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My old band the Space Cossacks played the Rendezvous Ballroom reunion
show in Santa Ana (or wherever it was, I'm blanking out now) back in
2000. One of the acts was the Belairs, with Eddie Bertrand on lead
guitar. I was extremely excited about this, as I'm a huge Eddie &
the Showmen fan. I think he was even better than DD back then.
Well, I was extremely disappointed. Not only was his technique
really sloppy, but he really ruined most of the song by playing them
with a tone with a lot of distortion and modern techniques. His
stage demeanor was utterly embarrassing, as well - a throwback to '74-
'78 guitar-hero/cock-rawk type of stuff. I mean, this is NOT
bringing in modern influences - this is simply bringing in
other 'outdated' influences (in this case 25 years old).
don't get me wrong: I grew up with all of the shredding guitar stuff
from the eighties, and still enjoy quite a bit of it. I even
acquired Yngwie's first four albums on CD earlier this year. I think
he's got a killer tone (and obviously an incredible technique). I'm
absolutely obsessed with Ritchie Blackmore, too, as well as a bunch
of other metal with shredding playing (like Iron Maiden). Though I'm
not terribly enthusiastic about musical cross-breeding between these
styles and surf music, there is a right and a wrong way to do it.
Unfortunately, I couldn't come to another conclusion than that Eddie
did it the wrong way. In order to play eighties shred style you've
got to have an impeccable technique, and he didn't. Like I said, he
was very sloppy. The Surf Coasters guitarist shows how to do this
correctly and with taste. The non-original guitarist in the
Chantays, though not my cup of tea, also does it quite well. In
addition, there is a type of a song that works with that style of
playing - Yngwie's "Black Star" and "Far Beyond the Sun," or Dokken's
(with another awesome shredmeister George Lynch) "Mr. Scary." The
Belairs' version of Three Blind Mice is NOT a song where you start
shredding - it just sounds ridiculous.
As a impartial observer and fan, I understand Eddie's desire to grow
as a musician. but what I saw that day was not an example of
positive growth. I found it cringe-inducing, and would not pay money
to see it again. I may be in a small minority, but I have not heard
any positive reviews of Eddie's modern playing on any list or in any
magazine since I've started following them back in '95. So, maybe
Eddie should take a hint. Almost all great guitarists become trapped
in their styles to a certain extent, but it doesn't mean that one
cannot progress and grow while sticking to the tone that made you
well-known in the first place. Just my opinion...
Ivan
PS BTW, Eddie was using a humbucker eqipped Strat through SEVERAL
silverface Quad Reverbs, or something strange like that. I can't
remember exactly now, maybe somebody else will. It's funny that the
Belairs broke up over the whole debate about how much reverb Eddie
should be using, when four years ago he just stomped over all those
classic songs with excessive volume and distortion, which is much
more damaging to guitar interplay in that setting than reverb.
There's irony for you....
PPS I have not heard any Get Wet stuff, Les, so I can't comment on
your own playing. This was strictly about Eddie.
--- In , Leslie Fradkin <lfradkin@e...>
wrote:
> Eddie hates this incident, and regrets doing it. He was tricked by
the
> producer and although he insisted his name not be used, it was
anyway.
>
> We used a real drummer (Peter G.) on the stuff we did together and
will
> continue to use real drums.
>
> And no, it's not his updated sound.
>
> Les
>
> On Tuesday, September 7, 2004, at 10:43 AM, Phil Kucer wrote:
>
> > I posted an MP3 ripped from the porn movie he did a few years
ago. The
> > song was awful. Not only the crappy song, but the crappy over-
processed
> > guitars and crappy electronic drums.
> >
> > Since this the last thing I've heard from Mr. Bertrand, I was just
> > wondering if this his 'updated' sound?
> >
> > Tell Eddie he needs to get back in the surf. We miss him.
> >
> >
> > And leave the drum machine on the beach...
> >
> >
> >
> > Phil Tiki
> > __________________________
> > The Cocktail Preachers
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sep 7, 2004, at 10:38 AM, Leslie Fradkin wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> "That's great that you are trying to navigate into some new sonic
> >>> territories. However, I've heard Eddie's newer version of "Mr.
> >>> Rebel" (the on that Phil Tiki posted for us all to hear) and I
have
> >>> to say it pales in comparison to the original."
> >>
> >> Your statement contradicts itself. Eddie & I both believe in
uncharted
> >> territory. That philosophy is one of the prime reasons he's
doing this
> >> project with me. We do his old hits live, BTW. We just update
them a
> >> little bit for modern ears. We performed "Mr. Rebel"
and "Squadcar" at
> >> the KFJC show. They were extremely well received and sounded
great.
> >> That's because we played them with passion and heart, which to
us,
> >> matters more than the gear we choose to use.
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > .
> > Visit for archived
> > messages, bookmarks, files, polls, etc.
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
I may be in a small minority, but I have not heard
> any positive reviews of Eddie's modern playing on any list or in
any
> magazine since I've started following them back in '95. So, maybe
> Eddie should take a hint. Almost all great guitarists become
trapped
> in their styles to a certain extent, but it doesn't mean that one
> cannot progress and grow while sticking to the tone that made you
> well-known in the first place. Just my opinion...
Great post Ivan! You sound like my economics professor this
semester. :)
I would like to see Eddie return to his old form as well. Like I had
said earlier just because that older surf tone has been done before
doesn't mean that it has to be stuck in cover songs. Thank god for
the Space Cossacks and Treblemakers.
I do know that you can hear some off Les's stuff on his website. Les
is a monster player, but the Eddie stuff I found was of him playing
2nd guitar.
Bill
Galaxy Ballroom, Santa Ana 2000: Rendevous Reunion...
by the way: Awesome Space Copssacks set...my only
experience seing Ivan and the gang shredding live...most
excellent!
also: that show featured the UN-Lively Ones...personally, I
thought they truly sucked...and I am a huge HUGE MASSIVE
Lively Ones fan...especially their drummer (Tim
Fitzpatrick) and sax (Joel Willenbring)...but, Jim
Masoner(guitar), Ron Griffith(Mosrite bass) and Ed
Chiaverini (guitar)...well very un-Lively says it all...
lastly, Ivan's assessment is accurate: Eddie sucked big
time, pure seventies Lynard Skynard/Allman Brothers
bluesrock riffs...at a surf celebration?!?!?
DP
--- ipongrac <> wrote:
> My old band the Space Cossacks played the Rendezvous
> Ballroom reunion
> show in Santa Ana (or wherever it was, I'm blanking out
> now) back in
> 2000. One of the acts was the Belairs, with Eddie
> Bertrand on lead
> guitar. I was extremely excited about this, as I'm a
> huge Eddie &
> the Showmen fan. I think he was even better than DD back
> then.
> Well, I was extremely disappointed. Not only was his
> technique
> really sloppy, but he really ruined most of the song by
> playing them
> with a tone with a lot of distortion and modern
> techniques. His
> stage demeanor was utterly embarrassing, as well - a
> throwback to '74-
> '78 guitar-hero/cock-rawk type of stuff. I mean, this is
> NOT
> bringing in modern influences - this is simply bringing
> in
> other 'outdated' influences (in this case 25 years old).
>
>
> don't get me wrong: I grew up with all of the shredding
> guitar stuff
> from the eighties, and still enjoy quite a bit of it. I
> even
> acquired Yngwie's first four albums on CD earlier this
> year. I think
> he's got a killer tone (and obviously an incredible
> technique). I'm
> absolutely obsessed with Ritchie Blackmore, too, as well
> as a bunch
> of other metal with shredding playing (like Iron Maiden).
> Though I'm
> not terribly enthusiastic about musical cross-breeding
> between these
> styles and surf music, there is a right and a wrong way
> to do it.
> Unfortunately, I couldn't come to another conclusion than
> that Eddie
> did it the wrong way. In order to play eighties shred
> style you've
> got to have an impeccable technique, and he didn't. Like
> I said, he
> was very sloppy. The Surf Coasters guitarist shows how
> to do this
> correctly and with taste. The non-original guitarist in
> the
> Chantays, though not my cup of tea, also does it quite
> well. In
> addition, there is a type of a song that works with that
> style of
> playing - Yngwie's "Black Star" and "Far Beyond the Sun,"
> or Dokken's
> (with another awesome shredmeister George Lynch) "Mr.
> Scary." The
> Belairs' version of Three Blind Mice is NOT a song where
> you start
> shredding - it just sounds ridiculous.
>
> As a impartial observer and fan, I understand Eddie's
> desire to grow
> as a musician. but what I saw that day was not an
> example of
> positive growth. I found it cringe-inducing, and would
> not pay money
> to see it again. I may be in a small minority, but I
> have not heard
> any positive reviews of Eddie's modern playing on any
> list or in any
> magazine since I've started following them back in '95.
> So, maybe
> Eddie should take a hint. Almost all great guitarists
> become trapped
> in their styles to a certain extent, but it doesn't mean
> that one
> cannot progress and grow while sticking to the tone that
> made you
> well-known in the first place. Just my opinion...
>
> Ivan
>
> PS BTW, Eddie was using a humbucker eqipped Strat through
> SEVERAL
> silverface Quad Reverbs, or something strange like that.
> I can't
> remember exactly now, maybe somebody else will. It's
> funny that the
> Belairs broke up over the whole debate about how much
> reverb Eddie
> should be using, when four years ago he just stomped over
> all those
> classic songs with excessive volume and distortion, which
> is much
> more damaging to guitar interplay in that setting than
> reverb.
> There's irony for you....
>
> PPS I have not heard any Get Wet stuff, Les, so I can't
> comment on
> your own playing. This was strictly about Eddie.
>
>
> --- In , Leslie Fradkin
> <lfradkin@e...>
> wrote:
> > Eddie hates this incident, and regrets doing it. He was
> tricked by
> the
> > producer and although he insisted his name not be used,
> it was
> anyway.
> >
> > We used a real drummer (Peter G.) on the stuff we did
> together and
> will
> > continue to use real drums.
> >
> > And no, it's not his updated sound.
> >
> > Les
> >
> > On Tuesday, September 7, 2004, at 10:43 AM, Phil Kucer
> wrote:
> >
> > > I posted an MP3 ripped from the porn movie he did a
> few years
> ago. The
> > > song was awful. Not only the crappy song, but the
> crappy over-
> processed
> > > guitars and crappy electronic drums.
> > >
> > > Since this the last thing I've heard from Mr.
> Bertrand, I was just
> > > wondering if this his 'updated' sound?
> > >
> > > Tell Eddie he needs to get back in the surf. We miss
> him.
> > >
> > >
> > > And leave the drum machine on the beach...
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Phil Tiki
> > > __________________________
> > > The Cocktail Preachers
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Sep 7, 2004, at 10:38 AM, Leslie Fradkin wrote:
> > >
> > >>
> > >> "That's great that you are trying to navigate into
> some new sonic
> > >>> territories. However, I've heard Eddie's newer
> version of "Mr.
> > >>> Rebel" (the on that Phil Tiki posted for us all to
> hear) and I
> have
> > >>> to say it pales in comparison to the original."
> > >>
> > >> Your statement contradicts itself. Eddie & I both
> believe in
> uncharted
> > >> territory. That philosophy is one of the prime
> reasons he's
> doing this
> > >> project with me. We do his old hits live, BTW. We
> just update
> them a
> > >> little bit for modern ears. We performed "Mr. Rebel"
>
> and "Squadcar" at
> > >> the KFJC show. They were extremely well received and
> sounded
> great.
> > >> That's because we played them with passion and
> heart, which to
> us,
> > >> matters more than the gear we choose to use.
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > .
> > > Visit for
> archived
> > > messages, bookmarks, files, polls, etc.
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
>
=== message truncated ===
_______________________________
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Hey Ivan,
I was at that show and your description of EB is just what I sawr. I'm not as
plentiful with the words so I just describe him as a Demon of Mediocrity.
-Marty
----- Original Message -----
From: ipongrac
To:
Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2004 12:22 PM
Subject: [SurfGuitar101] Eddie Bertrand (was: strings and strats)
My old band the Space Cossacks played the Rendezvous Ballroom reunion
show in Santa Ana (or wherever it was, I'm blanking out now) back in
2000. One of the acts was the Belairs, with Eddie Bertrand on lead
guitar. I was extremely excited about this, as I'm a huge Eddie &
the Showmen fan. I think he was even better than DD back then.
Well, I was extremely disappointed. Not only was his technique
really sloppy, but he really ruined most of the song by playing them
with a tone with a lot of distortion and modern techniques. His
stage demeanor was utterly embarrassing, as well - a throwback to '74-
'78 guitar-hero/cock-rawk type of stuff. I mean, this is NOT
bringing in modern influences - this is simply bringing in
other 'outdated' influences (in this case 25 years old).
don't get me wrong: I grew up with all of the shredding guitar stuff
from the eighties, and still enjoy quite a bit of it. I even
acquired Yngwie's first four albums on CD earlier this year. I think
he's got a killer tone (and obviously an incredible technique). I'm
absolutely obsessed with Ritchie Blackmore, too, as well as a bunch
of other metal with shredding playing (like Iron Maiden). Though I'm
not terribly enthusiastic about musical cross-breeding between these
styles and surf music, there is a right and a wrong way to do it.
Unfortunately, I couldn't come to another conclusion than that Eddie
did it the wrong way. In order to play eighties shred style you've
got to have an impeccable technique, and he didn't. Like I said, he
was very sloppy. The Surf Coasters guitarist shows how to do this
correctly and with taste. The non-original guitarist in the
Chantays, though not my cup of tea, also does it quite well. In
addition, there is a type of a song that works with that style of
playing - Yngwie's "Black Star" and "Far Beyond the Sun," or Dokken's
(with another awesome shredmeister George Lynch) "Mr. Scary." The
Belairs' version of Three Blind Mice is NOT a song where you start
shredding - it just sounds ridiculous.
As a impartial observer and fan, I understand Eddie's desire to grow
as a musician. but what I saw that day was not an example of
positive growth. I found it cringe-inducing, and would not pay money
to see it again. I may be in a small minority, but I have not heard
any positive reviews of Eddie's modern playing on any list or in any
magazine since I've started following them back in '95. So, maybe
Eddie should take a hint. Almost all great guitarists become trapped
in their styles to a certain extent, but it doesn't mean that one
cannot progress and grow while sticking to the tone that made you
well-known in the first place. Just my opinion...
Ivan
PS BTW, Eddie was using a humbucker eqipped Strat through SEVERAL
silverface Quad Reverbs, or something strange like that. I can't
remember exactly now, maybe somebody else will. It's funny that the
Belairs broke up over the whole debate about how much reverb Eddie
should be using, when four years ago he just stomped over all those
classic songs with excessive volume and distortion, which is much
more damaging to guitar interplay in that setting than reverb.
There's irony for you....
PPS I have not heard any Get Wet stuff, Les, so I can't comment on
your own playing. This was strictly about Eddie.
--- In , Leslie Fradkin <lfradkin@e...>
wrote:
> Eddie hates this incident, and regrets doing it. He was tricked by
the
> producer and although he insisted his name not be used, it was
anyway.
>
> We used a real drummer (Peter G.) on the stuff we did together and
will
> continue to use real drums.
>
> And no, it's not his updated sound.
>
> Les
>
> On Tuesday, September 7, 2004, at 10:43 AM, Phil Kucer wrote:
>
> > I posted an MP3 ripped from the porn movie he did a few years
ago. The
> > song was awful. Not only the crappy song, but the crappy over-
processed
> > guitars and crappy electronic drums.
> >
> > Since this the last thing I've heard from Mr. Bertrand, I was just
> > wondering if this his 'updated' sound?
> >
> > Tell Eddie he needs to get back in the surf. We miss him.
> >
> >
> > And leave the drum machine on the beach...
> >
> >
> >
> > Phil Tiki
> > __________________________
> > The Cocktail Preachers
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sep 7, 2004, at 10:38 AM, Leslie Fradkin wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> "That's great that you are trying to navigate into some new sonic
> >>> territories. However, I've heard Eddie's newer version of "Mr.
> >>> Rebel" (the on that Phil Tiki posted for us all to hear) and I
have
> >>> to say it pales in comparison to the original."
> >>
> >> Your statement contradicts itself. Eddie & I both believe in
uncharted
> >> territory. That philosophy is one of the prime reasons he's
doing this
> >> project with me. We do his old hits live, BTW. We just update
them a
> >> little bit for modern ears. We performed "Mr. Rebel"
and "Squadcar" at
> >> the KFJC show. They were extremely well received and sounded
great.
> >> That's because we played them with passion and heart, which to
us,
> >> matters more than the gear we choose to use.
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > .
> > Visit for archived
> > messages, bookmarks, files, polls, etc.
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
.
Visit for archived messages,
bookmarks, files, polls, etc.
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I was not at the Rendezvous Ballroom reunion, but I have the CD. I
was also kind of disappointed in the 1st wave surf guys. Especially
the Lively Ones. Just like DP, they are one of my favorite old
school bands, but they were really ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzz that
night.
I've seen the 1986 (?) South Bay surf band reunion tape that Paul
Johnson put together. Eddie did a really nice job I thought at that
show. Great playing and great tone (through a Strat). He was a bit
of a ham on stage though :)
Halibut Rick was there, can you add anything, Rick? The Halibuts
really kicked butt as I recall.
Paul Johnson told me that it is "on his to-do list" to someday
reissue this tape on DVD, but it is pretty far down priority-wise.
BN
Where did you see the video, Brian? I'd sure like to see it too.
Anybody know where to get one? Paul Johnson should get with it and
reissue it on DVD, before it gets lost forever, or people loose
interest.
It's sad to hear that some of our favorite bands from the 1st
wave don't play with much enthusiasm anymore. It almost makes me
wish I hadn't seen them in their current state, so I can remember
them as they were, not as they are.
Chris
> I've seen the 1986 (?) South Bay surf band reunion tape that Paul
> Johnson put together. Eddie did a really nice job I thought at that
> show. Great playing and great tone (through a Strat). He was a bit
> of a ham on stage though :)
>
>
> Paul Johnson told me that it is "on his to-do list" to someday
> reissue this tape on DVD, but it is pretty far down priority-wise.
>
> BN
RE: "It's sad to hear that some of our favorite bands from
the 1st wave don't play with much enthusiasm anymore..."
Yeah, it is sad that many lose energy as they get older...
but,then again, I did see the Tornadoes play a rippin' 2
hour set in San Bernardino a couple of years ago, and Dick
Dale (whether you like him or not) always seems to be High
Energy...Paul Johnson still rips it up too!...
so...like anything in this world, it all depends upon who
you are watching or hearing...some actually get better as
they age...
regards,
DP
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The Chantays play with a lot of energy and a three-guitar line up, plus bass.
They always get a great crowd response BUT theirs is more a modern guitar god
distortion lead guitar sound than a high energy trad surf sound.
-Marty
----- Original Message -----
From: DP
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2004 4:00 PM
Subject: Re: [SurfGuitar101] Re: Eddie Bertrand (was: strings and strats)
RE: "It's sad to hear that some of our favorite bands from
the 1st wave don't play with much enthusiasm anymore..."
Yeah, it is sad that many lose energy as they get older...
but,then again, I did see the Tornadoes play a rippin' 2
hour set in San Bernardino a couple of years ago, and Dick
Dale (whether you like him or not) always seems to be High
Energy...Paul Johnson still rips it up too!...
so...like anything in this world, it all depends upon who
you are watching or hearing...some actually get better as
they age...
regards,
DP
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now.
.
Visit for archived messages,
bookmarks, files, polls, etc.
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I wonder if that's because when Hendrix and Clapton came along the Chantays felt
like they got left behind in the dust and are still to this day trying to show
everybody that they can keep up with the Jones?
Dan
Marty Tippens <> wrote:
The Chantays play with a lot of energy and a three-guitar line up, plus bass.
They always get a great crowd response BUT theirs is more a modern guitar god
distortion lead guitar sound than a high energy trad surf sound.
-Marty
----- Original Message -----
From: DP
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2004 4:00 PM
Subject: Re: [SurfGuitar101] Re: Eddie Bertrand (was: strings and strats)
RE: "It's sad to hear that some of our favorite bands from
the 1st wave don't play with much enthusiasm anymore..."
Yeah, it is sad that many lose energy as they get older...
but,then again, I did see the Tornadoes play a rippin' 2
hour set in San Bernardino a couple of years ago, and Dick
Dale (whether you like him or not) always seems to be High
Energy...Paul Johnson still rips it up too!...
so...like anything in this world, it all depends upon who
you are watching or hearing...some actually get better as
they age...
regards,
DP
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now.
.
Visit for archived messages,
bookmarks, files, polls, etc.
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b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
.
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I'm pretty sure Hendrix, Clapton and the British bands played a role
in this. Not only did those guys end surf music but they screwed up
alot of the firstwavers. Put yourself in a surf band 1965 (which
was pretty late for surf bands)and your competition is some long
haired guys that the girls are screming for. Psychologically these
guys have scars that run pretty deep :).
Bill
--- In , Dan Bartley <bigtwangguy@y...>
wrote:
> I wonder if that's because when Hendrix and Clapton came along the
Chantays felt like they got left behind in the dust and are still to
this day trying to show everybody that they can keep up with the
Jones?
> Dan
>
> Marty Tippens <mctippens@e...> wrote:
> The Chantays play with a lot of energy and a three-guitar line up,
plus bass. They always get a great crowd response BUT theirs is more
a modern guitar god distortion lead guitar sound than a high energy
trad surf sound.
> -Marty
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: DP
> To:
> Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2004 4:00 PM
> Subject: Re: [SurfGuitar101] Re: Eddie Bertrand (was: strings
and strats)
>
>
> RE: "It's sad to hear that some of our favorite bands from
> the 1st wave don't play with much enthusiasm anymore..."
>
> Yeah, it is sad that many lose energy as they get older...
>
> but,then again, I did see the Tornadoes play a rippin' 2
> hour set in San Bernardino a couple of years ago, and Dick
> Dale (whether you like him or not) always seems to be High
> Energy...Paul Johnson still rips it up too!...
>
> so...like anything in this world, it all depends upon who
> you are watching or hearing...some actually get better as
> they age...
>
> regards,
> DP
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now.
>
>
>
> .
> Visit for archived
messages, bookmarks, files, polls, etc.
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
>
>
> b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>
>
> c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms
of Service.
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> .
> Visit for archived
messages, bookmarks, files, polls, etc.
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
>
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You are correct, Bill, the scars run deep.
Rick Griffin, who illustrated the Challengers album covers, did a cartoon in the
early '60's that reflected the mind of many surf music and pre-Beatles rock
fans. I think it's reprinted in John Blair's book and/or the Dumb Angel Gazette.
A surfer kid comes upon a long hair with ruffled shirt and Beatle boots and
asks, "What are you?" and the hipster replies with something such as, "Ya gotta
have long hair to be cool" and it goes on from there. Griffin's attitude is
clearly that the long hairs are a bunch a phonies. I know some older folks on
the Ventures list who still carry that anti-long hair attitude.
The Boss Martians do a very clever homage to this circa '64 attitude on their
"13 Evil Tales" CD in a song called, "Long Hair Lenny". It's a 1997 tune but
sounds as if it could very well have been a cut on a Trashmen album. "Long Hair
Lenny took my girl away"..."Looked like a chick from head to socks". Very well
done.
-Marty
----- Original Message -----
From: supertwangreverb
To:
Sent: Thursday, September 09, 2004 6:34 PM
Subject: [SurfGuitar101] Re: Eddie Bertrand (was: strings and strats)
I'm pretty sure Hendrix, Clapton and the British bands played a role
in this. Not only did those guys end surf music but they screwed up
alot of the firstwavers. Put yourself in a surf band 1965 (which
was pretty late for surf bands)and your competition is some long
haired guys that the girls are screming for. Psychologically these
guys have scars that run pretty deep :).
Bill
--- In , Dan Bartley <bigtwangguy@y...>
wrote:
> I wonder if that's because when Hendrix and Clapton came along the
Chantays felt like they got left behind in the dust and are still to
this day trying to show everybody that they can keep up with the
Jones?
> Dan
>
> Marty Tippens <mctippens@e...> wrote:
> The Chantays play with a lot of energy and a three-guitar line up,
plus bass. They always get a great crowd response BUT theirs is more
a modern guitar god distortion lead guitar sound than a high energy
trad surf sound.
> -Marty
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: DP
> To:
> Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2004 4:00 PM
> Subject: Re: [SurfGuitar101] Re: Eddie Bertrand (was: strings
and strats)
>
>
> RE: "It's sad to hear that some of our favorite bands from
> the 1st wave don't play with much enthusiasm anymore..."
>
> Yeah, it is sad that many lose energy as they get older...
>
> but,then again, I did see the Tornadoes play a rippin' 2
> hour set in San Bernardino a couple of years ago, and Dick
> Dale (whether you like him or not) always seems to be High
> Energy...Paul Johnson still rips it up too!...
>
> so...like anything in this world, it all depends upon who
> you are watching or hearing...some actually get better as
> they age...
>
> regards,
> DP
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
It's interesting how history plays itself out. When the long hairs with their
Marshalls came along in the mid 60's it must have been quite astounding and
revolutionary to behold. Nowadays, there is nothing more boring, mundane,
contrived, un-original, un-inspired and just plain shlocky than some dude with a
distorted tone wanking away on the 'ol blues/pentatonic scale tripe. Don't get
me wrong, a good player is a good player no matter what the genre, but let's
face it, that Hendrix/Clapton thing has been done to death. Traditional surf and
rock'billy guitar, in my opinion, sounds more fresh and modern. BUT, it must be
played well, or it risks sounding contrived as well. I feel that our job is much
more difficult than that of the mainstream wanker, but that is ultimately our
satisfaction. It's like winning this year's Daytona 500 in a ' 62 Dodge.
Dan
Marty Tippens <> wrote:
You are correct, Bill, the scars run deep.
Rick Griffin, who illustrated the Challengers album covers, did a cartoon in the
early '60's that reflected the mind of many surf music and pre-Beatles rock
fans. I think it's reprinted in John Blair's book and/or the Dumb Angel Gazette.
A surfer kid comes upon a long hair with ruffled shirt and Beatle boots and
asks, "What are you?" and the hipster replies with something such as, "Ya gotta
have long hair to be cool" and it goes on from there. Griffin's attitude is
clearly that the long hairs are a bunch a phonies. I know some older folks on
the Ventures list who still carry that anti-long hair attitude.
The Boss Martians do a very clever homage to this circa '64 attitude on their
"13 Evil Tales" CD in a song called, "Long Hair Lenny". It's a 1997 tune but
sounds as if it could very well have been a cut on a Trashmen album. "Long Hair
Lenny took my girl away"..."Looked like a chick from head to socks". Very well
done.
-Marty
----- Original Message -----
From: supertwangreverb
To:
Sent: Thursday, September 09, 2004 6:34 PM
Subject: [SurfGuitar101] Re: Eddie Bertrand (was: strings and strats)
I'm pretty sure Hendrix, Clapton and the British bands played a role
in this. Not only did those guys end surf music but they screwed up
alot of the firstwavers. Put yourself in a surf band 1965 (which
was pretty late for surf bands)and your competition is some long
haired guys that the girls are screming for. Psychologically these
guys have scars that run pretty deep :).
Bill
--- In , Dan Bartley <bigtwangguy@y...>
wrote:
> I wonder if that's because when Hendrix and Clapton came along the
Chantays felt like they got left behind in the dust and are still to
this day trying to show everybody that they can keep up with the
Jones?
> Dan
>
> Marty Tippens <mctippens@e...> wrote:
> The Chantays play with a lot of energy and a three-guitar line up,
plus bass. They always get a great crowd response BUT theirs is more
a modern guitar god distortion lead guitar sound than a high energy
trad surf sound.
> -Marty
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: DP
> To:
> Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2004 4:00 PM
> Subject: Re: [SurfGuitar101] Re: Eddie Bertrand (was: strings
and strats)
>
>
> RE: "It's sad to hear that some of our favorite bands from
> the 1st wave don't play with much enthusiasm anymore..."
>
> Yeah, it is sad that many lose energy as they get older...
>
> but,then again, I did see the Tornadoes play a rippin' 2
> hour set in San Bernardino a couple of years ago, and Dick
> Dale (whether you like him or not) always seems to be High
> Energy...Paul Johnson still rips it up too!...
>
> so...like anything in this world, it all depends upon who
> you are watching or hearing...some actually get better as
> they age...
>
> regards,
> DP
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now.
>
>
>
> .
> Visit for archived
messages, bookmarks, files, polls, etc.
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>
>
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>
>
>
>
>
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>
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>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I like your take on this. In the 90s, all the new surf bands were a
refreshing change from all the boring crap that received air time.
On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 13:36:46 -0700 (PDT) Dan Bartley
<> writes:
> It's interesting how history plays itself out. When the long hairs
> with their Marshalls came along in the mid 60's it must have been
> quite astounding and revolutionary to behold. Nowadays, there is
> nothing more boring, mundane, contrived, un-original, un-inspired
> and just plain shlocky than some dude with a distorted tone wanking
> away on the 'ol blues/pentatonic scale tripe. Don't get me wrong, a
> good player is a good player no matter what the genre, but let's
> face it, that Hendrix/Clapton thing has been done to death.
> Traditional surf and rock'billy guitar, in my opinion, sounds more
> fresh and modern. BUT, it must be played well, or it risks sounding
> contrived as well. I feel that our job is much more difficult than
> that of the mainstream wanker, but that is ultimately our
> satisfaction. It's like winning this year's Daytona 500 in a ' 62
> Dodge.
> Dan
>
> Marty Tippens <> wrote:
> You are correct, Bill, the scars run deep.
>
> Rick Griffin, who illustrated the Challengers album covers, did a
> cartoon in the early '60's that reflected the mind of many surf
> music and pre-Beatles rock fans. I think it's reprinted in John
> Blair's book and/or the Dumb Angel Gazette. A surfer kid comes upon
> a long hair with ruffled shirt and Beatle boots and asks, "What are
> you?" and the hipster replies with something such as, "Ya gotta have
> long hair to be cool" and it goes on from there. Griffin's attitude
> is clearly that the long hairs are a bunch a phonies. I know some
> older folks on the Ventures list who still carry that anti-long hair
> attitude.
>
> The Boss Martians do a very clever homage to this circa '64 attitude
> on their "13 Evil Tales" CD in a song called, "Long Hair Lenny".
> It's a 1997 tune but sounds as if it could very well have been a
> cut on a Trashmen album. "Long Hair Lenny took my girl
> away"..."Looked like a chick from head to socks". Very well done.
>
> -Marty
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: supertwangreverb
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, September 09, 2004 6:34 PM
> Subject: [SurfGuitar101] Re: Eddie Bertrand (was: strings and
> strats)
>
>
> I'm pretty sure Hendrix, Clapton and the British bands played a
> role
> in this. Not only did those guys end surf music but they screwed
> up
> alot of the firstwavers. Put yourself in a surf band 1965 (which
>
> was pretty late for surf bands)and your competition is some long
> haired guys that the girls are screming for. Psychologically
> these
> guys have scars that run pretty deep :).
>
> Bill
>
> --- In , Dan Bartley
> <bigtwangguy@y...>
> wrote:
> > I wonder if that's because when Hendrix and Clapton came along
> the
> Chantays felt like they got left behind in the dust and are still
> to
> this day trying to show everybody that they can keep up with the
> Jones?
> > Dan
> >
> > Marty Tippens <mctippens@e...> wrote:
> > The Chantays play with a lot of energy and a three-guitar line
> up,
> plus bass. They always get a great crowd response BUT theirs is
> more
> a modern guitar god distortion lead guitar sound than a high
> energy
> trad surf sound.
> > -Marty
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: DP
> > To:
> > Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2004 4:00 PM
> > Subject: Re: [SurfGuitar101] Re: Eddie Bertrand (was: strings
>
> and strats)
> >
> >
> > RE: "It's sad to hear that some of our favorite bands from
> > the 1st wave don't play with much enthusiasm anymore..."
> >
> > Yeah, it is sad that many lose energy as they get older...
> >
> > but,then again, I did see the Tornadoes play a rippin' 2
> > hour set in San Bernardino a couple of years ago, and Dick
> > Dale (whether you like him or not) always seems to be High
> > Energy...Paul Johnson still rips it up too!...
> >
> > so...like anything in this world, it all depends upon who
> > you are watching or hearing...some actually get better as
> > they age...
> >
> > regards,
> > DP
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now.
> >
> >
> >
> > .
> > Visit for archived
>
> messages, bookmarks, files, polls, etc.
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> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> > ADVERTISEMENT
> >
> >
> >
> >
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> >
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> of Service.
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At 17:36 10/9/2004, you wrote:
>It's interesting how history plays itself out. When the long hairs with
>their Marshalls came along in the mid 60's it must have been quite
>astounding and revolutionary to behold. Nowadays, there is nothing more
>boring, mundane, contrived, un-original, un-inspired and just plain
>shlocky than some dude with a distorted tone wanking away on the 'ol
>blues/pentatonic scale tripe. Don't get me wrong, a good player is a good
>player no matter what the genre, but let's face it, that Hendrix/Clapton
>thing has been done to death. Traditional surf and rock'billy guitar, in
>my opinion, sounds more fresh and modern. BUT, it must be played well, or
>it risks sounding contrived as well. I feel that our job is much more
>difficult than that of the mainstream wanker, but that is ultimately our
>satisfaction. It's like winning this year's Daytona 500 in a ' 62 Dodge.
>Dan
Amen to that.
90
