websurfer
Joined: May 14, 2007
Posts: 1753
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Posted on Apr 02 2017 01:26 PM
I don't know if this subject ever got its own discussion. I've been playing more guitar, learning progressions and rhythms. There are a wide variety of approaches--its not all bashing out bar chords (though that's called for a lot). Sometimes the rhythm plays a counterpoint to the lead, or plays simple figures. I think I heard that one of the Astronaut's three guitars was dedicated to keeping that constant drip going.
Many rhythms have a Latin sound, and a different feel can be gotten out of something as simple as slow backward strums across the strings.
How do some of the primarily rhythm guitarists here approach what you do, and for lead players, what do you look for in a rhythm player?
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Reverbenator
Joined: Jul 26, 2015
Posts: 259
San Diego, Ca
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Posted on Apr 02 2017 02:06 PM
Latin feel?
Rhythym guitar?
Google some Los Twang Marvel clips, and give a good listen to Marisol Yolanda. She is an amazing Rhythym guitarist. She has a very fast, funky right hand. And I'm sure that if you were to listen a good cross-section of their material, you'd hear numerous technique/approaches to Rhythym guitar. Good stuff.
— -Cheers, Clark-
-Less Paul, more Reverb-
Last edited: Apr 02, 2017 14:08:03
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Squid
Joined: Aug 22, 2010
Posts: 1018
Portland, Oregon with Insanitizers
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Posted on Apr 02 2017 09:56 PM
What I look for in a rhythm guitarist is to fit in and add to the overall sound without obscuring the lead. This can be done in various ways, but is easier said than done.
As you say the lady rhythm guitarist of Los Twang Marvels does this well. Dave Wronski's rhythm guitar for Jon and the Nightriders is awesome, and so is the rhythm guitarist of The Eliminators. While we're at it, hats off to Gabriela of Rodrigo & Gabriela, she's got it, oh she's got it.
— Insanitizers! http://www.insanitizers.com
Last edited: Apr 03, 2017 21:37:26
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DannySnyder
Joined: Mar 02, 2006
Posts: 11054
Berkeley, CA
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Posted on Apr 02 2017 10:17 PM
Rhythm guitar is a great topic and always worth re-examining, as it's such an essential component of most surf bands. I for one enjoy it just as much as playing lead,(sometimes more) having done my fair share of it over the years.
Here's a link to lots of previous discussions had on here about it. If you still have specific questions fire away.
https://surfguitar101.com/search/?q=&exact=rhythm+guitar&exclude=&models=forums.topic
— Danny Snyder
"With great reverb comes great responsibility" - Uncle Leo
Playing keys and guitar with Combo Tezeta
Formerly a guitarist in The TomorrowMen and Meshugga Beach Party
Latest surf project - Now That's What I Call SURF
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websurfer
Joined: May 14, 2007
Posts: 1753
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Posted on Apr 03 2017 12:27 AM
Thanks Danny and others who've replied. I've just read those threads and they do address a lot of related issues. Thankfully there are a lot of performances to watch online. At least it's nice to hear Yolanda get some attention here. She is really good. Between the Surfer Joe performances and the Brazilian t.v. appearance there is good opportunity learn a bit from her.
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stratdancer
Joined: Dec 11, 2013
Posts: 2537
Akron, Ohio
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Posted on Apr 03 2017 05:02 AM
Unlike other forms of rock rhythm guitar, in surf it can be more challenging in my opinion. I enjoy playing it as much as lead when our other guitarist takes the lead. We trade off and on during songs. Most of my rhythms are heavy palm muted drip right along with the bass. Fast songs requires lots of practice for palm muted drip ticks to build speed in your thumb and forefinger. For strumming you have to stay within a very tight pocket and tempo behind the lead where the groove resides. Without any gain such as you have in other forms of rock music there is no margin for error. You can screw up a good song very easily! This is when you have to listen to the rest of the band and make sure you are in the pocket!
— The Kahuna Kings
https://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Kahuna-Kings/459752090818447
https://thekahunakings.bandcamp.com/releases
Last edited: Apr 03, 2017 05:06:05
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ScottyBravo
Joined: Jul 14, 2008
Posts: 92
Chandler, AZ
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Posted on Apr 03 2017 12:53 PM
I think rhythm guitar, particularly in surf music, is highly underappreciated. In many cases it can make or break a song. I've always thought that Los Straitjackets does an excellent job with their rhythm guitar parts.
— Scott
http://thesurfsideiv.com/
https://www.facebook.com/surfsideiv/
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websurfer
Joined: May 14, 2007
Posts: 1753
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Posted on Apr 03 2017 04:33 PM
I've been spending some time on Yu Ishikawa's "Don Wilson Style Rhythm Guitar" YouTube channel. Great for practicing strums, moving bar chords around and repertoire. It's fast, so it can be challenging if you are not quite up to speed, but I find it worth sticking to. Don Wilson also often did a percussive, staccato strum between chords. This is a technique that seems unique to his style.
Here's his full playlist:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5F3F3C72AAD3B6F9
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websurfer
Joined: May 14, 2007
Posts: 1753
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Posted on Apr 03 2017 04:46 PM
This is another favorite. The videographer kept the camera almost exclusively on the rhythm player Eddie Ugata who practically puts on a clinic on how to back up a trad surf band. (I see these guys are coming to the convention this year!)
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tahitijack
Joined: Nov 03, 2006
Posts: 693
San Clemente, CA
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Posted on Apr 03 2017 05:11 PM
Based on what has been posted so far seems a good starting point is to stay out of the way of the lead guitar and drums. If you avoid stepping on toes you'll fit right in laying a solid foundation/platform for the melody and the beats but your chords and rhythm find their way to the front when either or both take a breath.
— Happy Sunsets!
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Las_Barracudas
Joined: Apr 24, 2011
Posts: 1087
Surf City, NC
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Posted on Apr 03 2017 06:26 PM
The Lively Ones offer many great examples of trad-Surf rhythm guitar. Not always easy to hear all the parts though depending on the song.
Surf Rider
— METEOR IV on reverbnation
Last edited: Apr 03, 2017 18:39:37
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Rondo1
Joined: Apr 01, 2016
Posts: 89
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Posted on Apr 03 2017 07:38 PM
I agree with what everyone has stated. Rhythm guitar is very under appreciated and not just in surf music. Listen to Jay Perkins guitar on all the great Carl Perkins cuts or Eddie Taylor on old Jimmy Reed records. It is what gives the tune the push. I started out as a rhythm guitarist in my fathers Bluegrass band. He wanted me to really give it some drive. Even though I'm currently the "lead" player in my instro group, I still really enjoy playing rhythm.
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websurfer
Joined: May 14, 2007
Posts: 1753
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Posted on Apr 03 2017 08:44 PM
Las_Barracudas wrote:
The Lively Ones offer many great examples of trad-Surf rhythm guitar. Not always easy to hear all the parts though depending on the song.
Surf Rider
Dang, you are right. I'm listening to them now. As familiar as I am with them, concentration on the rhythm parts has opened up a new world of appreciation. Ed Chiaverini (?) is really worth a close listen.
Rondo1 wrote:
I started out as a rhythm guitarist in my fathers Bluegrass band. He wanted me to really give it some drive.
I started out playing Bluegrass guitar too. I have been mostly playing bass lately and now with guitar my arm feel like it's going to fall off after a couple of tunes. I am really out of shape.
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Pablomago
Joined: Mar 23, 2017
Posts: 85
Fort Collins, CO/Moonstone Beach, CA
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Posted on Apr 07 2017 01:24 PM
There is so much that can be done with rhythm guitar. Accents, counterpoint, drive, keeping the groove together. Lot's of fun to play. Little things make a big difference.
I've also played a lot of back up to fiddle players in old time, bluegrass and Celtic musics. That will get your time solid and teach you dynamics and how to respond to what the other musicians and vocalists are doing.
While some bands do quite well as a three piece, I think rhythm guitar adds a lot to the music. Yeah, it's another person to pay, take up room on stage, more gear to move, but if it serves the music it's worth it.
— All opinions expressed by this poster are well thought out and based on actual experience and/or scientific experimentation, except for those which are knee-jerk reactions or good sounding fantasies.
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ArtS
Joined: May 09, 2008
Posts: 1356
Isle of Kent, MD
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Posted on Apr 07 2017 03:46 PM
When I played rhythm I tried to find a tone that would not clash with the lead. Also, it always helps if you know your parts rock solid so the lead can toy around with different ideas. If you want a fairly versatile and slightly under the radar rhythm guitarist check out Mark English of the Space Cossacks. He does a lot of counter melody stuff, straight rhythm and always seeks to compliment IvanP. Never more evident than during the classic "Tsunami Tsurprise".
— Surfcat
Agent Octopus
Agent Octopus Bandcamp
Wake up Jimmy! It's Christmastime! - New Single
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CrazyAces
Joined: Jul 31, 2012
Posts: 4053
Nashville, TN.
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Posted on Apr 07 2017 04:27 PM
An old timer friend of mine once said "Rhythm guitar is what you do/play 90 percent of the time and yet most players only put 10 percent of their time into learning how to do it well"
Cheers,
Jeff
— http://www.facebook.com/CrazyAcesMusic
http://www.youtube.com/user/crazyacesrock
http://www.reverbnation.com/crazyacesmusic
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JohnnyMosrite
Joined: Jun 14, 2006
Posts: 903
New York City area
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Posted on Apr 07 2017 07:01 PM
Rhythm guitar - done properly - is getting to be a lost art. It is the last aspect of guitar playing that I tackled when I started playing. I got my fingers coordinated on bass and lead parts first.
There is a discipline in gypsy jazz called 'le pompe' the rhythm sound of a Selmer Maccaferri that simulates a drum snare. It is not easy to learn but definitely worth learning.
I've always felt that to be a good lead player, one had to be a good rhythm player as well. Sadly, I've met some brilliant lead players who never learned the rhythm accompaniment to their melodies. Some even considered it beneath them. A bit shortsighted to me but that's the way the pick sticks and the strums hum.
When I learn a tune, I always start with the rhythm chords and play along. The lead melody then comes a lot easier and mentally, I know what chord change is going on behind it. And from that, I know when the rhythm is off or a chord was missed.
That's what works for me..
J Mo'
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h3dg3h0g
Joined: Jun 27, 2015
Posts: 236
San Francisco East Bay Area
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Posted on Apr 08 2017 10:31 AM
When I got back in to playing guitar, I found playing rhythm painful because I had not developed proper technique and strength to fret barre chords correctly. Pain of course detracted from practicing proper technique.
I would suggest that anyone with a similar experience take a lesson or two with someone who can review your technique. Carpal tunnel will really negatively impact your rhythm playing. 
— Jonathan the Reverbivore
The Reverbivores
Please check out our latest album The Reverbivores Watch TV!
www.thereverbivores.com
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Squid
Joined: Aug 22, 2010
Posts: 1018
Portland, Oregon with Insanitizers
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Posted on Apr 08 2017 11:19 AM
h3dg3h0g wrote:
When I got back in to playing guitar, I found playing rhythm painful because I had not developed proper technique and strength to fret barre chords correctly. Pain of course detracted from practicing proper technique.
If you play mostly bar chords, muted notes and tic-tics you might as well use very light strings, adjust action as low as you can like, and use thin picks. These will decrease finger pressure needed. Comparing different guitars should also be useful, it's about neck shape as well as thickness.
— Insanitizers! http://www.insanitizers.com
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Rondo1
Joined: Apr 01, 2016
Posts: 89
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Posted on Apr 08 2017 04:45 PM
Go to a bad "blues jam" if you want to experience a bunch of no rhythm playing clowns. Soloing on top of vocals, other players solos etc. Like Miles Davis told John Coltrane, "Try takin' the horn out of your mouth once and while".
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