Jason Lee on the reverb unit sound

DannySnyder

Joined: Mar 02, 2006
Posts: 11058
Berkeley, CA
United States

Posted on Aug 17 2008 01:16 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSHGeOD8HGQ

Nice job Jason

—

Danny Snyder

"With great reverb comes great responsibility" - Uncle Leo

Playing keys and guitar with Combo Tezeta

Formerly a guitarist in The TomorrowMen and Meshugga Beach Party

Latest surf project - Now That's What I Call SURF

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WR

Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 3832
netherlands
2 Link Pins

Posted on Aug 17 2008 06:13 AM

that's an awesome clip. almost 5000 viewings in three days too.

...however.... I dont really believe the spring mounting of the pan has much effect on the sound. it's the powertube driver which makes the difference. The spring is an electronical device, not mechanical, it's basically current going back and forth in a long wire. so I wonder how much the actual spring shape of the long wire has much effect. it's just that a 10 yard reverbunit would be a bit unpractical.

anyone with more understanding correct me if Im wrong though.

—

Rules to live by #314:
"When in Italy, if the menu says something's grilled, don't assume it is."

https://www.facebook.com/The-Malbehavers-286429584796173/

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bomboraboy

Joined: May 26, 2007
Posts: 87

Posted on Aug 17 2008 06:40 AM

I always thought that the springs are in fact a mechanical device. in the tank theres a little transducer (looks like a tiny transformer) that converts the current of the powertube into vibration and a other transducer on the other side that reconverts the incoming spring movements into a current that is amplified by the ecc83 and sent to the amp. Because the springs are compressed and expanded the signal is changed and the reverb happens.

But I don't believe that the way the tank is mounted changes the sound that much. I believe the only reason it is floating in the reverb unit is that it don't picks up vibrations form the stage or accidental kicking of the tank. So if you want to kick the tank you should nail it to floor of the unit.
Onboard reverb is so weak because the tank can not be driven so hard and there are not so many controls to affect the signal (I think it's only the mix control).

but maybe i'm totally incorrect

cheers

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estreet

Joined: Mar 17, 2007
Posts: 839
United Kingdom
1 POTD Pin

Posted on Aug 17 2008 07:28 AM

You are right Bomboraboy. It is an acoustic/mechanical device with transducers. Have you ever seen one of those reverb units for acoustic guitar that just have springs in them - or one of those toy reverb microphones for kids? Both of them work just like an amp reverb but contain no electronics. I used to have a fan heater you could sing into and get reverb becasuse of the springy filaments ..

The send transducer acts like a speaker that shocks the spring into vibrating at the frequency of the input signal and the other transducer picks it up like a mic would. Springs being what they are, it keeps vibrating for a period of time giving the reverb

What makes the outboard tank different, is that the spring is driven by a 5 watt power amp (pretty much like an old Fender Champ) valve (the 6K6 or 6V6 - instead of a weak signal from an ECC83 pre-amp valve like onboard reverbs are.

Electricity travels at 186 million miles a second - you'd need a reeeeeally long wire if it worked by delaying the current.

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http://www.myspace.com/thepashuns

Youth and enthusiasm are no match for age and treachery.

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Abe

Joined: Mar 12, 2008
Posts: 1237
Bay Area
1 Link Pin

Posted on Aug 17 2008 10:57 AM

Cool video thanks for posting that. Hey man whats that riff he was playing? It sounds familiar.

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The Deadbeats

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WR

Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 3832
netherlands
2 Link Pins

Posted on Aug 17 2008 01:41 PM

estreet
.

The send transducer acts like a speaker that shocks the spring into vibrating at the frequency of the input signal and the other transducer picks it up like a mic would. Springs being what they are, it keeps vibrating for a period of time giving the reverb

Electricity travels at 186 million miles a second - you'd need a reeeeeally long wire if it worked by delaying the current.

that makes perfect sense, thanks!

—

Rules to live by #314:
"When in Italy, if the menu says something's grilled, don't assume it is."

https://www.facebook.com/The-Malbehavers-286429584796173/

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bomboraboy

Joined: May 26, 2007
Posts: 87

Posted on Aug 17 2008 03:49 PM

estreet
What makes the outboard tank different, is that the spring is driven by a 5 watt power amp (pretty much like an old Fender Champ) valve (the 6K6 or 6V6 - instead of a weak signal from an ECC83 pre-amp valve like onboard reverbs are.

So do you think one could use the reverb unit as a practice amp by putting speaker where the springs would come?

b

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WR

Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 3832
netherlands
2 Link Pins

Posted on Aug 17 2008 05:12 PM

in theory yes. never tried it though. 8 ohm speaker I think.

BUT... you'll have no reverb

UNLESS you have two tanks!

(I do!... .. should try that once. )

—

Rules to live by #314:
"When in Italy, if the menu says something's grilled, don't assume it is."

https://www.facebook.com/The-Malbehavers-286429584796173/

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Dane_Brammage

Joined: Jun 14, 2006
Posts: 203
3 Contributor Pins

Posted on Aug 17 2008 08:15 PM

Hmm. What if you just put the speaker in series with the pan?

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FlatRacer

Joined: Apr 07, 2008
Posts: 182

Posted on Sep 10 2008 08:40 PM

estreet
Electricity travels at 186 million miles a second - you'd need a reeeeeally long wire if it worked by delaying the current.

I think you meant to say 186 THOUSAND miles per second (roughly the speed of light).

Eric

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DannySnyder Joined: Mar 02, 2006 Posts: 11058 Berkeley, CA	Posted on Aug 17 2008 01:16 AM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSHGeOD8HGQ Nice job Jason — Danny Snyder "With great reverb comes great responsibility" - Uncle Leo Playing keys and guitar with Combo Tezeta Formerly a guitarist in The TomorrowMen and Meshugga Beach Party Latest surf project - Now That's What I Call SURF Top
WR Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 3832 netherlands	Posted on Aug 17 2008 06:13 AM that's an awesome clip. almost 5000 viewings in three days too. ...however.... I dont really believe the spring mounting of the pan has much effect on the sound. it's the powertube driver which makes the difference. The spring is an electronical device, not mechanical, it's basically current going back and forth in a long wire. so I wonder how much the actual spring shape of the long wire has much effect. it's just that a 10 yard reverbunit would be a bit unpractical. anyone with more understanding correct me if Im wrong though. — Rules to live by #314: "When in Italy, if the menu says something's grilled, don't assume it is." https://www.facebook.com/The-Malbehavers-286429584796173/ Top
bomboraboy Joined: May 26, 2007 Posts: 87	Posted on Aug 17 2008 06:40 AM I always thought that the springs are in fact a mechanical device. in the tank theres a little transducer (looks like a tiny transformer) that converts the current of the powertube into vibration and a other transducer on the other side that reconverts the incoming spring movements into a current that is amplified by the ecc83 and sent to the amp. Because the springs are compressed and expanded the signal is changed and the reverb happens. But I don't believe that the way the tank is mounted changes the sound that much. I believe the only reason it is floating in the reverb unit is that it don't picks up vibrations form the stage or accidental kicking of the tank. So if you want to kick the tank you should nail it to floor of the unit. Onboard reverb is so weak because the tank can not be driven so hard and there are not so many controls to affect the signal (I think it's only the mix control). but maybe i'm totally incorrect cheers Top
estreet Joined: Mar 17, 2007 Posts: 839 United Kingdom	Posted on Aug 17 2008 07:28 AM You are right Bomboraboy. It is an acoustic/mechanical device with transducers. Have you ever seen one of those reverb units for acoustic guitar that just have springs in them - or one of those toy reverb microphones for kids? Both of them work just like an amp reverb but contain no electronics. I used to have a fan heater you could sing into and get reverb becasuse of the springy filaments .. The send transducer acts like a speaker that shocks the spring into vibrating at the frequency of the input signal and the other transducer picks it up like a mic would. Springs being what they are, it keeps vibrating for a period of time giving the reverb What makes the outboard tank different, is that the spring is driven by a 5 watt power amp (pretty much like an old Fender Champ) valve (the 6K6 or 6V6 - instead of a weak signal from an ECC83 pre-amp valve like onboard reverbs are. Electricity travels at 186 million miles a second - you'd need a reeeeeally long wire if it worked by delaying the current. — http://www.myspace.com/thepashuns Youth and enthusiasm are no match for age and treachery. Top
Abe Joined: Mar 12, 2008 Posts: 1237 Bay Area	Posted on Aug 17 2008 10:57 AM Cool video thanks for posting that. Hey man whats that riff he was playing? It sounds familiar. — The Deadbeats Top
WR Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 3832 netherlands	Posted on Aug 17 2008 01:41 PM estreet . The send transducer acts like a speaker that shocks the spring into vibrating at the frequency of the input signal and the other transducer picks it up like a mic would. Springs being what they are, it keeps vibrating for a period of time giving the reverb Electricity travels at 186 million miles a second - you'd need a reeeeeally long wire if it worked by delaying the current. that makes perfect sense, thanks! — Rules to live by #314: "When in Italy, if the menu says something's grilled, don't assume it is." https://www.facebook.com/The-Malbehavers-286429584796173/ Top
bomboraboy Joined: May 26, 2007 Posts: 87	Posted on Aug 17 2008 03:49 PM estreet What makes the outboard tank different, is that the spring is driven by a 5 watt power amp (pretty much like an old Fender Champ) valve (the 6K6 or 6V6 - instead of a weak signal from an ECC83 pre-amp valve like onboard reverbs are. So do you think one could use the reverb unit as a practice amp by putting speaker where the springs would come? b Top
WR Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 3832 netherlands	Posted on Aug 17 2008 05:12 PM in theory yes. never tried it though. 8 ohm speaker I think. BUT... you'll have no reverb UNLESS you have two tanks! (I do!... .. should try that once. ) — Rules to live by #314: "When in Italy, if the menu says something's grilled, don't assume it is." https://www.facebook.com/The-Malbehavers-286429584796173/ Top
Dane_Brammage Joined: Jun 14, 2006 Posts: 203	Posted on Aug 17 2008 08:15 PM Hmm. What if you just put the speaker in series with the pan? Top
FlatRacer Joined: Apr 07, 2008 Posts: 182	Posted on Sep 10 2008 08:40 PM estreet Electricity travels at 186 million miles a second - you'd need a reeeeeally long wire if it worked by delaying the current. I think you meant to say 186 THOUSAND miles per second (roughly the speed of light). Eric Top

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Jason Lee on the reverb unit sound