Surf Encounter & Song Keys

pineapple_geoff

Joined: Apr 24, 2006
Posts: 119
MV Mi Amigo

Posted on Oct 05 2008 09:03 PM

I was messing around with the Surfites "Surf Encounter" on the weekend (it's the tab on the inside sleeve of "Big Pounder") and couldn't help but notice the weird key. It's full of sharps so does that mean it's E ? (it finished on E). I think there's a key change too ? The A and B bit.

Anyway. my question was -

If most surf instro songs are in Am/C major, what are most of the other pop songs from the 60s in ? What are some other common surf keys ?

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zak

Joined: Sep 24, 2007
Posts: 2728
1 Link Pin

Posted on Oct 05 2008 09:10 PM

This post has been removed by the author.

Last edited: Sep 23, 2009 20:10:35

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pineapple_geoff

Joined: Apr 24, 2006
Posts: 119
MV Mi Amigo

Posted on Oct 06 2008 01:38 AM

Interesting.

I thought someone made the claim last year, in this forum, that lots of surf instro tunes were in C major or A minor?

I was curious how that sat with what other musicians were doing in the early '60s contemporaneously ? because I was wondering whether or not surf instro fitted into the broader musical trends or was more unique ? I know that some of Dick Dale stuff has a Middle Eastern influence, which is a little bit out of the ordinary.

PG

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wooza

Joined: Apr 24, 2006
Posts: 1618
Ithaca, NY
1 Download Pin

Posted on Oct 06 2008 02:43 AM

I haven't payed too close attention, but it seems Dick Dale tends to play lots of stuff in E or Am, and maybe that rubbed off a bit on the rest of the surf players in the '60s. My guess is it has something to do with his reverse playing of his strings which has got to limit the chords he can play. The one time I saw him live just about every song was in E, which also lends itself to excessive use of harmonics on his part.

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Klas

Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 2303
Stockholm, Sweden
Sweden

Posted on Oct 06 2008 09:21 AM

pineapple_geoff
I was messing around with the Surfites "Surf Encounter" on the weekend (it's the tab on the inside sleeve of "Big Pounder") and couldn't help but notice the weird key. It's full of sharps so does that mean it's E ? (it finished on E). I think there's a key change too ? The A and B bit.

I don't know much about musical theory (we're playing surf music) but believe the key for the song to be G#m. I recall the reason was to get an easier playing pattern of single notes for the rhythm guitar by including an open string during the F#ms.

—

T H E ✠ S U R F I T E S

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LHR

Joined: Aug 23, 2006
Posts: 2123
The jungle
Costa Rica

Posted on Oct 06 2008 10:08 AM

I find a disturbing number of songs from the 1960s (mostly late) to be in no discernible key!

—

SSIV

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pineapple_geoff

Joined: Apr 24, 2006
Posts: 119
MV Mi Amigo

Posted on Oct 07 2008 01:26 AM

Gee, interesting. I never knew about Dick Dale and the reverse playing (I missed him when he came to my part of the world years ago). What exactly is it ? and why is the excessive use of harmonics more likely in E ?

Thanks for all of your considered thoughts on this! Buy ya a beer sometime !

PG

P.S. Klas, I've always believed that "less is more" and LHR I think that's a key change (man) !

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wooza

Joined: Apr 24, 2006
Posts: 1618
Ithaca, NY
1 Download Pin

Posted on Oct 07 2008 01:59 AM

pineapple_geoff
Gee, interesting. I never knew about Dick Dale and the reverse playing (I missed him when he came to my part of the world years ago). What exactly is it ? and why is the excessive use of harmonics more likely in E ?

Well he plays left handed, but his guitar is strung for a righty. That's a big part of his legend. I'm of course only speculating about that limiting his chordal options. I don't actually know for sure... Actually I think Ron Rhodes may have said something along those lines a while back. (He plays the same way so I've heard. Any insights Ron?) And nowadays whenever Dick plays in E--often--he seems to like to hit the harmonics on his high E string--very often.

Check it out. You can get a glimpse of his strings, and he does the harmonics thing a handful of times in this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02ytG7ixX2M

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Brian

Joined: Feb 25, 2006
Posts: 19306
Des Moines, Iowa, USA
United States

Posted on Oct 07 2008 07:45 AM

Geoff, check out the strings:

—

Site dude - S3 Agent #202
Need help with the site? SG101 FAQ - Send me a private message - Email me

"It starts... when it begins" -- Ralf Kilauea

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TvD

Joined: Mar 03, 2006
Posts: 81
Toronto
1 Link Pin

Posted on Oct 07 2008 09:34 AM

pineapple_geoff
I thought someone made the claim last year, in this forum, that lots of surf instro tunes were in C major or A minor?

IIRC, that post was saying that it was common to have bridges that were in the relative major of a minor key. e.g. C major for A minor

—

Trevor von Drat

http://www.myspace.com/vondrats

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pineapple_geoff

Joined: Apr 24, 2006
Posts: 119
MV Mi Amigo

Posted on Oct 08 2008 07:37 PM

Ah ha ! now I understand ! Thanks guys. Makes me a little sad I didn't go to see him now. Can't remember why but probably because I was broke (again).............

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pineapple_geoff Joined: Apr 24, 2006 Posts: 119 MV Mi Amigo	Posted on Oct 05 2008 09:03 PM I was messing around with the Surfites "Surf Encounter" on the weekend (it's the tab on the inside sleeve of "Big Pounder") and couldn't help but notice the weird key. It's full of sharps so does that mean it's E ? (it finished on E). I think there's a key change too ? The A and B bit. Anyway. my question was - If most surf instro songs are in Am/C major, what are most of the other pop songs from the 60s in ? What are some other common surf keys ? Top
zak Joined: Sep 24, 2007 Posts: 2728	Posted on Oct 05 2008 09:10 PM This post has been removed by the author. Last edited: Sep 23, 2009 20:10:35 Top
pineapple_geoff Joined: Apr 24, 2006 Posts: 119 MV Mi Amigo	Posted on Oct 06 2008 01:38 AM Interesting. I thought someone made the claim last year, in this forum, that lots of surf instro tunes were in C major or A minor? I was curious how that sat with what other musicians were doing in the early '60s contemporaneously ? because I was wondering whether or not surf instro fitted into the broader musical trends or was more unique ? I know that some of Dick Dale stuff has a Middle Eastern influence, which is a little bit out of the ordinary. PG Top
wooza Joined: Apr 24, 2006 Posts: 1618 Ithaca, NY	Posted on Oct 06 2008 02:43 AM I haven't payed too close attention, but it seems Dick Dale tends to play lots of stuff in E or Am, and maybe that rubbed off a bit on the rest of the surf players in the '60s. My guess is it has something to do with his reverse playing of his strings which has got to limit the chords he can play. The one time I saw him live just about every song was in E, which also lends itself to excessive use of harmonics on his part. Top
Klas Joined: Feb 26, 2006 Posts: 2303 Stockholm, Sweden	Posted on Oct 06 2008 09:21 AM pineapple_geoff I was messing around with the Surfites "Surf Encounter" on the weekend (it's the tab on the inside sleeve of "Big Pounder") and couldn't help but notice the weird key. It's full of sharps so does that mean it's E ? (it finished on E). I think there's a key change too ? The A and B bit. I don't know much about musical theory (we're playing surf music) but believe the key for the song to be G#m. I recall the reason was to get an easier playing pattern of single notes for the rhythm guitar by including an open string during the F#ms. — T H E ✠ S U R F I T E S Top
LHR Joined: Aug 23, 2006 Posts: 2123 The jungle	Posted on Oct 06 2008 10:08 AM I find a disturbing number of songs from the 1960s (mostly late) to be in no discernible key! — SSIV Top
pineapple_geoff Joined: Apr 24, 2006 Posts: 119 MV Mi Amigo	Posted on Oct 07 2008 01:26 AM Gee, interesting. I never knew about Dick Dale and the reverse playing (I missed him when he came to my part of the world years ago). What exactly is it ? and why is the excessive use of harmonics more likely in E ? Thanks for all of your considered thoughts on this! Buy ya a beer sometime ! PG P.S. Klas, I've always believed that "less is more" and LHR I think that's a key change (man) ! Top
wooza Joined: Apr 24, 2006 Posts: 1618 Ithaca, NY	Posted on Oct 07 2008 01:59 AM pineapple_geoff Gee, interesting. I never knew about Dick Dale and the reverse playing (I missed him when he came to my part of the world years ago). What exactly is it ? and why is the excessive use of harmonics more likely in E ? Well he plays left handed, but his guitar is strung for a righty. That's a big part of his legend. I'm of course only speculating about that limiting his chordal options. I don't actually know for sure... Actually I think Ron Rhodes may have said something along those lines a while back. (He plays the same way so I've heard. Any insights Ron?) And nowadays whenever Dick plays in E--often--he seems to like to hit the harmonics on his high E string--very often. Check it out. You can get a glimpse of his strings, and he does the harmonics thing a handful of times in this video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02ytG7ixX2M Top
Brian Joined: Feb 25, 2006 Posts: 19306 Des Moines, Iowa, USA	Posted on Oct 07 2008 07:45 AM Geoff, check out the strings: — Site dude - S3 Agent #202 Need help with the site? SG101 FAQ - Send me a private message - Email me "It starts... when it begins" -- Ralf Kilauea Top
TvD Joined: Mar 03, 2006 Posts: 81 Toronto	Posted on Oct 07 2008 09:34 AM pineapple_geoff I thought someone made the claim last year, in this forum, that lots of surf instro tunes were in C major or A minor? IIRC, that post was saying that it was common to have bridges that were in the relative major of a minor key. e.g. C major for A minor — Trevor von Drat http://www.myspace.com/vondrats Top
pineapple_geoff Joined: Apr 24, 2006 Posts: 119 MV Mi Amigo	Posted on Oct 08 2008 07:37 PM Ah ha ! now I understand ! Thanks guys. Makes me a little sad I didn't go to see him now. Can't remember why but probably because I was broke (again)............. Top

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Surf Encounter & Song Keys