News flash:
After some more dialog which got unnecessarily personal and heated, the seller removed his sale of this 63 Ventures model from Reverb. Seems he is now going to question his "authenticator", "CV" (A guess there is that that is Carter Vintage Guitars in Nashville) with regard to the issues raised.
To quote the seller:
"the guitar is on hold until I shake out any potential details."

Well - that certainly is refreshing.

Garrett, I think we popped this guy's balloon.

Semper Fi, Caveat Emptor, or whatever.
J Mo'

Last edited: Jul 08, 2023 17:04:20

The seller verified that he bought the guitar from Carter Vintage in Nashville. He is going to have them "re-authenticate" it. (??!!)
I suggested he get a second and maybe a third appraisal from other dealers.
The price he's asking warrants that - kind of like getting a second or third opinion for a serious medical problem.

He is most unhappy with me. Something I said?
J Mo'

I like Carter Vintage guitars but from experience, I make sure I "trust but verify" with their vintage gear for sale. Back in 2017, I bought what was identified by them as a '62 Fender Reverb Unit, which actually turned out to be a '64 (this was the start of my vintage education). It's a great reverb unit so I can't complain.

I politely informed them that they got the date wrong and they apologized and offered to take it back but I was and still am quite happy with the '64 FRU. Hopefully when putting things up for sale they'll remember to take the time to verify the date if possible. In this case, all they had to do was verify the dated code stamp on the tube chart as well as see the "modern" raised Fender log as opposed to the older flat one. Quite often, the tube chart doesn't stand the test of time and gear use. Unless they can make the time to see if there is any date stamp code on the chassis but that requires a bit more effort to look for it (in amps, anyway).

It was a great lesson learned to be as educated/informed as much as possible when planning to purchase vintage gear. I find vintage gear detective work to be fascinating.

The doofus formerly known as Snorre
Surfysonic on YouTube
World Famous Philistines: 2014 - 2015
K39: 2013 - 2014
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gv9JADQ4ukw

Last edited: Jul 09, 2023 11:02:26

Here ya go, Daniel!

It's in pristine (maybe a bit more dusty) condition. The person that sold it Carter also sold their early Concert amp, also in "museum" condition. Wish I jumped on that back then...love a 4x10 Concert.

The doofus formerly known as Snorre
Surfysonic on YouTube
World Famous Philistines: 2014 - 2015
K39: 2013 - 2014
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gv9JADQ4ukw

Last edited: Jul 10, 2023 07:35:17

Firetone wrote:

After Surfer Joes 2023, I would like to get a Bass VI. But look at this babys price tag..

https://www.dba.dk/elguitar-fender-bass-vi-f/id-1103240299/

And Greetings from Denmark!

I heard more folks at SJ, who wanted to get a Bass VI.

I have a Squier Vintage Modified Bass VI and also a 2013 MIJ Fender VI, which I was able to buy for a very reasonable price in 2019 (given the prices they seem to go for these days).
Like many others here I'd suggest to go for the Squier one, and swap the bridge for a Staytrem.

As for insane prices, here's a nice case to go with your DK110,000 Fender VI: https://www.ebay.nl/itm/126004179945 ;)

Surfin’ Europe – Surf gigs in Europe
The Malbehavers – Instrumental Surf Music from Tilburg (NL)
Tout Tilburg Surft – Malbehavers’ debut EP

JohnnyMosrite wrote:

Regarding the seller of the questionable 1963 Mosrite and Carter Vintage.

The seller has nothing but praise for the place and expects things to be resolved on a professional level. He's been doing business for three decades as well as with Carter Vintage for a long time.

"I am optimistic that this issue can be resolved successfully when considering the bigger picture. I have had a pleasant experience working with CV thus far, and I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt until proven otherwise. Even if challenges arise, I am confident that there are various alternate avenues to achieve a fair resolution."

That last sentence caught my attention. I smell possible lawsuit in the air.
And I found this when I googled Carter Vintage's Return policy:
"DESPITE THE EXCHANGE’S IMPLEMENTATION OF INTERNAL PRODUCT AUTHENTICITY VERIFICATION PROCEDURES AND ITS BEST EFFORTS TO AUTHENTICATE PRODUCT LISTINGS, THE EXCHANGE DOES NOT GUARANTEE THE AUTHENTICITY OF ANY PRODUCT OR THE ACCURACY OF ANY LISTING."

This poor guy is in for a hassle - the degree of hassle being directly proportional to the amount he paid.
I think this guitar's authenticity question has hit this guy square in the wallet.
I don't know how long ago this guy bought the thing or how long any "authenticity guarantee" from Carter lasts.
Not a situation I'd like to be in.

He never did remove the three pickguard screws and get the date codes on the pots - a rather simple, straightforward procedure. Too afraid to look? If I were to shell out serious bucks for this guitar, it's the first thing I'd check out.

He also informed me that it is a "special" kind of person (i.e. that more money than brains aspect I mentioned in my initial post) who would want this Mosrite guitar or Don Wilson's guitar and amp rig at close to $40K a pop. I have to agree with him there. I'm happy not to be "special".
But I guess they're out there.

And a bit of irony -
His ad for the 63 Mosrite stated:
"You cannot go wrong with this one"
He's right there. We didn't go wrong; he did.
J Mo'

I think, if it were me, that I’d be getting that authentication from any respected source other than the party I’d purchased it from; that is to say somebody without skin in the game. Of course, this person is probably eager to stack the deck in his favor to avoid reckoning with an inconvenient truth.
Truthfully, a simple comparison with photos of known genuine examples proves the point anyway.
Anyway, apologies for hijacking this thread! As has been pointed out, education is your best insurance policy against losing your hard earned money on gear that isn’t what it purports to be.

Garrett
"I think, if it were me, that I’d be getting that authentication from any respected source other than the party I’d purchased it from; that is to say somebody without skin in the game."
That's exactly what I told him over this past weekend. This guy says he's been in business for 30+ years. How could he have fallen for this?

I'm thinking CV (they aren't cheap in their prices, BTW) probably soaked him for $15K-$20K for this guitar. He probably figured on a quick $10K+ profit but relied on someone else's "authentication" - not the wisest business move when 5 figure goods are involved.
Live and learn - the hard way, sometimes.
And -
I wonder what this guy's authentication and return policy is?
Some hourly time value? All sales final? U.F.O.I.(You f***ing own it)?
Food for thought
J Mo'

Last edited: Jul 10, 2023 15:34:17

Gracias!

Patrick

All,
I looked on Reverb with regard to this seller and his "return policy".
It is:
Used & Vintage Items
Not Returnable

Yet, he will probably seek recompense from Carter Vintage. I had some pity for this guy; now I have none. Typical "rules for thee but not for me" mindset or as I stated earlier - his "policy" is U.F.O.I. I hope CV stonewalls him. As we dish out, so must we be able to take.
I look for balance in the world.

Look for this '63 forgery at a website or vintage guitar show near you.

J Mo'

Last edited: Jul 13, 2023 19:15:02

Dan,
Yes. And this is part of his hot-air soliloquy regarding his silly high prices:
"Regarding pricing, as I mentioned earlier, my extensive experience in dealing with vintage items has shown me that their value can vary greatly compared to standard off the shelf retail items. Numerous factors contribute to determining their worth, and it is not solely reliant on broad customer appeal. What may not be suitable for one person could be a significant find for someone else in a different context of acquiring an item."

"Numerous factors"?? "different context"??!! Hmmm.. what might those be?
Offhand, I can only think it's the "more money than brains" factor I mentioned in my first post.

All IMHO, of course
J Mo'

Last edited: Jul 13, 2023 10:37:46