No difference between a '61 and '63. In 1960 there was a slightly different version with different tubes that is quite rare. Perhaps you are asking the differences between brownface and blackface?

So, the 1960-'63 Showmans are from the Brownface era of Fender amps. Careful not to call them blondes, as there are blonde blackface amps. (there are only two amps that had blackfaces and retained the brown circuit and these are very rare). 1964-67 are the Blackface era.

Brownface amps have more mids to them, a thicker tone, break up slightly earlier than black face amps, and have different tremolo circuits. Also, the Brownface has a 'presence' knob(reduces the gain in the output stage and just cleans the amp up/makes it 'tighter').

Blackface amps are described as cleaner and with more sparkle.

My attempts at the why these things are different(I am not an technical expert on amps).

The tone stack/circuit changed. More of the blackface amps circuit goes to ground(the added mids tone control) and this thins the amp out and puts focus on the 'scooped mids' you may have read about.

It uses harmonic tremolo(it pulses the lows and highs offset). The optical tremolo of the blackface does the entire signal at once. The optical trem can also be kind of weak sounding, where the harmonic tremolo is very full sounding. Blackface trem can sound awesome, but does need maintenance over time.

Same amp, same color tolex. Oxblood grille '60-62, wheat in '63. Some wheat in 1962 but it is rare and I don't think Showman amps ever got gold grille until blackface when they started using the smooth blonde.

Very few out there, very expensive. Good luck if you choose to pursue one.

Yep, VERY hard to get. It has 6L6GC power tubes.

Last edited: Sep 06, 2015 01:31:03

So is only a 6G14 considered as brownface, or is the 6G15A also a 'brownface,?

The Hicadoolas

Ups. Typo. 6G14A

The Hicadoolas

How different are the 3 circuits? Assuming I stumble upon a Brownface will I still be searching for the coveted 6G14?
Is there a noticeable difference between 6G14 and 6G14a?

I guess I'm lucky because I have a 6G14 Dual Showman, a VERY early (12/61 KK date code) one. I've had it for nearly 15 years, courtesy of my pal Eddie Katcher. Until reading this post I wasn't aware that there was much difference between the 14 and the 14-A.

I also have a '67 Dual Showman blackface that Eddie K recovered in Blonde for me back in the Dark Ages. Back then Larry Rodgers ( www.rodgersamplifiers.com/ ) was making perfect reproductions of brown faceplates for the later blackface Showmans and Bandmasters...before the Fender lawyers put an end to that.

So, do they sound different? Yes!

But they both sound great. The brownface and blackface Showman sounds have already been described accurately here so I won't repeat what has already been said other than that the simple version is that the brownface is warmer and more "musical" while the blackface is more aggressive with more headroom before what others are calling breakup. But neither amp really breaks up like a Princeton or Deluxe Reverb on "8". A brownface Showman when cranked is more of a "pushed" sound (which is a good thing!), not really classic distortion. It is easier to hear than to try to explain.

The volume and tone controls on the brownface amps I've played through are also noticeably more linear than the ones on the blackface amps.

When I was gigging regularly with the X-Rays back in the late '90's - early 2000's, both these amps were used primarily for bass and they worked very well for that. I liked the '67 blackface better for playing live and the brownface was better in the studio. Either amp would work fine in either setting, though.

For guitar use, the tube-driven tremolo in the brownface Dual Showman and especially in my '62 Pro amp is as good as tremolo gets. No pedal I've tried is quite the same but some of the boutique ($$$) ones can get pretty close. I'm not a pedal-flavor-of-the-week kind of guy, my old Demeter Tremulator is a very good trem pedal. But when I need to record tremolo, out comes the brownface Pro amp. That thing plus a Fender tank may be the perfect studio amplifier for instrumental surf music.

Not sure why I'm doing this but very soon I'll be converting the Dual Showman cabinet from bass use back to guitar specs with a pair of freshly reconed D-130F's. I no longer need a big-ass guitar rig but nothing else sounds like a cranked Dual Showman with a pair of JBL's and a Fender reverb tank. It will be fun to light it up occasionally to rattle the windows and watch the pictures on the wall rotate.

Jack Booth
(aka WoodyJ)

The Mariners (1964-68, 1996-2005), 2025
The Hula Hounds (1996-2000)
The X-Rays (1997-2004)
The Surge! (2004, 2011-2012)
Various non-surf bands that actually made money (1978-1990)

Last edited: Sep 06, 2015 21:40:02

Thanks Jack for the benefit of your post, great reading. Also, thank you both for the fine descriptive terms; as mentioned, easier heard than described.

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

I refer to that "pushed" sound as urgency. The main thing that I've noticed between the "61" and "62" Showman electronics were two fold. Leo changed the 500K volume pot to 1 meg, maybe to increase input circuit gain and maybe to help with high frequency response and he changed the values in the presence circuit's negative feedback. Once again, probably to increase the amp's gain a bit. It could have all been smoke and mirrors though to make the amp appear to get louder with a lower volume control setting. My "62" (14A) still requires a lot of pot swing to get it really cooking. The blackface ones come out smoking, practically right off the bottom.

One of the fun parts of point to point amps is the potential for tweaking..........ah.

ed

Traditional........speak softly and play through a big blonde amp. Did I mention that I still like big blonde amps?

My '67 blackface Dual Showman has a very subtle increase in volume on the "vibrato" channel. Literally I can play a low volume show on 3 or 4 on that channel. But it gets louder and LOUDER the higher i turn it up. The volume is there, just not immediate.