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> Can I coax Ivan out of lurk mode?
Sure, why not....
> The Cossacks also put it to great use on occassion.
Thank you. I think we used it on a few songs: Neutron Sabre and the
Defector come to mind. Oh, also our version of Journey To the Stars
on the Swingin' Creepers. BTW, Mark, our rhythm guitarist, often
played some variation of this rhythm on many of the songs, but the
three songs I listed above actually had three guitar parts, where one
was dedicated to just 'chunkin''. I played that part in all three
cases - just overdubbed it. After I got used to hearing it like that
recorded, I never liked playing it live, since we couldn't reproduce
all three parts, and it always seemed empty! And BTW, I'm not really
happy how it sounds on Neutron Sabre, I didn't really have a good
handle on the technique and the sound yet - I think it's much better
on the other two songs. I just remembered, too - by the end of these
songs, my wrist would be KILLING me! Very demanding and painful!
Mel already explained the basics of 'chunkin'' quite well. 8th
notes, with occasional syncopation. The greatest influence on me as
far as 'chunkin'' goes were obviously the Astronauts, but also the
Fathoms. I thought they did it so incredibly well (it was after I
saw the Fathoms play that I went out and bought a Jazzmaster, though
I'm a dedicated Strat guy - they just completely turned my head
around). The Nebulas do it extremely well, too. Looking forward to
hearing it live in person in Indy in July! ;)
The secrets to 'chunkin'' are: 1) Jag or Jazzmaster on the middle
pickup setting (I always used a Jazzmaster) - Strats don't work well
for this sound; 2) obviously, reverb turned up high - I used 6-6-6;
3) this is what Evan Foster of the Boss Martians taught me: MUST turn
up the treble on the amp, since that's where the 'ping' (the
waterwell-like sound) lives - of course, you can easily overdo it,
and you can't really use this same sound to play DD-like double-
picking parts, because with all that treble, you WILL bore into
people's eardrums in a very unpleasant way; 4) palm muting - the
muting will diminish the attack of all that treble, making the part
stand out as well as let the reverb ring - it has to be just right,
where the note has enough 'body', but no sustain. Must use your
ears! 5) an absolutely impeccable sense of rhythm, and a wrist to
pull it off - neither of these is optional. Your wrist must have the
precision of a swiss clock, or it's going to be a mess. As a surf
guitarist you don't have to have the ability to play fast scales or
fancy chords, but you MUST have great timing and a perfect right
hand. As Rip of the Penetrators noted many times, it's not an
accident that it's almost all men that play surf lead guitar -
certain single guy, ahem, "recreational activities" improve the wrist
strength. :)
As far as the strummed chords from the Shadows and the Atlantics go,
well, Brian, this is one of the trickiest things that I ever had to
deal with as well! It's hard, for sure, especially on the Atlantics'
recordings which were not recorded very well, and you can sometimes
barely hear the rhythm guitar. Basically, it's a trial-and-error
approach. You have to use your ears, listen to the bass lines for
guidance, and just try a few things playing along with it, and see if
you got it. It's usually quite time-intensive. I could spend hours
figuring out the chords for some of those songs. In the Troubadours
even after having played these Shadows songs for almost forty years
my father still stumbles upon 'more correct' chords in some songs.
He's always trying to track down the Shadows' sheet music, too, to
see the chords. But trying to figure out rhythm guitar parts will
really give your ears a workout, and will definitely make you a
better musician. I love the rhythm guitar, and I think it's truly a
lost art. There aren't many good rhythm guitarists playing in surf
music today, cause in many ways it's much more challenging than the
lead guitar. It's not an accident that Dave Wronski was happy to
play rhythm guitar in Jon & the Nightriders for so many years. Greg
from the Fathoms is also a very accomplished lead guitarist, and even
Frankie once admitted to me that Greg's at least as good as him, if
not even better. Spanky of the Penetrators specializes in rhythm
guitar and he's quite excellent, too. All the Satan's Pilgrims guys
are very good at both lead and rhythm, and they switched around quite
a bit. Mark of the Space Cossacks is also an excellent lead guitar
player. You must know both to be a well-rounded musician.
Anyway, I hope this helps a little bit.
Ivan
PS DD today is a total wanker - an army of 'chunkin'' guitarists
wouldn't save him. (sorry - my rant for the day)
--- In , "Brian Neal" <bneal@z...> wrote:
> Thanks for picking up on this Bo. I was afraid this thread would
die.
> Anyone? Ferenc? Dano? Mel? Can I coax Ivan out of lurk mode?
>
> And yes, TooFastJim, you are right. The Woodies, The Fathoms, & The
Pilgrims
> all brought back the "chunkin'" in all its glory. The Cossacks also
put it
> to great use on occassion. But you Nebulas guys are carrying the
torch!!!!
> :)
>
> Can you imagine the modern Dick Dale with a rhythm guitar player
backing him
> up? Or does he play to freely and jammy now so this wouldn't work?
Thoughts?
>
> BN
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: lookdenfer [mailto:bstruye@i...]
> ...
> >
> > What a great question! I am very interested to learn more about
this
> > also.
> >
> > Dano?
> >
> > --- In , "Brian Neal" <bneal@z...>
wrote:
> > > Jerry S. said that he always works up the rhythm guitar parts on
> > songs when
> > > learning them. The rhythm guitar parts are the hardest parts
for me to
> > > figure out. Does anyone have any tips? I do pretty good at
picking
> > out the
> > > lead parts. But many times the rhythm guitar eludes me. I don't
know how
> > > people figure out Shadows or Atlantics songs...!
> > >
> > > The rhythm guitar is often buried in the mix, the chords are
strummed so
> > > fast, and/or its hard to pick up on subtleties like minors or
7ths, etc.
> > > Sometimes I have had success by listening to the bass line. Any
other
> > > suggestions?
> > >
> > > I'd also take any suggestions on how to do the "chunking"
parts, ala the
> > > Astronauts or The Nebulas (I do believe the Nebulas have revived
> > this long
> > > lost art form). Is it just the root notes of the chords, root &
5th, or
> > > what? Is the rhythm usually straight 8th notes or are other
patterns
> > > employed? It sounds so damn good but it's deceptively difficult.
> > With all
> > > that reverb splash and sproinging going on it sometimes makes
it hard to
> > > hear the exact rhythm (at least for me).
> > >
> > > I also realize the answer to all my questions may just
be "practice
> > more and
> > > you'll get it".
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > BN
