TomH
Joined: Mar 15, 2006
Posts: 766
Oberlin, Ohio, USA
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Posted on Sep 23 2019 02:32 PM
The subject is actually Jaguar project gone Wray! Ha ha!
Started with a candy apple red Classic Player Jaguar. Gutted the electronics completely. Put in a 3-way Telecaster switch and a new switch plate. Then I wired it pretty much like a Mosrite, except I replaced the 1M Jaguar pots with .250K Fender pots. Then, I used a .022 capacitor,
again like on a Tele. Replaced the Jaguar pickups with Strat-style lipstick tube pickups. Had to route the pickup cavities a bit. Finally, I replaced the Classic Player bridge and tremolo with a StayTrem bridge and a AVRI tremolo. The Classic Player Jags run the ground wire to the bridge; however, since I changed the bridge and removed the inserts that the tune-a-matic style bridge used, I had to drill a hole into the trem cavity and that's where I ran the ground wire.
It was a fun project and I didn't know how it would turn out. Love all the chrome and the tone is totally different from the Jaguar tone. It's definitely richer, but there's plenty of twang. I'm happy with the end result. It's a cross between a Danelectro, a Strat, a Tele and a Jag, and that's also kind of how it sounds. It's definitely distinctive. I think the 250K pots were a wise choice.
My only regret is that I bought cheap lipstick tube pickups with alnico magnets on eBay for just $22 per pickup, including shipping. I was hesitant to buy better pickups, because I really didn't know how this project would turn out. In retrospect, I wish I had gone ahead and bought
Seymour Duncan SLS-1 lipstick tube pickups. As good as the Jag is sounding with the cheap pickups, I suspect it would sound even better with SLS-1 pickups. Maybe I'll do that at some point.
Anyway, most of my projects don't turn out as expected. This one finally exceeded my expectations! Just thought I'd share it! It was a lot of fun figuring everything out and putting it together!
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Surfing_Sam_61
Joined: Jan 15, 2019
Posts: 1515
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Posted on Sep 23 2019 02:56 PM
It's different - like to hear the sound if you ever record that machine.
Looks nice though with the lipstick pickups. Never thought of that.
I have the same color Jaguar but with old school switching, its my best playing one so will opt out on that one.  have others though
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Brian
Joined: Feb 25, 2006
Posts: 19335
Des Moines, Iowa, USA
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Posted on Sep 23 2019 05:03 PM
Very nice Tom, looks like a fun project!
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ldk
Joined: Nov 08, 2017
Posts: 369
San Francisco Bay Area
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Posted on Sep 23 2019 05:08 PM
TomH, nice looking guitar. Lipstick PUs look cool. Good choice.
In your wiring diagram, you have the third lug on the tone pot connected to ground. Is that really a Mosrite thing? I can't figure out what it accomplishes.
— If I'd stop buying old guitars to fix, I might actually learn to play.
Bringing instruments back to life since 2013.
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revmike
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 3852
North Atlantic
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Posted on Sep 23 2019 05:40 PM
I have the Seymour Duncan lip sticks in my Strat. You won’t regret buying them. Very cool guitar!
Rev
— Canadian Surf
http://www.urbansurfkings.com/
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TomH
Joined: Mar 15, 2006
Posts: 766
Oberlin, Ohio, USA
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Posted on Sep 23 2019 06:14 PM
Hey Lee,
Back in the 1990s I bought my first Mosrite and I had the pickups remade by Curtis Novak. I could only find one Mosrite wiring diagram and it didn't exactly match any of the pictures of Mosrite wiring that I had seen. So, I collected a whole bunch of pictures from auctions and from web sites that showed Mosrite wiring. From those pictures, I came up with my own Mosrite wiring diagram, which is what I modified to show above what I did with my Jag. I posted that 90's wiring diagram to the Mosrite Forum and some people thought it was helpful. Anyway, I don't know why that third lug is connected to the ground. It's what I saw in some of the pictures that I collected. I wanted my Fillmore Mosrite with the Curtis Novak pickups to be wired like a vintage Mosrite. The Mosrites made in Japan aren't wired like that, at least none of the ones I've had. So, I'll attach that diagram that I made back in the 90's, along with one of the pics that I still have, to this message. Unfortunately, I don't know enough about this stuff to be able to give you a good answer, but thanks for the question. I love talking gear! Luckily, I've had about 9 or 10 Mosrites over the years and this diagram has worked for me.
Last edited: Sep 23, 2019 18:57:35
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ldk
Joined: Nov 08, 2017
Posts: 369
San Francisco Bay Area
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Posted on Sep 23 2019 09:47 PM
Seems to me that the third lug connected to ground just puts a 500 kOhm resistance between signal and ground. I'd guess this lowers the volume slightly but doesn't change the pot's effect on tone otherwise. Next time I have a guitar apart, I'll experiment.
edit: after thinking about this further, there's more to it than what I said. Maybe someone else knows.
— If I'd stop buying old guitars to fix, I might actually learn to play.
Bringing instruments back to life since 2013.
Last edited: Sep 23, 2019 22:05:21
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ldk
Joined: Nov 08, 2017
Posts: 369
San Francisco Bay Area
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Posted on Sep 23 2019 10:35 PM
edit2: Thought about it some more. I'm going back to my original assessment.
— If I'd stop buying old guitars to fix, I might actually learn to play.
Bringing instruments back to life since 2013.
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TomH
Joined: Mar 15, 2006
Posts: 766
Oberlin, Ohio, USA
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Posted on Sep 24 2019 06:08 AM
I don't want to lower the volume! Should I cut that wire that joins the two 3rd lugs? It does look like it's not needed. So, maybe this is the way to go?
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Surf_Skater
Joined: Sep 06, 2012
Posts: 1300
Lawrenceville , GA
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Posted on Sep 24 2019 06:32 AM
If you're using the trem as your ground. That extra wire between the 3rd lugs continues the ground from tone pot to volume pot. Removing it takes away the volume pot ground.
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Surfadelphia
Joined: Sep 04, 2017
Posts: 435
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Posted on Sep 24 2019 09:05 AM
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ldk
Joined: Nov 08, 2017
Posts: 369
San Francisco Bay Area
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Posted on Sep 24 2019 12:56 PM
I did a little experiment. I recorded some guitar into Audacity. I then recorded from this sample back into Audacity, with and without a 500Kohm resistor between signal and ground. The track with the resistor was 0.2 dB quieter than the track without. So, not much of a difference, but a difference none the less. (In looking back at your post, I see you used a 250K pot and not a 500K pot, so the difference would be greater.)
If you want to change to a typical tone pot setup, then follow this schematic. Since your pots are mounted on metal, you probably don't need to add the wire between the V and T pots, and you'd just need to cut that wire between the third lug and the body of the tone pot.
— If I'd stop buying old guitars to fix, I might actually learn to play.
Bringing instruments back to life since 2013.
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TomH
Joined: Mar 15, 2006
Posts: 766
Oberlin, Ohio, USA
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Posted on Sep 24 2019 02:20 PM
Thank you! This is very helpful. I'll do this tonight. Can't wait! I really appreciate your help! I guess this really was a Jaguar project gone awry 
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stratdancer
Joined: Dec 11, 2013
Posts: 2537
Akron, Ohio
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Posted on Sep 24 2019 05:40 PM
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Surfadelphia
Joined: Sep 04, 2017
Posts: 435
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Posted on Sep 24 2019 09:08 PM
I'm really pretty clueless when it comes to guitar electronics. I do have a basic understanding of how pot values effect tone and audio taper vs linear taper and I have a good understanding of the different types of pu's...but that's about it. I even need to have a tech do something simple like changing vol and tone pots. Regarding replacement Lipstick Tube pu's, I'm sure the Duncans sound real good, Kent Armstrong makes excellent sounding Lipsticks in a Strat mount that won't break the bank (don't order them from WD as they sell them at list/retail, get them from a dealer...there are a few on Reverb, and they will be discounted). I have a set of Armstrong humbucker sized P-90's in my Edwards Les Paul clone and they are killer sounding pu's at a very reasonable price. Curtis Novak Lipsticks are great but a bit pricey ($250.00/pair).
Last edited: Sep 24, 2019 21:11:08
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TomH
Joined: Mar 15, 2006
Posts: 766
Oberlin, Ohio, USA
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Posted on Sep 24 2019 09:51 PM
Just did the changes that Lee suggested. Big improvement! Thanks again for that. The pickups are louder, but now they also seem a bit more powerful. I was just getting some nice feedback through my little Vox Pathfinder amp. Seems like all the guitars I've had with lipstick pickups get a pleasing feedback. Not like my Mosrite, which just shrieks and squeals. Wonder if that's common with lipstick pickups. Anyway, I'm going to attach one final wiring diagram that incorporates Lee's suggestions. I'm really happy with the sound I'm getting. I love the Jaguar neck and tremolo, but have always preferred lipstick tube pickups. Now I have both! If I get a chance in the near future, I'll post a recording.
Last edited: Sep 24, 2019 22:14:42
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ldk
Joined: Nov 08, 2017
Posts: 369
San Francisco Bay Area
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Posted on Sep 25 2019 12:22 AM
TomH wrote:
... Big improvement! ...
Fantastic. Great guitar!
— If I'd stop buying old guitars to fix, I might actually learn to play.
Bringing instruments back to life since 2013.
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Surfing_Sam_61
Joined: Jan 15, 2019
Posts: 1515
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Posted on Sep 25 2019 04:21 PM
TomH you should submit your lipstick pickup idea to Fender, This could be one of those alternate reality guitar series etc.
It would be cool looking with a matching red headstock as well.
Not sure how the rhythm circuit comes into play or if the switch still works or not. I think this would be a killer Fender product.
If they had the better roller saddles or all the improved Jaguar upgrades it would be a major new surf axe.
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TomH
Joined: Mar 15, 2006
Posts: 766
Oberlin, Ohio, USA
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Posted on Sep 25 2019 05:43 PM
Matching headstock would be very cool! I didn't do anything with the rhythm circuit controls. I thought about getting an American Professional Jaguar switch plate, which has just a single switch, and making it a cut-off switch, but it didn't seem to be worth the added cost. I use a pedal tuner and that functions the same as a cut-off switch. Another idea would be to have alternate wiring so that the pickups are wired in series, and then use the switch for that, but I wanted to keep it simple. So, I went with what I did. On Danelectro U2 guitars the pickups are wired in series. So, with both pickups on the sound is louder. That's kinda cool and I love Danelectro guitars (and basses), but, again, I wanted to keep it simple. Regarding roller saddles, the StayTrem bridge is excellent and my Jag stays in tune no matter how much I use the trem. My Mosrite has roller saddles, but it goes out of tune easily. I still love my Mosrite, but it is what it is. If Fender used a bridge more like the StayTrem, I think it would be popular.
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Surfadelphia
Joined: Sep 04, 2017
Posts: 435
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Posted on Sep 26 2019 10:47 AM
The Fender American Professional Series Jags use a modified Mustang bridge similar to the Stay Trem bridge but not quite as good. Fender actually sells that American Pro Jag bridge separately (Darren Riley's Guitar and Amp Parts stocks them and they go for $79.00). I say this because apparently the folks who make the Stay Trem are not shipping to the USA anymore.
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April Birthdays 
That's a really nice mod job. Looks great and I bet it sounds terrific. Getting 500K pots installed in my Hallmark 65 Custom this week, so that should distract me from the Jag GAS (not to mention my permanent case of Tele GAS, Gretsch Dyna Jet GAS.....and the list goes on and on; I'm just a hopeless case 
