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I recently got one of the Blackface Reverb Reissues from MF.
It arrived with the RCA connection from the tank unplugged, so I had
to fiddle around with that first, and then after I got the reverb
working, I couldn't turn the tone past "1" due to the harsh high-end
thing.
I was aware of the issue from the various posts here, so I headed
over to my local used/vintage instruments shop to pick up a 6K6 and
AT7. I ended up with a Marconi 6K6 ($15Cnd) plus a back-up. But
instead of an AT7, the amp guy suggested a 5751.
That allowed me to turn the tone control to "3".
Mainly I play a '65 Jaguar through a '66 Bandmaster, and the reverb
sounds very nice, but I suspect it could sound even better if I had
full tone control.
Would the AT7 be preferable to 5751 (Sovtek, no less)? Should I look
for a 7025? Is there anything else I can do, short of the cap mod?
Incidentally, like someone else has noted here, the tube chart on the
inside of the unit refers a 7025, but it came with a (GT) 12AX7 in
its place.
Here's my $.02 on your tank issues:
The 5751 tube has a bit more gain than a 12AT7 (the 5751 has about
70% of the gain of a 12AX7, while the 12AT7 has about 60% of the
gain of a 12AX7), so you may want to try a 12AT7 to reduce some of
the harshness.
The 7025 tube was a low noise version of the 12AX7 - I don't think
they're really in commercial production now (although Sovtek may
have such a model). Any 12AX7 should work fine in the tank. I think
the tank tube chart reference to the 7025 is for "authenticity"
reasons in the reissue.
Even with the cap mod (and with old 6K6, 12AX7, and 12AT7 tubes in
place), my reissue still has a good bit of the treble-y "ice pick"
effect (at least when compared to the 6G15 tank I built). Don't
know if you'll ever get "full tone control", but maybe a 12AT7 will
take a little edge off of the tank. Good luck!
-Dick
--- In , "rio452001" <mpietra102@a...>
wrote:
>
> I recently got one of the Blackface Reverb Reissues from MF.
>
> It arrived with the RCA connection from the tank unplugged, so I
had
> to fiddle around with that first, and then after I got the reverb
> working, I couldn't turn the tone past "1" due to the harsh high-
end
> thing.
>
> I was aware of the issue from the various posts here, so I headed
> over to my local used/vintage instruments shop to pick up a 6K6
and
> AT7. I ended up with a Marconi 6K6 ($15Cnd) plus a back-up. But
> instead of an AT7, the amp guy suggested a 5751.
>
> That allowed me to turn the tone control to "3".
>
> Mainly I play a '65 Jaguar through a '66 Bandmaster, and the
reverb
> sounds very nice, but I suspect it could sound even better if I
had
> full tone control.
>
> Would the AT7 be preferable to 5751 (Sovtek, no less)? Should I
look
> for a 7025? Is there anything else I can do, short of the cap mod?
>
> Incidentally, like someone else has noted here, the tube chart on
the
> inside of the unit refers a 7025, but it came with a (GT) 12AX7 in
> its place.
A pal and I tweaked our reverb units this past weekend and we found a 12AU7
instead of an AT7 made 'em nice and mellow sounding (but maybe not as deep).
At 03:54 AM 9/27/2003 +0000, you wrote:
>Here's my $.02 on your tank issues:
>
>The 5751 tube has a bit more gain than a 12AT7 (the 5751 has about
>70% of the gain of a 12AX7, while the 12AT7 has about 60% of the
>gain of a 12AX7), so you may want to try a 12AT7 to reduce some of
>the harshness.
>
>The 7025 tube was a low noise version of the 12AX7 - I don't think
>they're really in commercial production now (although Sovtek may
>have such a model). Any 12AX7 should work fine in the tank. I think
>the tank tube chart reference to the 7025 is for "authenticity"
>reasons in the reissue.
>
>Even with the cap mod (and with old 6K6, 12AX7, and 12AT7 tubes in
>place), my reissue still has a good bit of the treble-y "ice pick"
>effect (at least when compared to the 6G15 tank I built). Don't
>know if you'll ever get "full tone control", but maybe a 12AT7 will
>take a little edge off of the tank. Good luck!
>
>-Dick
>
>--- In , "rio452001" <mpietra102@a...>
>wrote:
> >
> > I recently got one of the Blackface Reverb Reissues from MF.
> >
> > It arrived with the RCA connection from the tank unplugged, so I
>had
> > to fiddle around with that first, and then after I got the reverb
> > working, I couldn't turn the tone past "1" due to the harsh high-
>end
> > thing.
> >
> > I was aware of the issue from the various posts here, so I headed
> > over to my local used/vintage instruments shop to pick up a 6K6
>and
> > AT7. I ended up with a Marconi 6K6 ($15Cnd) plus a back-up. But
> > instead of an AT7, the amp guy suggested a 5751.
> >
> > That allowed me to turn the tone control to "3".
> >
> > Mainly I play a '65 Jaguar through a '66 Bandmaster, and the
>reverb
> > sounds very nice, but I suspect it could sound even better if I
>had
> > full tone control.
> >
> > Would the AT7 be preferable to 5751 (Sovtek, no less)? Should I
>look
> > for a 7025? Is there anything else I can do, short of the cap mod?
> >
> > Incidentally, like someone else has noted here, the tube chart on
>the
> > inside of the unit refers a 7025, but it came with a (GT) 12AX7 in
> > its place.
>
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>.
>Visit for archived messages,
>bookmarks, files, polls, etc.
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
The 12AU7 has about 19% of the gain of the 12AX7 - not much signal
amplification at all - I'm not surprised at the effect! Personally,
I don't think I would substitute anything other than a 5751 or a
12AT7 - just my preference.
In case you haven't seen it, The Tube Store has a cool pre-amp tube
substitution page that's worth checking out. Here's the link:
-Dick
--- In , James Barnett
<elreydelart@e...> wrote:
> A pal and I tweaked our reverb units this past weekend and we
found a 12AU7
> instead of an AT7 made 'em nice and mellow sounding (but maybe not
as deep).
>
> At 03:54 AM 9/27/2003 +0000, you wrote:
> >Here's my $.02 on your tank issues:
> >
> >The 5751 tube has a bit more gain than a 12AT7 (the 5751 has about
> >70% of the gain of a 12AX7, while the 12AT7 has about 60% of the
> >gain of a 12AX7), so you may want to try a 12AT7 to reduce some of
> >the harshness.
> >
> >The 7025 tube was a low noise version of the 12AX7 - I don't think
> >they're really in commercial production now (although Sovtek may
> >have such a model). Any 12AX7 should work fine in the tank. I
think
> >the tank tube chart reference to the 7025 is for "authenticity"
> >reasons in the reissue.
> >
> >Even with the cap mod (and with old 6K6, 12AX7, and 12AT7 tubes in
> >place), my reissue still has a good bit of the treble-y "ice pick"
> >effect (at least when compared to the 6G15 tank I built). Don't
> >know if you'll ever get "full tone control", but maybe a 12AT7
will
> >take a little edge off of the tank. Good luck!
> >
> >-Dick
> >
> >--- In , "rio452001"
<mpietra102@a...>
> >wrote:
> > >
> > > I recently got one of the Blackface Reverb Reissues from MF.
> > >
> > > It arrived with the RCA connection from the tank unplugged,
so I
> >had
> > > to fiddle around with that first, and then after I got the
reverb
> > > working, I couldn't turn the tone past "1" due to the harsh
high-
> >end
> > > thing.
> > >
> > > I was aware of the issue from the various posts here, so I
headed
> > > over to my local used/vintage instruments shop to pick up a 6K6
> >and
> > > AT7. I ended up with a Marconi 6K6 ($15Cnd) plus a back-up. But
> > > instead of an AT7, the amp guy suggested a 5751.
> > >
> > > That allowed me to turn the tone control to "3".
> > >
> > > Mainly I play a '65 Jaguar through a '66 Bandmaster, and the
> >reverb
> > > sounds very nice, but I suspect it could sound even better if I
> >had
> > > full tone control.
> > >
> > > Would the AT7 be preferable to 5751 (Sovtek, no less)? Should I
> >look
> > > for a 7025? Is there anything else I can do, short of the cap
mod?
> > >
> > > Incidentally, like someone else has noted here, the tube chart
on
> >the
> > > inside of the unit refers a 7025, but it came with a (GT)
12AX7 in
> > > its place.
> >
> >
> >
> >To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> >
> >Visit for archived
messages,
> >bookmarks, files, polls, etc.
> >
> >
> >
> >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> I recently got one of the Blackface Reverb Reissues from MF.
Cool. What kind of handle does it have? Leather (dog bone) or plastic? White
knobs or Twin Reverb style? I think the picture Musician's Friend has on
their Web Site is misleading.
>
> It arrived with the RCA connection from the tank unplugged, so I had
> to fiddle around with that first,
My tank arrived with several of the springs that hold the pan in place
disconnected. These things seem to be delicate, or the UPS guy takes great
pride in shaking the crap out of them.
> and then after I got the reverb
> working, I couldn't turn the tone past "1" due to the harsh high-end
> thing.
Are you exaggerating? Maybe I got lucky, but I usually have mine on 6-6-6
without any ice-pick effect. Or maybe we have different ice-pick
tolerances... I've done the 6K6 swap and cap mod.
If it is that bad maybe you got a lemon....?
>
> Incidentally, like someone else has noted here, the tube chart on the
> inside of the unit refers a 7025, but it came with a (GT) 12AX7 in
> its place.
As Dick said, the 7025 is probably there for historical completeness...its
the low noise version of the 12AX7. Vintage amps distinguish between 7025's
and 12AX7's on their tube charts.
BN
--- In , "Brian Neal" <bneal@i...> wrote:
> > I recently got one of the Blackface Reverb Reissues from MF.
>
> Cool. What kind of handle does it have? Leather (dog bone) or
plastic? White
> knobs or Twin Reverb style? I think the picture Musician's Friend
has on
> their Web Site is misleading.
Brian: Mine has a plastic handle with chrome ends, like the usual
handle of BF or SF amps. The knobs are white plastic.
> >
> > It arrived with the RCA connection from the tank unplugged, so I
had
> > to fiddle around with that first,
>
> My tank arrived with several of the springs that hold the pan in
place
> disconnected. These things seem to be delicate, or the UPS guy
takes great
> pride in shaking the crap out of them.
>
> > and then after I got the reverb
> > working, I couldn't turn the tone past "1" due to the harsh high-
end
> > thing.
>
> Are you exaggerating? Maybe I got lucky, but I usually have mine on
6-6-6
> without any ice-pick effect. Or maybe we have different ice-pick
> tolerances... I've done the 6K6 swap and cap mod.
Actually, I'm not exaggerating... it was really really bad when I
first got it. Since installing the 6K6 and the 5751, it's been tamed
to the point where I can turn the tone to "3" (using a setting of "5"
for bass & treble on the amp).
Don't get me wrong, it actually sounds pretty good at either "663"
or "773", but "666" would be outta the question.
> If it is that bad maybe you got a lemon....?
> >
I'm pretty sure there are others here who can't turn theirs past "3",
and since it doesn't sound too bad, I don't think it's a lemon.
Maybe I'll take it to my amp guy and have the cap mod done.
> > Incidentally, like someone else has noted here, the tube chart on
the
> > inside of the unit refers a 7025, but it came with a (GT) 12AX7 in
> > its place.
>
> As Dick said, the 7025 is probably there for historical
completeness...its
> the low noise version of the 12AX7. Vintage amps distinguish
between 7025's
> and 12AX7's on their tube charts.
>
> BN
Thanks for your comments, Brian.
Rio
>
> Brian: Mine has a plastic handle with chrome ends, like the usual
> handle of BF or SF amps. The knobs are white plastic.
Nice! I wish I had a black one now, I just have the brown/tan reissue.
>
> > > and then after I got the reverb
> > > working, I couldn't turn the tone past "1" due to the harsh high-
> end
> > > thing.
> >
> > Are you exaggerating? Maybe I got lucky, but I usually have mine on
> 6-6-6
> > without any ice-pick effect. Or maybe we have different ice-pick
> > tolerances... I've done the 6K6 swap and cap mod.
>
> Actually, I'm not exaggerating... it was really really bad when I
> first got it. Since installing the 6K6 and the 5751, it's been tamed
> to the point where I can turn the tone to "3" (using a setting of "5"
> for bass & treble on the amp).
>
> Don't get me wrong, it actually sounds pretty good at either "663"
> or "773", but "666" would be outta the question.
>
Wow, I hope you can get that resolved. Good luck!
BN
--- In , "Brian Neal" <bneal@i...> wrote:
Are you exaggerating? Maybe I got lucky, but I usually have mine on
> > 6-6-6
> > > without any ice-pick effect. Or maybe we have different ice-pick
> > > tolerances... I've done the 6K6 swap and cap mod.
> >
It may well be a tolerance thing... it's not necessarily painful
above "3", but it's not really to my liking. Normally, I set the tone
controls to "5" on either my BandMaster or my Twin Reverb re-issue,
so I like to keep it fairly evenly balanced. Maybe I should try
cranking the tone up at this week's rehearsal and see what the rest
of the band thinks of it.
> > > Wow, I hope you can get that resolved. Good luck!
Maybe to speed up the process (and save me having to search the
archives again), could you please refresh my memory: exactly which
cap mod did you have done to deal with the "ice pick" effect?
I'll have to bring it to a local shop to have it done, and the fellow
there seems reasonably knowledgeable, but it'll probably help if I
can tell him what it is.
>
Thanks again Brian.
This is a great site, it really is.
> Maybe to speed up the process (and save me having to search the
> archives again), could you please refresh my memory: exactly which
> cap mod did you have done to deal with the "ice pick" effect?
See Dick Messick's excellent tutorial here:
BTW, this didn't affect my tone, it very subtley gave it a more mellower,
richer reverb. It was not a dramatic ice-pick killer, at least for me. It
sure sounds like our reverb units are different. Too bad we can't meet and
do a side by side comparison...!
BN
Thanks Brian, this is great.
If you're ever in Toronto, bring your Reverb & look me up! Got
guitars, amps & the loud & mighty rythm section of The Eradicators
waiting for you!
Rio
--- In , "Brian Neal" <bneal@i...> wrote:
> > Maybe to speed up the process (and save me having to search the
> > archives again), could you please refresh my memory: exactly which
> > cap mod did you have done to deal with the "ice pick" effect?
>
> See Dick Messick's excellent tutorial here:
>
>
>
> BTW, this didn't affect my tone, it very subtley gave it a more
mellower,
> richer reverb. It was not a dramatic ice-pick killer, at least for
me. It
> sure sounds like our reverb units are different. Too bad we can't
meet and
> do a side by side comparison...!
>
> BN
