My basic skills answer to SixStringSurfer, basic skills being all I've got to apply here.

a) The Fender '63 Reissue SanchoPansen used is fairly heavily modded. Duplicating that result would change its price somewhat. Maybe an unmodded Fender '63 Reissue should also be tested.

Even if people can provide the equipment, you may get awful sick of your test cases, Sanch!

b) The tanks (and SB FET) include a spring pan, an electro-mechanical analog device. The pedals use digital simulations of pan-based devices. The digital basis of the simulation is perhaps a factor, but probably the critical factor is that the various pedal simulations are not identical in behavior to any of the various analog devices they emulate, and the differences make their sounds less desirable to many ears. Clearly not all, per the results of the test!

I suppose that theoretically a tank simulation could be identical in behavior to a tank up to the limits of digital vs. analog behavior - may thousands of surf fanatics strike me dead if I am wrong - but clearly it would take much more acoustic information, computing power, and programming thought than have so far been applied to the problem. The result might cost more than an actual tank, too.

The pan in general and the particular pan are not the only factors in the behavior of a tank. The circuitry of the tanks is also a factor. So, for that matter are the devices reproducing the sound for your ears and the various ears and brains perceiving the results.

All of the devices are also parametrized by the three controls (dwell, mix, tone), of course, and these vary in their effect depending on the design of the tank or pedal circuitry.

The SB FET unit uses circuitry based on the Field-Effect Transistor (FET) as opposed to vacuum tubes.

Ask Kilian (SP) what's involved in the mods, maybe? I've never priced anything like that, but about two thirds of it sounded like it was on a par with replacing a headlight. Maybe not the one that requires you to remove the battery or have a special tool ... The SB FET requires a certain amount of "do-it-yourselfery" plus additional parts too, as you can see from the thread on it.

If it has to be one at a time, then I suspect if you end up unhappy over time with whatever you get you can always sell it and try something else.

Badger wrote:

Keep in mind Sancho's '63 RI has a much different cap in the C10 position, which does effect the tone. (Not better/worse, but that's what he likes to hear.)

I think that is something that needs to be verified via blindfold test as well. I haven't done this particular test - different caps - but I have done the test on different tubes as installed in the '63 Fender Reverb RI. In immediate A/B comparison of two units with different tubes, no difference was heard. I realize that this is only my telling and a group A/B comparison such as was performed here is more reliable. However, if the caps are outputting the same values, I am skeptical as to how the same number of electrons are going to have any effect on tone simply because they are put through an oil filled cap vs a paper cap (for example). -Marty

"Hello Girls!"

Ah yes, different values would change things. -Marty

"Hello Girls!"

If you have a cabinet, I can sell you the chassis, discount the pricing and install it. The cabinet for a reverb unit is ~$300 shipped from MOJO. Many other cab builders are NOT much less expensive.

Last edited: Jan 23, 2015 09:23:35

SixStringSurfer wrote:

Thanks for the info, Tuck. Your post really has me rethinking, again! Honestly, I am really not into modding that much. I was also looking at the Gomez G-Spring, but for $300 more I can get the '65 Twin Reverb reissue. I think I am right back to where I was two hours ago, saving up for the '65 RI!

If you're not into modding, even as a concept, or building, there is NOTHING wrong with your idea of enjoying your surf played through a Twin Reverb. At some point when the dust settles you may want a tank, but a TR (which checks the box also on getting a really nice tube amp) is a good approach. I'd personally rather have a TR than a Peavey and a tank. In fact if I was gigging a TR would probably be at the top of my list (although I'm older & would make it into a head/cab affair). Keep stuffing the pennies in the coffee can.

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

Tuck wrote:

It sounds like Texotica may be out of business or heavily scaled back?

http://texotica.net/?product=texotica-reverb

The site is still there, but reading currently (2015-01-22):

ATTENTION EFFECTIVE 12-30-13 I will not be taking orders for the first few months of 2014 in order to catch up on backorders and reassess things moving forward. Thanks for your understanding.

Unfortunately, I believe this to be the case. I contacted Billy prior to the holidays, to see if he had ramped production back up, and he replied that "the amp business is on hold for the foreseeable future". I was super bummed because I had drooled over the Texotica for several years. And when I finally realized I "needed" a tank, the Texotica seemed to be the best fit for my ears and budget. (Huge thanks to all the great folks who posted their experiences here on SG101!)

So, I started scouring SG101, reverb.com, ebay, and adhuntr/craigslist in hopes of finding one. I was totally floored when I found one IN MY FREAKING HOMETOWN for sale. It had been listed three days before I found it, but was still available. I test drove it and made a list-minute phone consultation with morphball before pulling the trigger (thanks again, dude!).

The Texotica sounds AMAZING and has literally transformed the tone of my guitar/amp setup. I couldn't be happier with the purchase and predict it will fuel the fire for new songs, and provide a sonic "happy place" I'll visit on a regular basis.

I emailed Billy to tell him about my score and he actually REMEMBERED the very unit... "You were crazy lucky to find that one. There's not that many out there. It was blonde and one of the earliest I built back in December 2011".

I don't know the details of why Billy put Texotica on hold... likely because he is a super-talented musician with only so much time to go around. I can only imagine how much commitment and work it takes to own and operate a business. Any business. But especially building boutique amplifiers with a solid reputation and at a price-point not much higher than most of the mass-produced gear out there.

I definitely consider myself CRAZY LUCKY to have found one of Billy's creations in the wild, and sincerely hope that Texotica will live again one day. VIVA TEXOTICA!

-murph

http://www.reverbnation.com/elmiragesurf
http://www.reverbnation.com/aminorconspiracy

"I knew I was in trouble when the Coco-Loco tasted like water!" -- morphball

Last edited: Jan 23, 2015 09:20:53

Hi DGG, while I don't fully understand everything you said, it does sound like you are genuinely tying to help me out. I do appreciate that! I have a few questions, if I may. If I bought the Surfy Bear from you, could I also pay you (up front, of course) to put it in a cabinet for me?

How do I install the cabinet into my Peavey amp? If I buy a different amp in the future, is it difficult to transfer the unit? I am terrible at wiring, installing, etc... I will admit, the Surfy bear sounded awesome, it's just the installation and wiring is what turned me off. Thanks again for your interest.

Badger, if I don't go the tank or Surfy Bear route, then yes I am getting a '65 TR. I won't have to worry about lugging around a tank and an amp, and to be honest the TR sounded amazing when I tested it out at GC. The reverb was awesome, in fact I had to turn it down from 10 to like 7.5 or 8.

For now, I am happy with my Flint, and I do think the "drip" on the Flint sounds great. However, as I have stated before, I am just an amateur who is learning a ton from you guys. Thank you everyone for sharing your knowledge and all of your input.

MooreLoud.com - A tribute to Dick Dale. New EP Louder Than Life available on bandcamp and website.

Last edited: Jan 23, 2015 13:05:14

SanchoPansen wrote:

Yes, the original C10 (270pF) has been replaced by a 1000pF cap. It had an impact on the overall sound and was a easy job for someone who knows how to use a soldering iron. Check out this page for more info on the C10 mod.
Also I would like to offer to make a tube shootout using my Fender RI tank. Just the same settings as in the first shootout. I have a couple of tubes (original, JJ, etc.) and it's an easy swap. Let me know if you are interested.

Yes, that would indeed be a reasonable one to set up and I would be interested. -Marty

"Hello Girls!"

Nokie wrote:

Has a blindfold comparison between this mod and an non-mod'd '63 RI unit been made available? I do see a number folks recommend it based on anecdote. -Marty

Marty, that's a great idea & would be a very cool demo (especially again if done by surf people). Whoever sacrificed donated their tank could do the same thing like when you're trying to figure out a treble-bleed mod on a guitar, ya know? Once you get to the board, just run a couple leads out on baby-clips & try various caps w/o having to muck around all the time. I've heard the mod itself is quite easy - other than the PITA part about the cap you want being located by the knob on the OTHER side of the board (had to be, ).

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.