs to be open or it is never going to be as good as it should. Apple has gotten better since Jobs left, they made ALAC open source and royalty free. Not their only post-Jobs good move.
-Bandwidth... we aren't there yet, as you can imagine. A house needs to be able to flawlessly stream several HD sources at once. You know anybody that gets an actual 1080p non-compressed signal when streaming? I get 3mb/s and I'm certainly not in that ballpark. For a single-person household, you probably want 5mb/s to watch 1080p and have some space for internet usage. And when we get to a four-person household... wow. 3 movies/TV shows at once, plus internet and everything else. DATA IS REALLY EXPENSIVE, it will cost you a fortune.
-Battery life... It isn't there yet. Your phone or tablet can't handle streaming audio. Google Music gives you crappy quality files and its gobbles down battery life like they were big cocks. Seriously, try listening to a commutes worth of music and then not being able to use your phone the rest of the day for fear of battery dying.
-Who watches the watchers?
-Devices... There needs to be free installable applications for everything. Xbox, playstation, TVs, computers, phones, tablets. You need universal compatibility. Exclusive deals, like at the moment, CANNOT happen. It is unfair to the user and stifles the technology of the field.

They are trying to rush the cloud, but the cloud isn't ready. Companies are trying to cash in early, but all they are doing is harming the idea. They are steering it on a path it probably shouldn't go down(like Apple and the iPad). See Microsoft Courier vs. iPad for that discussion. Microsoft is also a stupid company, just incompetent though, not huge assholes.

Format longevity is not a new problem, only one that is cycling more rapidly with the speed of digital technology.

Non-digital formats evolved more slowly in part due the relationship between physical media and physical player and the time to re-tool manufacturing as well as the time it took to have significant public adoption of the new devices to play the new recording format.

Digital enables the "re-tooling" to largely be (if not entirely) software based. Distribution and cost hurdles (mfg & consumer) being greatly diminished = speed for development of new formats.

Noel, this is their answer to your Kindle point.

IMO, human nature will keep the lights on. Sentiment and nostalgia won't overtake the momentum of "today", but I suspect it will keep niche markets alive for "old" formats for much longer than most would imagine. Think about the photo I inserted above... someone took a digital photo of real cylinder records. The cylinder records do still exist. Functional phonograph players too. According to wikipedia, The phonograph was invented by Thomas Edison on 18 July 1877.

Fady

El Mirage @ ReverbNation

Trying to steer this thread back on topic, pre-digitial technoligies made it harder to pirate material. It takes a master artist to make a stroke for stroke acceptable copy of the Mona Lisa, or a perfect duplicate of the Pieta, not withstanding how hard they were to create in the first place. It would be extraordinarily difficult to create a perfect forgery of one of James Michener's hand-written drafts.

No matter how many calendars are printed with Ansel Adams photographs, there exist his original negatives only once and his original prints from them. A new print made from an original negative is still more valuable than a print made from a copy.

A copy becomes stolen property when, among other things, it is made without permission, the original is protected by copyright or the personal use clause is violated. Pirating copyrighted material is simply theft. Now, many people today don't believe in private property and so they don't believe in theft. They're pirates the same as Black Beard. Of course, we may decide to abolish private property altogether to solve the problem of theft. At least when it comes to Air Jordans. But I believe there shouldn't be a difference between owning a pair of shoes and owning the rights to your performance.

It's uncertain that the record on which Paul Anka wrote his note of thanks to my dad will survive intact longer than any copy of it I make, but the note on the jacket is the one and only original, and any copy I make of it isn't. While a signature in an e-file is legal, in a physical sense there is no original; every print is a copy.

But things change over time, technology, values, beliefs, and the lifestyles that are inseparable from them. People have tried to live in isolation from change from the beginning. It doesn't work. But I believe we lose something essential to civilization if we no longer recognize private property or penalize its theft.

This is Noel. Reverb's at maximum an' I'm givin' 'er all she's got.

Yeah...I don't think any/most of us on here are defending the current state of physical media vs. sales. We are just stating the grim reality. I will be the first to admit that I absolutely love the accessiblity of my Ipod. I fought purchasing one for years and years, until the day that I almost had a terrible car accident while flipping through a huge, 300 CD wallet while driving. Given all of that, if I could turn back time and make things the way they were, I would certainly do it. I really do miss the days of traveling to a new town and spending hours in some strange record store, flipping through their selection. These stores still exist. But, they are certainly dwindling.

THE KBK ... This is the last known signal. We offer Sanctuary.

www.thekbk.com
http://www.deepeddy.net/artists/thekbk/
www.reverbnation.com/thekbk
www.facebook.com/thekbkal