Strumming Up

wooza

Joined: Apr 24, 2006
Posts: 1618
Ithaca, NY
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Posted on Jun 24 2007 06:51 PM

I noticed while playing my strat that when I strum up on the strings (particularly the low E and A) that it gives off a deeper, gutsier tone with a sorta warbled sound. Has anyone else noticed this sort of effect? Any ideas what the sonic physics behind the difference in sound is?
And I was thinking about it, do you think this could potentially be part of how Dick Dale gets such a huge sound? Maybe I should buy left-handed guitars and string them backwards...

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JakeDobner

Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 12159
Seattle
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Posted on Jun 24 2007 06:56 PM

The 'gutsier' tone is due to the low strings being the most recently struck string.

Dick Dale doesn't play chords enough for this to effect his music.

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JakeDobner

Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 12159
Seattle
5 News Pins

Posted on Jun 24 2007 06:57 PM

Also, I believe the angle and direction of which your pick hits the string will effect the tone, although I do not believe this is causing the effect as you noticed it as much as the low strings being the last hit

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revmike

Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 3824
North Atlantic
Canada

Posted on Jun 24 2007 07:15 PM

I suspect it is also the strength/ force being less and less even in an upward strum. I'm sure if you focused on this (plus Jake's suggestions) this will take care of the issue.

Rev

—

Canadian Surf

http://www.urbansurfkings.com/

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wooza

Joined: Apr 24, 2006
Posts: 1618
Ithaca, NY
1 Download Pin

Posted on Jun 24 2007 10:04 PM

I think it may be more a matter of pick angle/uneven force on the string--sort of a dragging of the pick across it rather that a quicker downward pluck. It wasn't something I noticed strumming up through an entire chord. Rather, the strings sound gutsier relative to themselves when individually plucked upward instead of down.
Rev, you mentioned this being an "issue." Maybe I gave the impression that it's a problem. Actually, it sounds really cool when this happens. I guess I'm wondering how it can be recreated.
Thanks for the help guys.

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JakeDobner

Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 12159
Seattle
5 News Pins

Posted on Jun 24 2007 10:07 PM

That is what I said, but worded poorly. I realized I said direction when I meant angle.

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Joelman

Joined: Sep 07, 2006
Posts: 1500
Redlands, CA
United States

Posted on Jun 24 2007 11:59 PM

wooza

Do you use the minimun effort picking method when you play guitar? That is where you pick one note down and the next one up. It is like tremolo picking but usually not as fast.
The different sound you are hearing is very real. But what it is, is the same as do, ra, me. said backwards. It's the same notes, but they sound different when said in a different order. For instance, make a open Am and strum slowly up, then down. The difference is eerie even though they are the same cord. It's just the asending and decending tonal structure that makes the sounds different.

Joel

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wooza

Joined: Apr 24, 2006
Posts: 1618
Ithaca, NY
1 Download Pin

Posted on Jun 25 2007 02:47 AM

Joel, I don't use that method you described (though I do go for plenty of fast tremolo picking). The whole backwards chord thing is a cool effect, but not really what I'm hearing. It's just a matter of striking the 6th string downward sounding different than striking it upward (not as part of a chord, just the lone string). It's just an interesting effect I noticed. It's actually harder to distinguish within a full chord. I guess it's just a physical difference in the plucking of the string that accounts for it, rather than some aural musical trick. I don't need to analyze it too much. It just sounds cool.

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surfneptune

Joined: Mar 16, 2006
Posts: 923
3 News Pins

Posted on Jun 25 2007 12:37 PM

So much of your tone comes from the right hand, it is worth really concentrating on where you pick in relation to the bridge, how you pick (does the string vibrate vertically or laterally) How deep you pick, what the pick is made of, if you are driving the pickups too hard or not hard enough...

I bet you are pulling the string out a tad more when you up-pick than when you down pick. So the string is vibrating in a different direction.

My two cents

—

THe NEpTuNeS

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SurfBandBill

Joined: Mar 15, 2006
Posts: 1487
San Francisco
1 News Pin

Posted on Jun 25 2007 03:56 PM

I'm with Tom on this one -- I notice that when I "up" pick there is a lot more slap because I find that picking motion draws the string out further away from the pickup, and there is a result simiar to slapping on a bass that really pops the reverb.

~B~

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wooza Joined: Apr 24, 2006 Posts: 1618 Ithaca, NY	Posted on Jun 24 2007 06:51 PM I noticed while playing my strat that when I strum up on the strings (particularly the low E and A) that it gives off a deeper, gutsier tone with a sorta warbled sound. Has anyone else noticed this sort of effect? Any ideas what the sonic physics behind the difference in sound is? And I was thinking about it, do you think this could potentially be part of how Dick Dale gets such a huge sound? Maybe I should buy left-handed guitars and string them backwards... Top
JakeDobner Joined: Feb 26, 2006 Posts: 12159 Seattle	Posted on Jun 24 2007 06:56 PM The 'gutsier' tone is due to the low strings being the most recently struck string. Dick Dale doesn't play chords enough for this to effect his music. Top
JakeDobner Joined: Feb 26, 2006 Posts: 12159 Seattle	Posted on Jun 24 2007 06:57 PM Also, I believe the angle and direction of which your pick hits the string will effect the tone, although I do not believe this is causing the effect as you noticed it as much as the low strings being the last hit Top
revmike Joined: Feb 26, 2006 Posts: 3824 North Atlantic	Posted on Jun 24 2007 07:15 PM I suspect it is also the strength/ force being less and less even in an upward strum. I'm sure if you focused on this (plus Jake's suggestions) this will take care of the issue. Rev — Canadian Surf http://www.urbansurfkings.com/ Top
wooza Joined: Apr 24, 2006 Posts: 1618 Ithaca, NY	Posted on Jun 24 2007 10:04 PM I think it may be more a matter of pick angle/uneven force on the string--sort of a dragging of the pick across it rather that a quicker downward pluck. It wasn't something I noticed strumming up through an entire chord. Rather, the strings sound gutsier relative to themselves when individually plucked upward instead of down. Rev, you mentioned this being an "issue." Maybe I gave the impression that it's a problem. Actually, it sounds really cool when this happens. I guess I'm wondering how it can be recreated. Thanks for the help guys. Top
JakeDobner Joined: Feb 26, 2006 Posts: 12159 Seattle	Posted on Jun 24 2007 10:07 PM That is what I said, but worded poorly. I realized I said direction when I meant angle. Top
Joelman Joined: Sep 07, 2006 Posts: 1500 Redlands, CA	Posted on Jun 24 2007 11:59 PM wooza Do you use the minimun effort picking method when you play guitar? That is where you pick one note down and the next one up. It is like tremolo picking but usually not as fast. The different sound you are hearing is very real. But what it is, is the same as do, ra, me. said backwards. It's the same notes, but they sound different when said in a different order. For instance, make a open Am and strum slowly up, then down. The difference is eerie even though they are the same cord. It's just the asending and decending tonal structure that makes the sounds different. Joel Top
wooza Joined: Apr 24, 2006 Posts: 1618 Ithaca, NY	Posted on Jun 25 2007 02:47 AM Joel, I don't use that method you described (though I do go for plenty of fast tremolo picking). The whole backwards chord thing is a cool effect, but not really what I'm hearing. It's just a matter of striking the 6th string downward sounding different than striking it upward (not as part of a chord, just the lone string). It's just an interesting effect I noticed. It's actually harder to distinguish within a full chord. I guess it's just a physical difference in the plucking of the string that accounts for it, rather than some aural musical trick. I don't need to analyze it too much. It just sounds cool. Top
surfneptune Joined: Mar 16, 2006 Posts: 923	Posted on Jun 25 2007 12:37 PM So much of your tone comes from the right hand, it is worth really concentrating on where you pick in relation to the bridge, how you pick (does the string vibrate vertically or laterally) How deep you pick, what the pick is made of, if you are driving the pickups too hard or not hard enough... I bet you are pulling the string out a tad more when you up-pick than when you down pick. So the string is vibrating in a different direction. My two cents — THe NEpTuNeS Top
SurfBandBill Joined: Mar 15, 2006 Posts: 1487 San Francisco	Posted on Jun 25 2007 03:56 PM I'm with Tom on this one -- I notice that when I "up" pick there is a lot more slap because I find that picking motion draws the string out further away from the pickup, and there is a result simiar to slapping on a bass that really pops the reverb. ~B~ Top

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