butchdelux
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 250
Port Fierce, Florida
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Posted on Jul 12 2006 01:34 PM
Ok, I'll be the first to admit that I'm a novice at the whole recording process, but I have done a bit of net scouring, and I have a very general idea of very basic techniques when it comes to recording, in general. That said...how much of that goes out the proverbial window when talking about recording surf instros?
For example - Is close-mic'ing more/less effective than room-mic'ing when you're talking about adding a ton of reverb to the guitar tone? Bass - direct-to-board or mic'ed cabinet? How many tracks do you guys record on to get "that" sound? (There are more questions than this - just not sure how to word them).
I realize that alot of this is going to be subjective to ones tastes and ears, and may seem like a pretty open-ended question. I'd just be really interested to hear how y'all pull it off.
Thanks.
— The Disasternauts
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krakatoa
Joined: Jun 15, 2006
Posts: 30
cleveland , oh
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Posted on Jul 12 2006 08:17 PM
hiya butch. I am also a newbie at recording. I've been tinkering around with my pro tools for a few months now. (Still kinda over my head) I think that the mic placement is just something you have to play around with. You have to figure in how big/soundproof the room is. Tinker with the volume on the amp and the mic. channel. I JUST got my fender deluxe reverb amp and haven't even had a chance to play around with it and pro tools(I believe you saw my problem child,yeah, she's the reason)But I did use my marshall and i really didn't have to move the mic too much because I've got a 4X12 cabinet on it and my "studio"(modified spare bedroom)isn't very big.Needless to say it really fills the room with sound.It takes a few tries at getting the right sound, but it comes. But with my deluxe verb(r.i. unfortunately) being that it only has 1 speaker it may make a difference in mic placement(overhead, in front, in a beer mug,etc.)
Even though he's not surf, I read a little about Jimmie Page. When he would record and he'd just spend days moving the mic around. He'd have it close to his amp, then across the room, and sometimes down the hall.(of course they rented palatial mansions in the English countryside) I guess , like you said, it's a matter of preferance, but just tinker with it and see what you like. that of course is my way, I'm no pro. What you Do have to do , is just have fun with it.
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Kawentzmann
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 1060
Berlin, Germany
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Posted on Jul 13 2006 03:16 AM
close miking:
I think that is personal preference. The directness of close miking can be an advantage. I prefer the âsizeâ of a guitar miked with at least a foot of air between the speaker and the mike.
direct to board or amped bass:
I use both. To get it sit well at the bottom of the track you almost always have to tweak the sound with eq anyway. You hardly want room on the bass, and the purity of a direct recorded bass is always better then a mediocre miked one.
how many tracks:
Honestly, to get a real surf sound, give each instrument one track. If you know what you are doing printing the band to 4 tr, 2 tr or mono would be very sixties.
my 2 cents
KK
— The Exotic Guitar of Kahuna Kawentzmann
You can get the boy out of the Keynes era, but you can’t get the Keynes era out of the boy.
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Redd_Tyde
Joined: Apr 23, 2006
Posts: 260
Oceanside, CA
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Posted on Jul 14 2006 06:53 PM
Recertly I recorded my Prosonic in isolation both. The amp was placed ontop a Auralex isolation board and the mic was a condenser mic about 6 inches off the right speaker. Anyways like mentioned before, mic'ing is about doing the takes and moving the mic until the sound is where you want it.
The thing that amazed me was how the amps own reverb became huge on full when it was placed on the iso-board. I recorded with a MIJ Jaguar with both pick-ups selected. It was almost a drippy as using a tank. I ended up using most of my scratch tracks as the final takes on the clean side.
Might of got lucky this day, but not complainning at all.
Redd Tyde
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Fez
Joined: Mar 22, 2006
Posts: 197
Florida
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Posted on Aug 02 2006 11:45 PM
What I have found in my recent recording is that close mic'ing gives a good sound... but you need to consider the size of the speaker that you are mic'ing when you set everything up...
The general rule that I use now is the larger the speaker the farther back you would want to get...
I've found that if you mic too close on a large speaker (15") you lose a good bit of your reverb... back the mic up, and it's all good!!!
If you are recording a live performance you might want to cheat the mic back towards the amp to get more seperation between the instruments... It's just something that you have to tinker with...
All of this is assuming that you are recording with decent mic's too... They really make a difference...
Fez
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MPoppitt
Joined: Apr 23, 2006
Posts: 133
Austin TEXAS!
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Posted on Aug 03 2006 11:35 AM
One thing I've found in recording surf guitar, especially if you are the only guitar player, is close micing an amp as your only guitar track never sounds 'big'. I close mic the amp, and use a room mike at least 5 feet away from the amp into 2 seperate tracks, and mess with the panning when I go to mix. Don't add fake reverb to the mix, because it will diminish the tone of your amp's reverb. A little fast stereo delay sometimes sounds cool at mixdown.
I like things live sounding, so I mic the bass if possible, but you can get a decent sound straight in. I like to use overhead mics on the drums, too, to pick up the room sound.
If you are going for that old school sound, then mic everything in an acousticly 'live' room. If you are going for that modern big studio sound, close micing EVERYTHING and lots of effects (compression, verb etc.) at mixdown is the way to go.
In an ideal world my micing would go:
-Lead guitar- 2 mics into 2 tracks, as stated above.
-rythym guitar- 1 close mic
-bass-close mic, with a large condenser mic
-drums- close mic the snare (so I have control of the eq curve at mixdown), close mic bass drum, w/a touch of compression, and two small condensers as stereo overheads.
So, that is 8 tracks total. I can't see why a surf band would need much more....
— 
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dp
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 3546
mojave desert, california
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Posted on Aug 03 2006 12:18 PM
MPoppitt
In an ideal world my micing would go:
-Lead guitar- 2 mics into 2 tracks, as stated above.
-rythym guitar- 1 close mic
-bass-close mic, with a large condenser mic
-drums- close mic the snare (so I have control of the eq curve at mixdown), close mic bass drum, w/a touch of compression, and two small condensers as stereo overheads.
So, that is 8 tracks total. I can't see why a surf band would need much more....
I would agree with your "ideal world" setup, but I'd add a bass DI...
so there would be two bass tracks to work with: a mic'd cab and a direct input. Then I would twidle around with mixing together the two bass tracks into one nice, fat, dynamic bass sound. The mic'd cab provides fullness and "liveness"...the DI adds brighter finger/pick attacks and high-end harmonics and transients.
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WaveOhhh
Joined: Apr 24, 2006
Posts: 236
Plantation, FL
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Posted on Aug 31 2006 01:49 PM
HAs anyone tried this: We took 2 good sounding tube amps, arranged them somewhat diagonally towards each other in an obtuse angle. We split the guitar signal into two and one amp had extra heavy reverb, the other was completely dry. The bleed-through gave the clean some background reverb. We recorded the guitar on two tracks, clean and wet and blended on the board for final mixdown. That way when I did some really fast picking, we punched-up the clean a little to get better articulation but that was only for the fastest passages.
I tried this on stage once and thought it sounded good but was a lot of stuff to lug around.
— What day is Surf Rock's birthday? Looks like Surf Rock and I was born the same year. Maybe we are both Libras?
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DannySnyder
Joined: Mar 02, 2006
Posts: 11053
Berkeley, CA
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Posted on Aug 31 2006 03:25 PM
FinDicator1
.
I tried this on stage once and thought it sounded good but was a lot of stuff to lug around.
Cliff, why don't you try A/B'ing 2 reverb units into 1 amp?
You also have the option then to put them in series and get the ultimate 'Astronauts' level reverb.
— Danny Snyder
"With great reverb comes great responsibility" - Uncle Leo
Playing keys and guitar with Combo Tezeta
Formerly a guitarist in The TomorrowMen and Meshugga Beach Party
Latest surf project - Now That's What I Call SURF
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