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--- dave wronski <> wrote:
> I've been told by a guy high up the Fender food
> chain that the cheepo Jags and Jazzmasters being
> sold by MF are made in a different factory than the
> Japan made guitars we usually see. The price
> reflects the quality.
>
This is a bit confusing. If the price reflects the
quality, are the $399 guitars that MF sells different
than the $699 versions they (and many music stores)
have been offering? The Jags and JMs sold through
Ishibashi are actually cheaper than $699, before the
massive shipping costs are added in. They might be
built in a different factory, and they may be lower
quality, I don't know, but the fact they're being
talked down now that the price has dropped seems out
of line.
FWIW, I've played a both a mid-90's matching-headstock
JM and a new one (almost) side-by-side, and the new
one felt, and sounded, a bit better to me. Both were
set up horribly wrong, of course (music shops can't
seem to set these things up to save their lives), but
they did feel different.
Ric
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Here is all I know about the subject. Regarding price. The $399
guitars are exactly the same as the $699 guitars. They are selling
cheap because they are closing them out. They only made 350 of each
available to the US. What happened was that they were made for Japan
but they didn't want them because the Japanese don't really want
guitars without matching headstocks. So they offered them to the US
market if they wanted them. The limited edition Jaguars are different
from the Ishibishi guitars. The Ishibishi ones are MIJ while the
limited ones are CIJ. The MIJ are made to be sent to other countries.
They are essentially MIM type guitars. The CIJ is made to stay in
Japan. They quality is better thant he MIJ because it is Fender's
main plant producing guitars in Japan. The don't send American made
guitars to Japan so Japan has to make their own Custom Shop series,
Deluxe series etc... The wood is alder which is the real deal. MIJ
are basswood. CIJ's only have pickups which are, supposedly, not as
good. I cannot comment on that. All of the parts, except wood and
pickups, are said to be from America. I may be wrong. I was just
summing up what I have heard regarding they guitars.
--- In , Ric Flinn <zanshin09@y...>
wrote:
> --- dave wronski <stickmandw@y...> wrote:
> > I've been told by a guy high up the Fender food
> > chain that the cheepo Jags and Jazzmasters being
> > sold by MF are made in a different factory than the
> > Japan made guitars we usually see. The price
> > reflects the quality.
> >
>
> This is a bit confusing. If the price reflects the
> quality, are the $399 guitars that MF sells different
> than the $699 versions they (and many music stores)
> have been offering? The Jags and JMs sold through
> Ishibashi are actually cheaper than $699, before the
> massive shipping costs are added in. They might be
> built in a different factory, and they may be lower
> quality, I don't know, but the fact they're being
> talked down now that the price has dropped seems out
> of line.
>
> FWIW, I've played a both a mid-90's matching-headstock
> JM and a new one (almost) side-by-side, and the new
> one felt, and sounded, a bit better to me. Both were
> set up horribly wrong, of course (music shops can't
> seem to set these things up to save their lives), but
> they did feel different.
>
> Ric
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
>
"The Ishibashi ones are MIJ while the limited ones are CIJ."
Hi,
I'm not sure this is correct (but it could be). I think that MIJ guitars
are no longer produced.
MIJ is pre "97 Japanese production and stands for "Made In Japan"
In "97 The Japanse changed from MIJ to CIJ "Crafted In Japan" and is
using CIJ ever since.
It seams "Crafted In..." is considered a beter sounding name then "Made
In...."
Although I heard that MIJ and CIJ are still used by different factories,
but I'm not sure it really is.
Squier also went from "MIJ" to "CIJ" (Vista series also have "Crafted In
Japan" on the back of their necks.)
Fender doesn't have a factory in Japan, a well known guitar factory
produces guitars for Fender there. (Sorry forget the name of the actual
factory) Unlike Fanders Mexico factory, which is an actual Fender
factory.
But it is possible Fender has contracted several Japanes guitar
factories. (so MIJ and CIJ could be used by different factories)
On the other hand, both the Jaguar and the Jazzmaster are not top
sellers like the strat and the Tele, so I'm not sure if it would be of
Fender's economical intrest to have two contract Japanese guitar
factories building these models.
Perhaps it is really a matter of "overstock" or "stock clearance"
All the above are mere observations and do not rely on actual knowledge.
Perhaps a "educated guess"
-Jerry S.
"On the other hand, both the Jaguar and the Jazzmaster are not top
sellers like the strat and the Tele, so I'm not sure if it would be of
Fender's economical intrest to have two contract Japanese guitar
factories building these models."
I agree...however I think the Jazzmaster is bigger in Japan than here
just because of the Ventures fame.
--- In , "Jerry" <jerry.soetewey@b...>
wrote:
>
>
> "The Ishibashi ones are MIJ while the limited ones are CIJ."
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm not sure this is correct (but it could be). I think that MIJ
guitars
> are no longer produced.
> MIJ is pre "97 Japanese production and stands for "Made In Japan"
> In "97 The Japanse changed from MIJ to CIJ "Crafted In Japan" and
is
> using CIJ ever since.
> It seams "Crafted In..." is considered a beter sounding name
then "Made
> In...."
>
> Although I heard that MIJ and CIJ are still used by different
factories,
> but I'm not sure it really is.
> Squier also went from "MIJ" to "CIJ" (Vista series also
have "Crafted In
> Japan" on the back of their necks.)
>
> Fender doesn't have a factory in Japan, a well known guitar factory
> produces guitars for Fender there. (Sorry forget the name of the
actual
> factory) Unlike Fanders Mexico factory, which is an actual Fender
> factory.
> But it is possible Fender has contracted several Japanes guitar
> factories. (so MIJ and CIJ could be used by different factories)
>
> On the other hand, both the Jaguar and the Jazzmaster are not top
> sellers like the strat and the Tele, so I'm not sure if it would be
of
> Fender's economical intrest to have two contract Japanese guitar
> factories building these models.
>
> Perhaps it is really a matter of "overstock" or "stock clearance"
>
> All the above are mere observations and do not rely on actual
knowledge.
>
> Perhaps a "educated guess"
>
> -Jerry S.
Thanks for the detail, Jacob.
Do you know if the $699.00 Jazzmasters are CIJ or MIJ?
Apparently other CIJ's are not staying in Japan. I have a recent issue '52 Tele
with Bigsby that is CIJ. It is definitly high quality.
-Marty
----- Original Message -----
From: jacobdobner
To:
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 9:32 AM
Subject: [SurfGuitar101] Cheapo Jags (was Re: The Reluctant Aquanauts online)
Here is all I know about the subject. Regarding price. The $399
guitars are exactly the same as the $699 guitars. They are selling
cheap because they are closing them out. They only made 350 of each
available to the US. What happened was that they were made for Japan
but they didn't want them because the Japanese don't really want
guitars without matching headstocks. So they offered them to the US
market if they wanted them. The limited edition Jaguars are different
from the Ishibishi guitars. The Ishibishi ones are MIJ while the
limited ones are CIJ. The MIJ are made to be sent to other countries.
They are essentially MIM type guitars. The CIJ is made to stay in
Japan. They quality is better thant he MIJ because it is Fender's
main plant producing guitars in Japan. The don't send American made
guitars to Japan so Japan has to make their own Custom Shop series,
Deluxe series etc... The wood is alder which is the real deal. MIJ
are basswood. CIJ's only have pickups which are, supposedly, not as
good. I cannot comment on that. All of the parts, except wood and
pickups, are said to be from America. I may be wrong. I was just
summing up what I have heard regarding they guitars.
--- In , Ric Flinn <zanshin09@y...>
wrote:
> --- dave wronski <stickmandw@y...> wrote:
> > I've been told by a guy high up the Fender food
> > chain that the cheepo Jags and Jazzmasters being
> > sold by MF are made in a different factory than the
> > Japan made guitars we usually see. The price
> > reflects the quality.
> >
>
> This is a bit confusing. If the price reflects the
> quality, are the $399 guitars that MF sells different
> than the $699 versions they (and many music stores)
> have been offering? The Jags and JMs sold through
> Ishibashi are actually cheaper than $699, before the
> massive shipping costs are added in. They might be
> built in a different factory, and they may be lower
> quality, I don't know, but the fact they're being
> talked down now that the price has dropped seems out
> of line.
>
> FWIW, I've played a both a mid-90's matching-headstock
> JM and a new one (almost) side-by-side, and the new
> one felt, and sounded, a bit better to me. Both were
> set up horribly wrong, of course (music shops can't
> seem to set these things up to save their lives), but
> they did feel different.
>
> Ric
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
>
.
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