thewrays
Joined: Jan 04, 2009
Posts: 5
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 12:59 PM
Ok, so I'm sorta new at this.. I joined a surf band three months ago and I've been playing out of my buddy's Fender Stageman 100, which has been pretty decent, although the reverb isnt enough for surf. I debated on buying that Boss FDR1 pedal to boost the reverb on the Stageman, but I dont know much about the sound it puts out. If anyone might have an idea how this would sound, and if it saves me money, I might go that route? Probably not though, just curious.
I hesitated on buying a good "surf" amp because I didnt know how serious I was gonna be about this band. Well, its getting serious, and I love playing in it, so I think its time to invest in a better amp for surf... as well as other musical uses.
I'm looking to spend between 600-700 dollars, perferibly something used, and a reissue. I'm looking into the Twin Reverb reissue, or the Delux Reverb reissue... or something else maybe? Who knows. Again, I'll be playing out a lot with it, with a band, so loudness is an issue. I'm playing through a Telecaster and I really want that classic clean, and wet, splashy reverb. What do you guys think I should get?
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HBkahuna
Joined: Mar 02, 2006
Posts: 1778
Star, Idaho. Formerly lived in Surf City USA.
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 01:14 PM
If you want splashy reverb, get a Fender reverb tank first. Even a solid state amp will sound surfy with a good tank. That will make the most difference.
As far as the amps, I don't think you can go wrong with either of the ones you mentioned. It just depends on your needs. Obviously you will get more volume with the twin. Its a nice sounding amp. The deluxe doesn't have quite the ball$ twin but it's a bit lighter. Los Straitjackets use the Deluxe reverb
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scotstandard
Joined: Nov 09, 2008
Posts: 1140
Davenport Iowa
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 01:15 PM
I have played both those RI's and I like the deluxe more than the twin, but there is also a huge diffrence in power! if you want to be balls out loud go with the twin, more moderate volume go with the deluxe.
I allways say your buying dollars are better spent on vintage or older stuff. I dont really care for the RI's and i think they are cheaply made. for the 6 or 7 grab a silverface combo. Pick the one with the right volume for you.
— Give me reverb or give me death!
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Rio
Joined: May 22, 2006
Posts: 500
Hamilton, Ontario
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 01:20 PM
There's tons of info in the forums on both amps, so do a search and you'll find lots of information and opinions.
In basic terms, the issue between the Twin & the Deluxe is weight & volume-- Twin will be loud (85 w) and clean, and weigh a ton, while the Deluxe will be lighter but quieter (20w) and break up way more as you increase the volume
Speaking personally, I'd look for a decent Silver Face Fender rather than a used re-issue, and I'd probably consider a 40w amp (Pro, Vibrolux, Super Reverb even) which would fall somewhere in between the Twin and Deluxe in terms of power. You'll have to do some legwork to find one completely within your budget, but it's certainly not impossible.
Incidentally, a Tele probably wouldn't be the guitar of choice for most people here playing surf, although with a Bigsby, there's no reason it wouldn't work.
Good luck.
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Rio
Joined: May 22, 2006
Posts: 500
Hamilton, Ontario
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 01:22 PM
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WR
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 3832
netherlands
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 01:28 PM
one more vote for the silverface fender. are you playing lead or backing?
though a reverb tank is ' that' surfsound, Ivge seen quite a few bands recently which used the onboard of silverface fenders and sounded great.
— Rules to live by #314:
"When in Italy, if the menu says something's grilled, don't assume it is."
https://www.facebook.com/The-Malbehavers-286429584796173/
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thewrays
Joined: Jan 04, 2009
Posts: 5
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 01:29 PM
I'm playing backup.. thanks again guys for the replies!
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Rio
Joined: May 22, 2006
Posts: 500
Hamilton, Ontario
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 01:56 PM
thewrays
I'm playing backup..
The lack of a whammy on the typical Tele would be less of an issue if you're playing rythm rather than lead, although a little whammy on rythm can be cool in the right place, too... Or, you can always bend the neck instead...LOL
— http://www.facebook.com/?sk=lf#!/rockinrio.delrosa
http://www.facebook.com/?sk=lf#!/TheHighTides
http://www.facebook.com/?sk=lf#!/pages/The-Blue-Demons
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eddiekatcher
Joined: Mar 14, 2006
Posts: 2778
Atlanta, GA
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 05:08 PM
My vote is Twin Reverb. For surf most of us prefer a big fat clean sound. The Deluxe Reverb is a great amp, but if you are trying to keep up with a hard hitting drummer, you'd be a much happier camper with more clean power when ya want it.
I have acutally played through both RI's and I was stunned with the reverb that came out of that RI Twin Reverb. If I used one as my only surf amp I could get by just fine without a tank. The silverface ones are the best value and the '68's were very close to the blackface ones so many of us lust over. As a matter of fact. My first Twin Reverb was a '65 that I bought new in '65. In '68 I needed more volume so I bought a new '68 so I could play out of both of them. I kept that '68 for a LONG time. I swapped it for a Mesa Boogie which was an awful mistake. Anyway my primary Surf amp from 1997 on was a '68 Dual Showman Reverb until just last year when I started "collecting" 6G series blonde amps.....
Also the older P to P amps are MUCH easier to service.
ed
— Traditional........speak softly and play through a big blonde amp. Did I mention that I still like big blonde amps?
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thewrays
Joined: Jan 04, 2009
Posts: 5
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 07:53 PM
Really great and helpful tips guys. I really appreciate it. I dont want to sound like a lame-o.. but like I said.. I'm a little new to this. What is the difference between the Fender Twin Silverface and the Twin Reissue?
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DannySnyder
Joined: Mar 02, 2006
Posts: 11077
Berkeley, CA
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 08:01 PM
How loud would you say your drummer is? That's often the deciding factor for how much wattage you need.
— Danny Snyder
"With great reverb comes great responsibility" - Uncle Leo
I am now playing trumpet with Prince Buster tribute band 'Balzac'
Playing keys and guitar with Combo Tezeta
Formerly a guitarist in The TomorrowMen and Meshugga Beach Party
Latest surf project - Now That's What I Call SURF
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Surfgitar
Joined: Mar 16, 2007
Posts: 1342
Ft. Lauderdale, Florida
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 08:01 PM
I also voted for the twin. I play through a rebuilt '65 and really like the versatility. As Eddie pointed out, we also have a hard hitting drummer and I can keep up with his volume.
— CUTBACK
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Jon
Joined: Mar 15, 2006
Posts: 1076
Columbus, OH
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 09:46 PM
I think that the twin reverb is pretty much a perfect amp.
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LHR
Joined: Aug 23, 2006
Posts: 2123
The jungle
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 10:01 PM
Spend the same and find a non-master volume silverface Twin Reverb, of course. But if you gotta have a new one (I understand, new stuff, it's cool) then try the Twin Reverb Custom 15 before you buy.
— SSIV
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RobbieReverb
Joined: Feb 28, 2006
Posts: 2389
San Jose, Ca.
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 10:05 PM
thewrays
Really great and helpful tips guys. I really appreciate it. I dont want to sound like a lame-o.. but like I said.. I'm a little new to this. What is the difference between the Fender Twin Silverface and the Twin Reissue?
I'm no expert, but here is my 2 cents worth....
Silverface Fenders are post-CBS handwired amplifiers that generally sound great. They are still considered good values. In a Siverface amp, you can generally get a hand-wired "boutique" quality amp for the price of a reissue. Because they been around for 35-40 years, a lot of them show significant wear. But handwired amps like this will last virtually forever. When repairs are needed, it is an easier process diagnosing the problem, and of replacing parts than it is for modern circuit-board amps. The new Fender reissues have circuit boards that generally fail more easilly, are tougher to diagnose, and generally require an expensive change-out of the circuit board (as opposed to a bad cap or resister in a hand-wired amp). A Silverface Fender amp can be fairly easilly modified to pre-CBS ("Golden-Era") blackface specs. But know that not all Silverface Fenders are gems. Some of the later (mid to late 70's) master volume models are generally considered to lack good tone. Avoid them. Many Silverface (and Blackface) amps have been modified for Marshall-type tone. In general, avoid Fender amps modified in any way other than a "black-face" mod. Be careful in buying used amplifiers, especially bought long distance, without being able to see the amp before purchasing. There are a lot of experts on this stuff at this site, who would probably help guide you through the process. Buying a used amp is more work than buying a new one off of a showroom floor, but the extra effort is worth it. Good luck with your hunt.
Bob
— Bob
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eddiekatcher
Joined: Mar 14, 2006
Posts: 2778
Atlanta, GA
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Posted on Jan 04 2009 10:30 PM
The main differences between the original Twin Reverbs and the reissues is that the original amps were hand wired point to point using wires. The reissues are made using printed circuit boards, computer controlled parts insertion, and wave soldering machines. Also the RI's have better speakers than the originals had. I blew the pee out of my speakers in the '60s but haven't blown any of the modern Fender speakers built by Eminence.
Most players feel the original amps (AB-763 and AB-568) were more musical sounding and very friendly to play. A lot of us old timers believe that the modern amps built on circuit boards sound cold and sterile. In all fairness, the modern amps may prove to be more reliable than the originals due to their modern assembly methods, particularly the very accurately controlled component insertion and wave soldering.
However, when and if you need to get a modern amp repaired, be prepared to chuck out the cash as they ain't easy to fix. One other thing is that if the re-issues are using the same printed circuit board input jacks that the re-issue tank uses, it is an accident waiting to happen. Step on a cord plugged in and your amp may just quit working.
I had both a '93 Super Amp and a '93 Concert amp and I liked them both. Not a really deep reverb on either, but ok. One day I opened one of them up to adjust the bias as it had always run pretty hot, and when I looked at that mess.......I thought to myself, " crap on this" and sold them both.
Everything is a trade off. If you buy an early amp and take care of it, it will probably increase in value over the years. If you buy a new RI, you can kiss three or four hundred buck away as they seem to have only a moderate resale value. I now have mostly old amps as I love to get my soldering iron hot and spend way too much time tweaking on them.
Good hunting! I remember getting my first good amp, a Fender Super Reverb for Christmas 1964! Boy did that improve my outlook on life!
Reverbs,
ed
— Traditional........speak softly and play through a big blonde amp. Did I mention that I still like big blonde amps?
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TropicsHenri
Joined: Jan 14, 2009
Posts: 5
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Posted on Jan 14 2009 09:25 AM
Funnily enough I'm in the same boat right now.
I've just joined the forum after reading the thread on Silverface Twin and Deluxe Reverb. I've tried the Deluxe Reverb and loved it but I am really keen on trying a Silverface. I've been offered Silverface Twin at a decent price but it's the 135W version with master volume.
A lot of places I've researched on the net warn away from these but how do they compare against the Reissue Deluxe Reverbs for example? I'd mainly be looking for a clean tone, nothing excessively bright, and use a OD pedal to bring some grit.
I think it's worth my while to try a 135W Silverface isn't it? I should be able to do an A/B test against a Deville which should tell me all I need to know. I'll keep hunting to see if a 100W comes up.
Anyone here have a 135W and not been happy?
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MadScientist
Joined: Jan 17, 2008
Posts: 2188
Atlanta, GA
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Posted on Jan 14 2009 09:33 AM
I love my 135W Master Volume Twin, so I say go for it, especially if the price is right. Many might disagree, but it's all in the ear of the beholder. A DeVille is a completely different kind of amp. Way more crunchy, breaks up early. Great sounding, but for different stuff. I have both, and enjoy them, but my Twin is my main, with my 100W/25W Red Knob Showman being a solid second.
Welcome aboard by the way!
—
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WaimeaBay
Joined: Jul 05, 2006
Posts: 969
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Posted on Jan 14 2009 09:38 AM
Are there any upgrades you can do with the Twin Reverb amp? Like Tube Swaps.
I think the Twin is a good choice if you are going to play other styles. However, I have heard that the distortion channel is weak and you might need a pedal (I am no expert on the amp, so don't quote me.)
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TropicsHenri
Joined: Jan 14, 2009
Posts: 5
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Posted on Jan 14 2009 09:51 AM
Hey MadScientist!,
Thanks for the response! I've read the Silverface is all about clean but does it still keep some body to it if used in conjunction with an OD pedal? I do play a lot of Alternative stuff and post-rockish material. I like a tone with a lot of mid and nothing excessively bright.
I found that too with the Devilles - You start hammering away with some chords and the tubes can kick in quite quickly. Lovely amp though.
WaimeaBay - I've also read that the Silverface can be blackfaced but is a lot trickier with the 135W models due to a change in the Bias structure for the tubes. Don't quote me on this but I think the Blackface work with a bias pot while the Silverface have a balance bias which is a lot harder to set correctly. Like I said, I'm not a tech expert but I've heard bits and pieces about this model.
I'm really excited to try a Silverface - Love the look, hoping I love the sound. As a vintage amp, I think it would be a better investment for me over a Fender Reissue.
I just want to be careful with my money and invest it properly - I am thinking long term here.
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