my band got offered a slot to do some big party style show at house of blues, but its pay to play in the way that we apparently have to sell 30 tickets (or at least hand over 30 tickets worth of cash)

does any of you guys ever do these things?
is it ever worth it?
im guessing no but maybe some of you have some stories

http://dinosaurghost.bandcamp.com/
http://sixtycyclehum.podbean.com

We've not payed to play, but if it was a stepping stone to something bigger for the band I guess we'd not be against it.

the Undead Bureaucrats
http://www.facebook.com/TheUndeadBureaucrats

The Rum Sweats

...as though the headliners couldn't bring enough people in and they can't sell enough booze to make a profit? It's a mirror of the rest of the labor market in America where the worker carries all the risk and responsibility and the boss none. Time for a revolution, folks. And yes, this is political speech.

Big_Ryan wrote:

my band got offered a slot to do some big party style show at house of blues, but its pay to play in the way that we apparently have to sell 30 tickets (or at least hand over 30 tickets worth of cash)

does any of you guys ever do these things?
is it ever worth it?
im guessing no but maybe some of you have some stories

Squink Out!

JObeast wrote:

...as though the headliners couldn't bring enough people in and they can't sell enough booze to make a profit? It's a mirror of the rest of the labor market in America where the worker carries all the risk and responsibility and the boss none. Time for a revolution, folks. And yes, this is political speech.

These gigs don't have headliners. Most local gigs don't have headliners. A venue that does the pay-to-play scheme probably is rather small and has no booking prowess. They hire out a company to do the pay-to-play promotion. They do pay-to-play because they've been burnt by too many bands bringing absolutely no audience to the gig. I've seen this happen time and time again. I honestly don't understand how venues have live music, too many of the bands are abysmal and bring no audience. They actually turn away customers.

I hate the pay-to-play scheme but it makes complete sense to a promoter or owner of a bar. It actually forces the band to try and promote the show. Too few bands incessantly promote a show. Putting up a facebook flyer is not promoting a gig.

It all comes down to bad music, bad venues, lazy people.

Jake, how did learning to play an instrument also mean having to learn how to be a promoter? 2 totally different skills. Why would a business leave their livelihood to the unexperienced and unpredictable? Wouldn't it make more sense to have a professional promoter, working with an invested booker, to put shows together and advertise them efficiently so that they would draw consistently. I can understand if the band comes to the club and wants to put an entire show together, then they can assume responsibility. But again, why leave it to amateurs?

Danny Snyder

"With great reverb comes great responsibility" - Uncle Leo

Playing keys and guitar with Combo Tezeta

Formerly a guitarist in The TomorrowMen and Meshugga Beach Party

Latest surf project - Now That's What I Call SURF

NFW.....Ive been approached to do this type thing many times and won't do it.
I spend enough money doing gigs ...flyers (back when there was no internet for promotion),phone bills, gas ,rehearsal space,cost of gear and upkeep ,lost time at work,tires burned up running to Vegas and LA......I like to draw the line at playing for free;paying the bar to play is a line I wont cross.I guess I dont want to 'make it' in the music biz THAT BADLY.

I guess you never ad the bad fortune of working as a temp or independent contractor – this route makes the contracted worker liable for everything, including taxes and the contracting party merely responsible for cutting a check. In many cases, such as day labor, non-payment happens, with no recourse for the worker. It's become commonplace in tis late stage of crony capitalism we live under. Go ahead, call me a lefty. I'm proud to be able to call out criminal exploitation were I see it. Music biz is notoriously unfair to workers. THat's why workers shed blood to form union.

JakeDobner wrote:

JObeast wrote:

It's a mirror of the rest of the labor market in America where the worker carries all the risk and responsibility and the boss none.

Examples to prove it is a mirror of the labor market in America?

Squink Out!

My vote is No. These things rarely lead to bigger and better things. I assume if you don't sell the 30 tickets, you have to buy the rest yourself. A lot of times the line up of bands makes no sense either, and the tix are often too high for your friends who may only want to see your band.

Rev

Canadian Surf

http://www.urbansurfkings.com/

Yeah I told the booker that we wont play if we have to pick up the cost of any unsold tickets, i used to play these kind of shows when i was young and had the energy to run around all day trying to push tickets on my friends and family but these days i just dont care that much

It doesn't bother me to play for free because for the most part music is my hobby im self employed in my professional life and i definitely don't work for free there.

http://dinosaurghost.bandcamp.com/
http://sixtycyclehum.podbean.com

"Open mikes" in bars can sometimes be a pay to play situation, and sometimes not. The pay consists of buying drinks or meals while you are not performing. Sometimes it is just while you are waiting to perform, but sometimes you must sit through performances afterwards too.

It's different if you consider this as entertainment for yourself of course. If you don't it is a form of pay to play, unless you can schedule in advance and be present only for setup and performance.

Some bars operate "open mike" nights to recruit performers as paying clientele. You can't schedule in advance and they expect you to sit through the entire open mike period, which can last several hours.

I haven't minded waiting 30 minutes to perform for an open mike, but sometimes it's been much longer.

Insanitizers! http://www.insanitizers.com