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billyblastoff805 - 31 Jan 2005 23:18:07: Absolutely Marty! If you gotta start tinkering with Leo's design, well, you
ain't really playin' surf now are ya?
B-B-O
P.S. Eddie can't play surf.
---- Marty Tippens <> wrote:
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> I think we're actually agreeing, Red. 
> 
> As you say, you want your strat(s) to be versatile. I'm guessing this means
that you may still want to play a Hendrix or Yngwie number in between your
Pipelines and Penetrations. I certainly agree that a standard strat trem ain't
the best for that kinda versatility. And no doubt about it, Hendrix woulda had
it easier with a Floyd Rose (but I actually like the imperfections and the
beautiful way he worked around 'em). 
> 
> The three strats that I've been playing really are one trick ponys and that's
the way I want 'em. They're intended for surf and surf only. Yep, for that
standard trem to work best does require special strings, heavy mo-fos.  If
I'm gonna play a different style, I use a different guitar.  
> -Marty 
>   ----- Original Message ----- 
>   From: red_thundr 
>   To: 
>   Sent: Monday, January 31, 2005 7:26 PM 
>   Subject: [SurfGuitar101] Re: Mighty Mite Trem (Wilkinson) 
> 
> 
> 
>   We can simply agree to disagree. 
> 
>   Hendrix was notorious for being out of tune (I can hardly stomach
his 
>   live performances merely on that fact.)  Jeff Beck and others
need 
>   massive adjustments and tweeks to make their stock Fender units 
>   livable.  Van Halen simply gave up on the stock Fender unit and
found 
>   something better, and in doing so rewrote the book on what you
could 
>   do with a tremolo. 
> 
>   My Stratocaster is not a one-trick-pony, and I demand that it have 
>   flexibility, versatility, and reliability.  The Wilkinson
tremolo 
>   plays a big part in that equation, and if I can spread the good
word 
>   on something I found, I'm gonna do it.  You won't be able to
convince 
>   me that the stock Fender tremolos are anything more than
cantankerous 
>   hunks of junk that are better left unused.  My time is better
spent 
>   making good music than nursemaiding a device that has been vastly 
>   surpassed by far more elegant and usable solutions. 
> 
>   Consider yourself extremely fortunate to have a workable stock
Fender 
>   trem; for it's only due to luck and not by design.  My case is
the 
>   opposite: I have a great trem that's usable by design, not by luck.
 
>   The stock Fender trem will never shed its quirky reputation for 
>   needing special setups, special strings, and a wing and a prayer
when 
>   you really need to count on it. 
> 
> 
>   --- In , "ipongrac"
<ipongrac@g...> 
>   wrote: 
>   > 
>   > --- In , "red_thundr" 
>   <red_thundr@y...> 
>   > wrote: 
>   > > 
>   > > I'd only have to add that you need to try a Wilkinson
first.  
>   > 
>   > I will, if I get a chance. 
>   > 
>   > > The 
>   > > general consensus is that the "vintage" Strat trem
needs special 
>   > > supporting setup mods and inordinate care applied in order
for it 
>   to 
>   > > be somewhat stable and usable; it doesn't just
"work" out of the 
>   > box. 
>   > > Tuning problems are a well-documented and universally
accepted 
>   > > idiosyncrasy of the stock Fender unit.  All that
friction on the 6 
>   > > pivot screws doesn't bode well for tuning stability, and
the 
>   > > side-to-side shifting of the spring-loaded saddles doesn't
give 
>   the 
>   > > strings a consistent zero return point. 
>   > 
>   > Cause people use thin strings and don't set it up right.  Oh,
and 
>   > they dive-bomb with it and pretend they're EVH or Brad Gillis, 
>   which 
>   > is not what it was designed to do. Again, I said that it works 
>   really 
>   > well for SURF MUSIC, meaning adding true vibrato, whether gentle
or 
>   > heavy-handed, rather than making airplane and Ferrari noises
with.  
>   > Incidentally, Hendrix, Van Halen, and Jeff Beck did much if not
all 
>   > of their whammy abuse on vintage style units...  I even read
an 
>   > interview with EVH where he said he prefers the tone of the
vintage 
>   > Strat unit, but obviously a Floyd Rose stays in tune better
for 
>   what 
>   > he does.  
>   > 
>   > > If the vintage Fender trem was half as good as you say, 
>   > 
>   > I'm telling you what my experience with it is - why would I 
>   > exaggerate? 
>   > 
>   > > Floyd Rose would have been out of business > 25 years
ago.  
>   > 
>   > Well, Kahler is.  And how many new guitars do you see with
real 
>   Floyd 
>   > Rose units?  Maybe Jackson and ESP, but not many more. 
I don't 
>   think 
>   > that Fender has one standard model with a real Floyd Rose on it
 
>   > anymore (they have a Mexican or Korean model with a Floyd Rose 
>   copy), 
>   > while the vintage unit is still found on the great majority of 
>   their 
>   > (and many other manufacturers') guitars.  Floyd Rose trems
are a 
>   pain 
>   > in the ass.  They're hard to adjust for intonation,
changing 
>   strings 
>   > is a pain in the ass, and locking and unlocking the nut and having
 
>   > the right wrench is just really inconvenient. 
>   > 
>   > > Most elements of the original Strat design are timeless; 
>   > > unfortunately, the trem isn't one of them. 
>   > 
>   > I couldn't disagree more.  I believe it's one of Leo Fender's
major 
>   > claims to fame.  
>   > 
>   > > I've played a gazillion Strats, from Mexis all the way to
Custom 
>   > Shop 
>   > > beauties, and 95% of them with the stock trem have gone out
of 
>   tune 
>   > > with mild use.  And frankly, I've yet to pick up a Strat
right 
>   off 
>   > the 
>   > > dealer's wall that didn't have a major problem with the
tuning 
>   after 
>   > > testing the trem. 
>   > 
>   > Cause most of them leave the factory with 9-gauge strings and poor
 
>   > setups.  
>   >  
>   > > Bang for the buck, I believe the Wilkinson upgrade mod wins
hands 
>   > > down.  It's an inexpensive drop-in mod that a competent
luthier 
>   can 
>   > > setup with ease.  It's not finicky, it's rugged,
nice-looking, and 
>   > > actually benefits the sustain.  My recommendation is for
people to 
>   > > simply try it. 
>   > 
>   > No problem.  All Strat players should go ahead and try
it.  If I 
>   > lived close any kind of a guitar store (the nearest - crappy -
one 
>   is 
>   > 45 miles away, a good one is some 70 miles away, and I rarely
get 
>   to 
>   > go there), I would.  But my opinion is that the vintage
Strat 
>   tremolo 
>   > rules.  
>   > 
>   > Ivan 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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