big_papu
Joined: May 17, 2006
Posts: 657
Buenos Aires
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Posted on Sep 11 2008 09:47 PM
kenposurf
When I played in a blues band there often was much competition between guitar players..cutting heads kinda thing...there were also lots of guys who really just love the style and want to see it grow in popularity and are willing to lend a hand and an ear to players coming up. I see many on this site that are willing to also help and teach each other...I've been working on a Strat modification and Mel from MBP has been a great help by sharing things he's learned along the way. I digress...when playing blues one can slide in and out of key at times and get away with it the "off note" being treated as a passing tone. Now if we take a simple melody..say Mary Had A Little Lamb...pretty basic right but play any wrong note at it's going to be very easy to hear the mistake. Much surf music is based on a melody with little or no room for improv so precision is key.
yeah, but is great that, if you forget the "real" melody line, you can do other melody line with the scale of the key that you are playing.......and nobody notice that you forget the line............people said "you play the song different.......sounds great !!"
— El Papu & los Fantasticos Reverberantes
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Mel
Joined: Feb 25, 2008
Posts: 321
Canada's Wet Coast
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Posted on Sep 11 2008 09:48 PM
big_papu
JakeDobner
Speaking of heart...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AoH-IxvKEA
yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeech........I wanna die !
Well, that video scarred me for life too so you aren't the only one big_papu..:-)
— Mel
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big_papu
Joined: May 17, 2006
Posts: 657
Buenos Aires
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Posted on Sep 11 2008 09:54 PM
Mel
big_papu
JakeDobner
Speaking of heart...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AoH-IxvKEA
yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeech........I wanna die !
Well, that video scarred me for life too so you aren't the only one big_papu..:-)
— El Papu & los Fantasticos Reverberantes
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Icetech
Joined: Dec 16, 2006
Posts: 892
Macomb Mich
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Posted on Sep 11 2008 09:59 PM
"OK Zak, .........you WIN !!!!!
I go to start to forget all the minor melodic scales and all the 7, m7 , 6, + and - chords that i know..........just to be a SURF guitarist "
Actually... you didn't need them in the first place.... doing things the hard way son.... drunk bald and musically talented is no way to play surf....
— I wanna play just like him when i grow up...
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big_papu
Joined: May 17, 2006
Posts: 657
Buenos Aires
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Posted on Sep 11 2008 10:05 PM
Icetech
"OK Zak, .........you WIN !!!!!
I go to start to forget all the minor melodic scales and all the 7, m7 , 6, + and - chords that i know..........just to be a SURF guitarist "
Actually... you didn't need them in the first place.... doing things the hard way son.... drunk bald and musically talented is no way to play surf....
mmmmmmmmmmmm..................... you can use those things for not write eternally songs in the I - IV - V patern, and that doesn´t mean that you have to be Yngwie
— El Papu & los Fantasticos Reverberantes
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00Diablo
Joined: Mar 15, 2006
Posts: 135
Alameda, CA/Las Vegas, NV
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Posted on Sep 12 2008 02:39 AM
A lot of what make surf music great is the tone, texture, and atmosphere of the sound. The energy and dynamics, the spaces between notes. The feeling and mood surf music can evoke is what gives it it's own unique style - not chordal harmony or melodic complexity.
Mastering some of these subtleties of technique and feel can be challenging for any guitarist. I find it often takes more focus and commitment to stay musical and keep the feeling going when playing simply and cleanly - although the reverb does help!
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lonecat
Joined: Jun 09, 2008
Posts: 65
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Posted on Sep 12 2008 05:20 PM
My friend Tom is a schooled classical guitarist, with the posture and the stool and the manicured nails and the correct hand positions and the black suit and on and on. It's amazing to watch and amazing to listen to, and I could never play 99% of that stuff. I'm absolutely floored whenever I get the opportunity to see him play.
Yet he comes to my place...I'll be jamming away with the reverb and the amp cranked and he will beat himself up because he _cannot _tremolo pick,in fact he totally sucks when playing with a pick at all, it's completely alien to him. He's tried for years to do what most surf guitarists take for granted,and it frustrates the hell out of him.
Tom says when he tries to play Miserlou it's hard...I say playing Pagannini is hard.... In a lot of ways it's all relative.
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WaimeaBay
Joined: Jul 05, 2006
Posts: 969
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Posted on Sep 12 2008 06:00 PM
All I can say on this topic is that I think there are some really talented people to come down the surf guitar pipeline. Players good enough to turn the heads of those who play other genres.
I also think that many players of surf music were heavily influenced by the instro genre ala The Shadows, Ventures, Chet Atkins and such. Instro players have to have some talent or they are in the wrong business.
One thing I would be critical about playing surf is that it may be easy to hide behind heavy reverb, just like a player can hide behind heavy distortion. A cranked Fender guitar through a reverb tank and tube amp sounds pretty darn good, no matter what your skill level is.
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JoshHeartless
Joined: Jun 17, 2006
Posts: 1010
Bay City, Michigan
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Posted on Sep 12 2008 08:46 PM
J_Razor
I believe that Carl played on every BB album, if not every song, untill his untimely passing. He was the only member of the group to do so.
that is quite untrue.
even by Surfin' U.S.A.,(the album) Brian had already started using studio musicians. on Surfin' U.S.A.(the song) Carl didn't play either rhythm nor lead. however, on Shut Down, he played lead guitar (with David Marks playing that little lead lick in the very end of the song...)
on pet sounds Carl merely contributed vocals and the guitar track in "that's not me"
it is quite possibly that Carl contributed a bit more instrument tracks after the Smile sessions, i think after that they didn't rely on the Wrecking Crew as much, of course this i don't know as Smile, to me, is the last listenable Beach Boys album, i know this because i have heard many bootlegs of the original sessions.
— The Tremblors on Facebook!
The Tremblors on MySpace!
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Carrie
Joined: Sep 13, 2008
Posts: 5
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Posted on Sep 13 2008 07:48 AM
JoshHeartless
J_Razor
I believe that Carl played on every BB album, if not every song, untill his untimely passing. He was the only member of the group to do so.
that is quite untrue.
even by Surfin' U.S.A.,(the album) Brian had already started using studio musicians. on Surfin' U.S.A.(the song) Carl didn't play either rhythm nor lead.
Actually, you are wrong. Carl Wilson and David Marks played lead and rhythm on Surfin' USA. The only studio musician brought in BEFORE David left at the end of 1963 was Hal Blaine on drums on Our Car Club and he over-dubbed timbales on Hawaii and a drummer named Frank DeVito played drums on Surfin' USA because Dennis had a broken ankle.
Surfin USA is all Beach Boys on guitar!!!!
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JoshHeartless
Joined: Jun 17, 2006
Posts: 1010
Bay City, Michigan
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Posted on Sep 13 2008 09:24 AM
Carrie
JoshHeartless
J_Razor
I believe that Carl played on every BB album, if not every song, untill his untimely passing. He was the only member of the group to do so.
that is quite untrue.
even by Surfin' U.S.A.,(the album) Brian had already started using studio musicians. on Surfin' U.S.A.(the song) Carl didn't play either rhythm nor lead.
Actually, you are wrong. Carl Wilson and David Marks played lead and rhythm on Surfin' USA. The only studio musician brought in BEFORE David left at the end of 1963 was Hal Blaine on drums on Our Car Club and he over-dubbed timbales on Hawaii and a drummer named Frank DeVito played drums on Surfin' USA because Dennis had a broken ankle.
Surfin USA is all Beach Boys on guitar!!!!
from Carol Kaye's official website:
Surfin' USA - The Beach Boys (Elec. Rhythm Guitar, Billy Strange on Solo Lead Guitar - Union contract)
http://www.carolkaye.com/www/library/guitarhits.htm
there was, at one point in time, the Surfin' U.S.A. instrumental track posted on YouTube, since has been taken down, but states all of the studio musicians used on that specific song.
— The Tremblors on Facebook!
The Tremblors on MySpace!
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Carrie
Joined: Sep 13, 2008
Posts: 5
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Posted on Sep 13 2008 10:07 AM
And her site is wrong! 100%, without question WRONG!!!
I believe Carol may have played on a cover of Surfin' USA that she could be confusing with the Beach Boys original version. But I have a copy of the AFM Local 47 session log with both David and Carl's name on it...not Carol's. And multiple first hand accounts from people who were there!
David Marks and Frankie DeVito only met once at the Surfin' USA session and hadn't spoken or heard of each other since that day...and in 2 conversations with 2 different people 45 years later, both unaware they were being asked the same questions, had identical stories - including specifics like positioning of equipment.
Before Surfin USA, The Beach Boys hadn't broken into the National scene yet...there is no reason Capitol would PAY union wages to session players on a band with an unproven track record when they were a more than qualified self-contained band. In fact, The Beach Boys were booked on most of their early dates because they could not only play their own sets, but would double as a back up band for the other singing acts on the bill...imagine The Beach Boys backing Sam Cooke? They did.
Session players were only used on the early songs because of injury or if there wasn't anyone in the band would could play that part - like Mike's sister on harp. But the whole idea Brian used session players from the start is an out-dated myth.
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JakeDobner
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 12159
Seattle
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Posted on Sep 13 2008 11:07 AM
I have even bigger news that none of you know. I have a session log from the studio they recorded it at. None of the Beach Boys are listed as the singers. There is only one singer listed who sang all the parts. And his name is Ronnie James Dio. Fact.
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Icetech
Joined: Dec 16, 2006
Posts: 892
Macomb Mich
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Posted on Sep 13 2008 11:11 AM
JakeDobner
I have even bigger news that none of you know. I have a session log from the studio they recorded it at. None of the Beach Boys are listed as the singers. There is only one singer listed who sang all the parts. And his name is Ronnie James Dio. Fact.
BB wishes they had dio's vocal talent... being 3'4" tall he packs alot of punch...
— I wanna play just like him when i grow up...
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JakeDobner
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 12159
Seattle
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Posted on Sep 13 2008 11:15 AM
I just did a youtube search for Dio and it does alternate searches and one of the other searches was for "God". Since English is the only language on the planet I must conclude that Dio is the messiah.
This will convert everbody from Surf rock to Dio Rock.
http://nz.youtube.com/watch?v=szcVWTyrq_Q&feature=related
Middle of the page
http://nz.youtube.com/results?search_query=dio&search_type=&aq=f
Last edited: Sep 13, 2008 13:18:04
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Klas
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 2310
Stockholm, Sweden
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Posted on Sep 13 2008 12:31 PM
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emerpus01
Joined: Aug 13, 2007
Posts: 28
Queens, New York
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Posted on Sep 13 2008 12:45 PM
Mel
big_papu
JakeDobner
Speaking of heart...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AoH-IxvKEA
yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeech........I wanna die !
Well, that video scarred me for life too so you aren't the only one big_papu..:-)
Any one up for doing a surf/instrumental cover of that one?
Just kidding!!!
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Ruhar
Joined: Jun 21, 2007
Posts: 3909
San Diego, CA
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Posted on Sep 13 2008 12:49 PM
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CaptainSpringfield
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 4387
Under the Sun
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Posted on Sep 13 2008 01:05 PM
Vaya Con Dio, baby.
-Warren
— That was excessively violent and completely unnecessary. I loved it.
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JakeDobner
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 12159
Seattle
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Posted on Sep 13 2008 01:17 PM
CaptainSpringfield
Vaya Con Dio, baby.
-Warren
Indeed.
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