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Well said, Brian - I agree with you. I just take issue with those who'd hold
that The Shadows were more influential, heard by a wider audience, and/or
therefore more essential to be inductees into the RRHOF. I go along with you
that both groups are equally important, and equally deserving of the
recognition.
I don't think Dolton Records would have made the claim that The Ventures had
toured Great Britain, if the claim couldn't be backed up - and yet, on their "On
Stage" LP from the 1960's, are two or three songs, supposedly performed in G.B.
- Ivan, do you want to call this an outright lie?
Bruce D
Brian Neal <> wrote:
I'm not the hard core Ventures or Shadows authority like some of you
guys here, but from my own investigations, it is quite clear that The
Shadows ruled the UK and Europe while the Ventures had a more direct
influence on the US and Japan. Did the Shadows influence the 1st wave of
surf? Not as much as the Ventures, sure. But what about bands like the
Atlantics from Australia? They had a direct Shadows influence and were
considered a surf band as they were exposed to both. And I definitely
hear the Shadows influence in *modern* European surf bands where the
Shadows influence was inescapable.
As for why didn't the Shadows tour the US during the British
Invasion....well the Shadows weren't considered a British Invasion band!
Bands like the Beatles, Rolling Stones, Kinks, The Who, etc were very
different from The Shadows at the time and probably looked down their
noses at those older guys (even though they probably liked them and
learned from them when they first picked up guitars).
Clearly if there were justice in the world, both The Shadows & The
Ventures would be in the RRHOF. They both inspired multitudes of kids to
pick up guitars all over the world.
One thing that always kind of bugged me about the Ventures is their
trend hopping nature. Of course they claim it is because they like all
forms of music, and maybe that's true and more power to them. No one can
take away their power and contributions in the early-mid 60's, but to
release disco albums, Carpenters cover albums, Country albums, etc,
etc....either they really do like all that stuff or they are just trying
to stay in business (as in a business Venture). They openly admit that
they would listen to the top 40 hits of the day, pick a few, Venture-ize
them, and then record several originals in the same vein. Wham, there is
your next Ventures album. Is that wrong? I dunno. Is that easy to do?
Not at all, and they mastered it. They still put a fair amount of
creativity into those arrangements, and if you buy their argument that
"hey we musicians who just love to play our guitars" then I guess it's
okay. It's hard not to say "sell out" under your breath though....ouch.
I don't know very much about the Shadows in their later periods, but
Ivan has told me a little bit about their history and they kind of went
off the rails too during various times.
Still, all in all, both of those bands have had phenomenal careers with
longevity and success unheard of for "instrumental" bands. They both
deserve recognition equally IMHO. They both affected surf music. As I
see it, The Ventures directly influenced the 1st wave surf musicians
before surf existed; they also themselves jumped on the trend and helped
popularize it. The Shadows influence on surf came mainly in later waves,
but they did create quite a revolution in popular music in Europe and
England.
BN
.
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