Basically what I’m reading throughout this thread is that which we think we need to achieve (sonically) is unattainable.
Whether it’s miserlou, smurf party (the little blue characters) or firewater, just good enough is all you’re going to get.
The sound (imo) is a part of the whole package, equipment, technique, and recording, and nothing available to us today will yield the same result, especially live.
Or am I reading this whole thread wrong?

Chippertheripper wrote:

Basically what I’m reading throughout this thread is that which we think we need to achieve (sonically) is unattainable.
Whether it’s miserlou, smurf party (the little blue characters) or firewater, just good enough is all you’re going to get.
The sound (imo) is a part of the whole package, equipment, technique, and recording, and nothing available to us today will yield the same result, especially live.
Or am I reading this whole thread wrong?

no, i think it can be replicated but needs to be understood first. referring to the sound we listen to on the recordings. it is just not simply “turn the reverb on”, the 3 guitars have to work together to make the sound, plus the bass, plus the drums.
what equipment we have today different from 1963? we all have brownface amps and the same guitars they had. so everything can be done.
but of course each one of us has a sound in his hands and his own technique.

Lorenzo "Surfer Joe" Valdambrini
(www.surfmusic.net)

I don’t know Lorenzo...from the videos I’ve watched of what they were doing, they had one dude playing lead, one playing the rhythm chords, and one dude bringing the booch, or drip as you guys like to call it.
I’m still going with the theory that it’s a sum of the parts.
Yes, Ivan, it is fun to try. It’s just as fun to discuss, right wrong, or indifferent.

surferjoemusic wrote:

no, i think it can be replicated but needs to be understood first. referring to the sound we listen to on the recordings. it is just not simply “turn the reverb on”,

Surfer Joe, don't get mad at what I am about to write. My words are not personal nor an attack on your opinion which I respect based on your knowledge of the genre, but one which I strongly disagree.

I get a laugh when musicians will look at the settings of a particular artists equipment, then, thinking they can replicate the same sound by merely adjusting the same setting on their personal equipment, go home and do just that.

It is not that easy. If it were, this Thread and others like it would not be active.

I jam with Dale frequently. Sometimes we blast though our Showmans, sometimes a BF Twin or other amp. Dick's sound will change, depending on the amp, where it is located such as in the den, in the hangar or patio.

I have a 62 Showman, 62 Reveb and 59/60 Strat. I always have to change the settings at different gigs to get a sound I can live with. It is rarely, if ever the same. The temperature of the day, my attitude can alter the sound just as the setting on my amp can.

Because I prefer to be on a dance floor jitterbuggin' rather that on a stage performing, my music preferences lean toward 50's R&B. However, because I was in my early teens when the 1st Wave hit, I tend to blend the 1st Wave West Coast instrumental rock sound to my repertoire. The foregoing represents a couple, of a myriad of other reasons I am never invited to surf rock shows. Did I mention attitude!!!

Dale showed me most of my licks beginning in 1960 when I initially picked up a guitar. My learning continues with him as it did last weekend. I have the same equipment as him, taught by him as a youngster, but I do not sound like him, not even close.

Sound emanating from a guitar, amp, reverb or any other gadget is akin to fingerprints: there are no exact duplicates. Why not? Maybe pressure on an individuals hand against the strings, wrist movement, picking style, pick, attitude. In my opinion all of those factors will affect tone more than equipment.

That said, the right tech, room, equipment, time, temperature, can and will have a big effect on tone.

What all that means is no one can re-create the exact tone of another that was recorded. There are just too darn many outside variables that are obstacles in doing so.

If Surfer Jose or anyone else opines my position is not only inaccurate, but is dead wrong, now is the time to support your position. Here is an assignment grasshoppers which should keep this Thread going on til summer and you won't have to kick off your shoes like Ivan did, but maybe it may help, so feel free to do so. Ivan, I'm just trying to add levity to this post, so, please don't get mad at me for referring to you.

Ok, now follow Ivan's lead and plug your guitar into the amp of your choice, then try to replicate Del Tone 45 Miserlou or anything on the Astronauts first album. Post it when you are done.

This should be a fun assignment.

Maybe the Tiki guy will give the winner some tickets or a gig invite to next years SG convention. But that is contingent on the sound reproduced being exact: no just abouts.

surferjoemusic wrote:

do you have my record with the kilaueas? i think i have replicated pretty well all the parts. i tried with the sound, but that can be arguable, but CERTAINLY the 3 guitars have to work together in the mix and the lead has very little reverb. this work is really the most important thing in their band sound. this is what i mean when i say that the sound has to be understood first, before checking the gear or the settings. they were 5 people on stage... not just 1.

so yes, i think like you: it’s the sum of all the parts that make that sound.

I don’t, but I’ll be certain t check it out post/haste.
Edit: grasshopper is 70’s kungfu movie for “student”.

Last edited: Dec 16, 2017 15:52:42

sent.
I also found that record on iTunes. In my mind, that's exactly what it would sound like if it were recorded today. It's nice and crisp, and the fidelity is there.
It's pretty easy to see, though, that it's not a 50+ year old recording. I don't know what youse were going for when you set out to make it, but it sounds legit.

*surferjoemusic wrote

well being defined a “student” is quite funny to me
but that’s right as we never finish learning in this life.

I think when he calls people grasshoppers, it’s more than just suggesting that we are students but to establish himself as a “master”

He played back then. He still hangs out with Dick Dale. Pretty cool, actually! But until I hear a live performance or listen to a record, then it’s all just talk.

I can hear, very clearly, that Lorenzo has come VERY close to that sound. Closer than anyone else I’ve heard. He’s certainly no mere student.

The context of “grasshopper” is a master imparting wisdom to a student. If you didn’t intend such a meaning, use a different term. Simple.

Also, I stated your playing history and relationship with Mr Dale was pretty cool.

Relax.

And all this time I thought Surf was about having fun playing cool music.

Old punks never die... They just become surf rockers.

surferjoemusic wrote:

LeeVanCleef wrote:

And all this time I thought Surf was about having fun playing cool music.

why?

Sorry. That was a somewhat sarcastic comment about the general tone this thread is taking.

Old punks never die... They just become surf rockers.