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SurfGuitar101 Forums » Gear »

Permalink Looking For StayTrem Arm Experiences

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andare wrote:

There's a video by Puisheen for the hammer trick. I don't have a vise so I placed the end of the arm on top of a ledge at an angle and hammered it until it was bent. The bend is visible. As reported above, the arm is easy to insert and pull out, doesn't swing or squeak and I didn't have to squeeze the collet

The offset vibrato is a flawed design for many reasons. I will die on this hill no matter how many people swear by it.

Fender's QC is horrible right now, no way I'm spending 100 Euros on a vibrato only for the arm to be too big.

The Squier unit is cheap and doesn't have enough range but it works for me.

The bridge on my 40th anniversary is very stable. No buzz, no sinking. Absolutely no need for a Staytrem.

I have no doubt aftermarket parts are high quality but I can't afford them so a Squier and some elbow grease have to be enough for me.

I agree with a great deal you say. The collet is an idea that might have looked good on paper, but wasn’t so good in practice. FMIC has obviously lowered their QC standards, of late, and that doesn’t make matters any better. Angela Instruments sells a lot of Offset parts, and they charge extra to physically test that the arm they are selling you fits into the collet. Where I’m concerned, Fender should be ashamed, that they can’t get such a straightforward thing right.

The Squier trem’ that I removed from the CV Jaguar actually worked fairly well. I’m not into heavy trem’ action, so the limited range was not an issue, and the arm was stable, but the action was uneven, and I wanted the lock button, so I swallowed hard and bought the AVRI trem’. I thing that five minutes work with a file and one hammer strike to the arm would have been enough to make it worthwhile to use.

The AVRI trem’ works as well as any I’ve ever owned. It has a taut feel and predictable action. It stacks up well against a Bigsby, and that’s high praise coming from me, because I really like Bigsbys.

The StayTrem arm and collet are not too bad, price wise. Actually, about the same cost as a replacement AVRI collet and arm, from Fender.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

This discussion, or any other on SG101 was hard for me to visualize what all the working parts were about, but now I understand.
For anyone else still trying to grasp the simple mechanism, here are 3 pictures of different types.
The basic principle is a simple collet that the Tremolo arm either screws into, or presses into a friction restraint collet.
The screw-in type will not keep resistance from arm swing as it simply rotates on threads. Same as most Stratocasters.
One could try and foul up the threads with tape or glue to make a tighter fit. But that only lasts a while before tape wears out.

The 2 friction collet designs, AM vintage and Staytrem both have a smooth shaft Tremolo arm to press into the collet.
Fender Vintage uses 4 pronged metal collet which flexes and places friction to keep arm from swinging. The metal requirements for decent long-term use are needed to be made from hardened metal to retain flex memory, much like a quality hardened spring.
The Staytrem design is similar arm press-in fit, but it uses nylon insert sleeve bushing inside the metal sleeve collar for the friction bearing.
One improvement for this type is also no metal to metal contact. But nylon is softer than steel and this too can wear out.

None of the designs are long-term friendly as the imposed friction will wear one or another part out.

The Stratocaster is a design where a hardened steel spring and ball bearing can be placed inside the Tremolo threaded pocket and thrusts pressure upwards to keep arm from swinging. This design is actually the best from Fender as the hardened spring won't wear out.
Perhaps if some aftermarket company came up with the Jazzmaster Jaguar version of the Strat system would be great.

The home-mod solutions to various Tremolo design breakdowns obviously work.
And most players are happy bending metal parts to accomplish increasing the friction to keep arms from flailing about like a helicopter.

Any Low cost Squire owners would agree to not pay a fortune to accomplish a simple solution.
Investment into a higher cost complete tailpiece is one to carefully consider.

STAYTREM
image

FENDER AM Pro
image

FENDER AM Vintage collet

image

Last edited: Apr 30, 2023 08:55:33

Tremolo arms have been an area where a lot of different ideas have been employed, whether by Fender, or other manufacturers. Unfortunately, many of these ideas have not worked all that well in the real world. I’ve seen floppy tremolo arms on all sorts of guitars. Many players have learned to just grab the arm and swivel it into position when they use it, but that doesn’t work for me.

Even a Bigsby can get floppy, but it’s easily corrected by replacing a fiber washer. In the case of Fender trems, Offset or Strat, there are all sorts of fixes. The screw-in arm can work pretty well, although it’s possible for the spring to fall out, so I always kept a few of those springs in my parts box, back when I played Strats.

I don’t know that the collet is not made of spring material, but I strongly suspect that it is not. Springs are not simple things to make. Years ago, I read about how automotive valve springs are manufactured, and it was an incredibly complicated process. OTOH, valve springs can last hundreds of thousands of miles, and they are certainly under more stress than the average whammy bar. I don’t know enough to suggest that a collet made of spring steel would be feasible, but I’d be curious to find out. The cost might be prohibitive, as well.

I think that the StayTrem might be the best solution out there, assuming that the nylon inserts are adequately durable. StayTrem states that these will last for “many years”, so I guess I’ll find out in many years. One of the reasons I started this thread was to hear if anyone had a StayTrem for long enough to have had one wear out. So far, no one has reported having that experience.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

Synchro
I was suggesting that the Fender brand collet is made from hardened metal vs the cheap China metal used on Squire.
I have both and can certainly tell the US Fender is definitely harder.
I was not intending to state that it was technically "spring steel " which is far more advanced process to metal than simple hardening.

You know Synchro, this is a great question for OSG. Many people on there have been using these for years and years. Now I'm curious!

Daniel Deathtide

IceratzSurf wrote:

Synchro
I was suggesting that the Fender brand collet is made from hardened metal vs the cheap China metal used on Squire.
I have both and can certainly tell the US Fender is definitely harder.
I was not intending to state that it was technically "spring steel " which is far more advanced process to metal than simple hardening.

I figured as much. The Squier probably uses the cheapest components they could find. The US made collets I have seem ok, but the handles are a bit iffy.

DeathTide wrote:

You know Synchro, this is a great question for OSG. Many people on there have been using these for years and years. Now I'm curious!

I’ll have to post it there.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

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