JObeast
Joined: Jul 24, 2012
Posts: 2762
Finknabad, Squinkistan
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Posted on Oct 26 2015 09:22 PM
Raveonettes are more Duane Eddy and Everly Bros. influenced than surf, but yeah, they are way cool. They are miles ahead of US bands that don't have any real love of foundational music influences – I mean Ronny SPector sings on "Ode to L.A." on Pretty in Black, for cryin' out loud. Raveonettes are
anything but dilettantes.
"Surfer Billy" is a cute enuf song. The drummer is WAY, WAY cuter than the music. I guess it's good that the Fender guitar and amp is fetishized, perhaps it points in a more guitaristic direction.
One thing missing in contemporary hipster music is real musicianship, the cyborganic melding of player with instrument. They are truly a bunch of wussies. And there is NO place in surf for wussies.
— Squink Out!
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JakeDobner
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 12159
Seattle
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Posted on Oct 26 2015 09:32 PM
Again, the misuse of the word hipster! Hipsters are evil and vile. Young people who are mediocre are just to be forgotten.
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JObeast
Joined: Jul 24, 2012
Posts: 2762
Finknabad, Squinkistan
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Posted on Oct 26 2015 10:06 PM
_Maybe you are on to something there, Jake. Hipsters are voiding the social landscape of language capable of transmitting any clear ideas or sincere emotions. That is a definite trait of forces of evil. They employ hot girls to distract our attention, that's typical devil stuff. The biggest tip-off is there is no rhyme or reason to any of the crap they put out – it's all corrosive of meaning, incapable of fresh expression. I should resist the temptation to feel pity and just crush them, like I would a poisonous viper crossing my path. But the hot chicks...
— Squink Out!
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psychonaut
Joined: Dec 08, 2007
Posts: 1306
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Posted on Oct 26 2015 10:11 PM
JObeast wrote:
Raveonettes are more Duane Eddy and Everly Bros. influenced than surf, but yeah, they are way cool. They are miles ahead of US bands that don't have any real love of foundational music influences – I mean Ronny SPector sings on "Ode to L.A." on Pretty in Black, for cryin' out loud. Raveonettes are
anything but dilettantes.
"Surfer Billy" is a cute enuf song. The drummer is WAY, WAY cuter than the music. I guess it's good that the Fender guitar and amp is fetishized, perhaps it points in a more guitaristic direction.
One thing missing in contemporary hipster music is real musicianship, the cyborganic melding of player with instrument. They are truly a bunch of wussies. And there is NO place in surf for wussies.
Objectifying the girl drummer... Um... OK...
I fail to see how they are bad musicians. Sure they're not virtuosos, but they are playing in time, singing in key, and write well structured songs that are well played. The guitar tone is good - many around here would like tone like that. I'm not crazy about them, not quite my cup of tea, but I certainly wouldn't classify them as bad. I've heard much much worse. So I don't understand what you have against this band. As i stated earlier somewhere in this thread, it's very easy to criticize, not so easy to create. Can you come up with something as good or better? I mean writing, arranging, performing, and recording music that's superior quality? And I'm not being snotty, it's a legitimate question.
— https://www.facebook.com/coffindagger
http://coffindaggers.com/
http://thecoffindaggers.bandcamp.com
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JObeast
Joined: Jul 24, 2012
Posts: 2762
Finknabad, Squinkistan
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Posted on Oct 26 2015 11:02 PM
I don't hate them at all. But what I hate is how none of these type of hipster lifestyle bands really play hard, push themselves to do anything beyond the very basic. It's a homeostatic scene, as I mentioned above. How to compare what's going on in American pop with what happened in O.C. 53 years ago? The standards of even teenage guitarists were so far beyond what is tolerated now. A heavy player is look at askance, like he's trying to by Joey Bonamassa, "uncool".
A big part of my frustration is the failure here in ILL Noise so far to hook up with anyone dedicated to anything surf. All the ads that mention it treat it like it's another form of classic rock or blooz (old guys) or it's a meaningless moniker that denotes some lifestyle reference that has nothing to do with guitar playing (hipsters). ALternately, I get replies from guys who live 130 miles away and just say, 'damn!' It's not like I'm not trying to improve my playing; I write and arrange music and render classic surf. Its hard to kick against the pricks.
— Squink Out!
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JakeDobner
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 12159
Seattle
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Posted on Oct 26 2015 11:43 PM
JObeast wrote:
How to compare what's going on in American pop with what happened in O.C. 53 years ago? The standards of even teenage guitarists were so far beyond what is tolerated now.
My friends and I have recently began to lament the demise of 'guitar music'. A really broad term, but the prominence of the guitar is really waning. Just a decade ago there was some amazing guitar work out there(Nick Zinner of the Yeah Yeahs Yeahs, Raveonettes, Interpol, Daniel Rossen of Grizzly Bear, the Strokes. This was the stuff poised to break through, but never broke through the zeitgeist once people my age turned not age 23 and were replaced.
I would never consider guitar to be the 'be-all, end-all' of instruments but electronic instruments aren't not being used well. I love synths and I like a number of electronic bands. I just don't like bad music, and that is what most of this music is.
But, on the bright side. There is still good new music coming out, bands that are good live, and established artists still making great music. Oh, and we have 50+ years of modern music to sift through. I don't think I've even heard 0.01% of it.
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tigermask
Joined: May 06, 2015
Posts: 33
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Posted on Oct 26 2015 11:52 PM
JakeDobner wrote:
Yep, pretty damn surfy. That song is really hard to listen to(the lyrics are fucking inane). But... it is surf to these ears. It has vocals, yes. But it is more surf than Ventures stuff to me.
It's funny, the Raveonettes had a pretty strong 'surf' lead guitar sound. It wasn't surfy from a songwriting standpoint, and they never referred to themselves as surf. I'm surprised I don't see more bands in this movement citing them as an influence.
And actually, reviewers of the last Raveonettes album Pe'Ahi referred to the album as 'surfy' despite it being hands down the furthest thing from surf music they have done. The album, has surf symbology and is about being at the beach. Sune, lead guitar, having being in a instrumental surf band sure knows what surf music is but chose to write about the beach in a different way due to his experience. His experience being a near drowning.
I agree. It sounds surfy to me too although that singing kinda kills it for me.
What I think they are doing here is going for a surf version of The Cramps and she being the female Lux Interior.
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psychonaut
Joined: Dec 08, 2007
Posts: 1306
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Posted on Oct 26 2015 11:59 PM
JObeast wrote:
I don't hate them at all. But what I hate is how none of these type of hipster lifestyle bands really play hard, push themselves to do anything beyond the very basic. It's a homeostatic scene, as I mentioned above. How to compare what's going on in American pop with what happened in O.C. 53 years ago? The standards of even teenage guitarists were so far beyond what is tolerated now. A heavy player is look at askance, like he's trying to by Joey Bonamassa, "uncool".
I'm not sure I follow you. A lot of people like basic music and theres nothing wrong with that. I'm not quite sure what a hipster lifestyle entails, but it's a bit of a gross generalization to lump every young band together like that. What do you mean by "play hard" as in metal or punk? Or "push themselves beyond the very basic"? Did the Ramones push themselves to do anything beyond basic 3 chord riffing? Link Wray built his entire career on 3 chords.
You really can't compare anything from 53 years ago to now. It's a different world, different century. Why would someone of your age care what kids that are in a scene your not part of are into? Or even give a crap what they think? Kids think Bonamassa is uncool because that's the kind of stuff their dad's listen to, and that's perfectly normal. (come to think of it, I don't think he's all that cool either, and I wouldn't pit him against Black Sabbath in the heavy dept.)
A big part of my frustration is the failure here in ILL Noise so far to hook up with anyone dedicated to anything surf. All the ads that mention it treat it like it's another form of classic rock or blooz (old guys) or it's a meaningless moniker that denotes some lifestyle reference that has nothing to do with guitar playing (hipsters). ALternately, I get replies from guys who live 130 miles away and just say, 'damn!' It's not like I'm not trying to improve my playing; I write and arrange music and render classic surf. Its hard to kick against the pricks.
Well what can I tell you, it's not easy to find like minded players. Never was. I think almost everyone here can tell a similar tale. But keep in mind, you've chosen to play a kind of niche music that 99% of the public is not aware of. Not one single person that's ever been in my band wanted to play surf or instro music at first. If they ended up in the band it's because they had an open mind and were willing to try it, but they weren't easy to find and it wasn't their idea. I've gone through a lot of people, drummers in particular to get to this point in time. It's been fucking harder than you can ever imagine to get it together and keep it going all these years. I've had so many craigslist nightmares that I could write a book about it, No one would believe it though -- an endless stream of time wasters, jerks, a-holes, incompetents and flakes. Not to mention all the people that did follow through but couldn't cut it at all. And the band started way before craigslist existed, so I went through all that with printed ads too! It sucks, but it's life and one can either bitch and moan about it or perservere and get on with it, but the two are mutually exclusive. All I can say beyond that is keep at it and good luck.
— https://www.facebook.com/coffindagger
http://coffindaggers.com/
http://thecoffindaggers.bandcamp.com
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nick123
Joined: Oct 01, 2013
Posts: 82
San Pedro, California
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Posted on Oct 27 2015 02:08 AM
I know that gut wrenching feeling I get when I see the "surf" label applied to bands which do not sound surf. I regreettably can't avoid it and wish my automatic response was a positive rather than a negative one. Having strong reactions to bands I may or may not like, I've found, is a black tunnel that just leads to a brick wall of negativity.
Realizing I'm prone to it, I've taught myself the principle of stepping back from close mindedness. I can dislike the sounds or ethos of a group and choose to not listen to them. But beyond this, I think it evebtually becomes self destructive. What I've been doing lately, metaphoricall,is looking at music like the color prism. Whatever noise I'm hearing falls somewhere in the spectrum. And I see this spectrum as life, for what it's worth.
So I acknowledge this music that I can't stand is being made by another person, somewhere on the same spectrum
I'm in. So I forge this mental solidarity with things I don't find pleasing, because I acknowledge we're all sitting in the same spectrum! What I find horrible suddenly becomes a "celebration of life" (good album too). A good instead of a bad. I fail often at this, as it is a work in progress (and extends beyond just music...politics for instance).
Far out, forgive me. I didn't watch the video so no comment there.
Last edited: Oct 27, 2015 02:12:45
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J_T
Joined: May 16, 2012
Posts: 55
Kallangur, QLD
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Posted on Oct 27 2015 05:22 AM
I got to talking to one of these young hipster folk about surf music once. He wasn't in a band but was a musician and had a lot of friends who were also musicians. He acknowledged that whilst the new surf rock wasn't the same as traditional surf instro both he and his friends did listen to and were influenced by stuff like Dick Dale and the Atlantics. I did find this surprising as like most of you I find it hard to hear the link between traditional surf music and what is often called surf these days. But I guess its nothing new, Taman Shud were calling themselves surf in the late sixties and they're something different again.
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Clarry
Joined: Oct 01, 2014
Posts: 519
Streatham, London
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Posted on Oct 27 2015 05:42 AM
JObeast wrote:
Here is one comment from the Allah-Las web page:
I saw the Allah-Las at the Eagle Rock street fair a few years ago. They are all about mid-60s LA style, with white jeans and period-correct gear and technique. But they have the good taste to simply call their schtick 'garage'.
They're a very good band. Have that 65-66 vibe, a bit softer than all-out "garage" and some great riffy songs. There's a great couple of full gig videos on youtube.
As far as band "identity" goes, I've made my lot remove the term "mod" and the red, white and blue "mod target" from our posters. Doing 3 Small Faces and 3 Who songs out of a set of 40, does not a make you a mod band!
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djangodeadman
Joined: Jan 25, 2007
Posts: 1569
Brighton UK
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Posted on Oct 27 2015 06:19 AM
I've just been listening to the Crushed Out album. I quite like it ("quite" being the operative word here; I didn't buy it, so I guess I didn't like it THAT much). It's pretty hard to argue against there being a surf (in the sense that we use the term around these parts) influence in some of the guitars, but neither are they a surf band (in the way that we use the term). Mind you, they don't claim to be a surf band, if you look at their website, just that surf is an influence.
— Los Fantasticos
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Ariel
Joined: Aug 29, 2009
Posts: 1556
Israel
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Posted on Oct 27 2015 09:09 AM
djangodeadman wrote:
Mind you, they don't claim to be a surf band, if you look at their website, just that surf is an influence.
But they do. "Crushed Out is an electrified honky-tonk surf duo from Brooklyn..." ...whatever that means. It's a post modernistic mangle of terms that describes nothing. I guess is as good a definition as any...
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skeeter
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 2065
Virginia, USA
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Posted on Oct 27 2015 09:16 AM
I don't care, they can label it whatever they want.
Just as long as they don't mess with the "windsurfing" genre!
— Paul
Atomic Mosquitos
Bug music for bug people is here!
Killers from Space
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djangodeadman
Joined: Jan 25, 2007
Posts: 1569
Brighton UK
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Posted on Oct 27 2015 09:18 AM
DreadInBabylon wrote:
djangodeadman wrote:
Mind you, they don't claim to be a surf band, if you look at their website, just that surf is an influence.
But they do. "Crushed Out is an electrified honky-tonk surf duo from Brooklyn..." ...whatever that means. It's a post modernistic mangle of terms that describes nothing. I guess is as good a definition as any...
Fair enough, I missed that. Just to the right of that a number of influences are listed. Surf is just one of them.
— Los Fantasticos
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Syndicateofsurf
Joined: Oct 08, 2014
Posts: 1073
Northern Ohio
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Posted on Oct 27 2015 10:33 AM
skeeter wrote:
I don't care, they can label it whatever they want.
Just as long as they don't mess with the "windsurfing" genre!
Let's all start a Windsurf band! And fly to the Netherlands, my homeland! And the pretty pretty girls!
Das entertainment!
— Da Vinci Flinglestein,
The quest for the Tone, the tone of the Quest
The Syndicate of Surf on YouTube
http://www.syndicateofsurf.com/
http://sharawaji.com/
http://surfrockradio.com/
Last edited: Oct 27, 2015 10:33:42
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JohnnyMosrite
Joined: Jun 14, 2006
Posts: 913
New York City area
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Posted on Oct 27 2015 10:23 PM
Psychonaut - er Mr. Dominicis..
I was away but read some of your posts:
Even more than all of that, no kid/20 something gives a damn what the opinion of some aged out musician is. Sorry. It is a harsh truth.
Vic - I can't speak as to whether you ever had children or not. You are partially right. As a parent, somewhere in pre-teen years, you become the biggest dope, listening to the dumbest music and other pursuits in your child's view. Then - after the teen years - say around 19,20,21 years old, you suddenly morph into the smartest person your offspring ever knew. I can't explain it; I just waited patiently on the post teen side.
As for craigslist, I have stories of craigslist that might give your experiences a run for the money.
I had a long road trip and I made a point of listening to your first CD again on the trip. It was a little more interesting this round.
And I listened (again) to this duo from Brooklyn. Nope - it still sucks.
J Mo'
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JObeast
Joined: Jul 24, 2012
Posts: 2762
Finknabad, Squinkistan
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Posted on Oct 27 2015 11:25 PM
This is precisely what I mean, more than any other thing, you said it, Dread. Their flippancy is the most hipsterish and lamest apsectof an otherwise OK band that's not half bad looking (again, with that drummer). It's not about their putative violation of purism, it's just that they don't give a damn. I find this the signal characteristic of their scene. L A Z Y - M I N D E D N E S S
DreadInBabylon wrote:
djangodeadman wrote:
Mind you, they don't claim to be a surf band, if you look at their website, just that surf is an influence.
But they do. "Crushed Out is an electrified honky-tonk surf duo from Brooklyn..." ...whatever that means. It's a post modernistic mangle of terms that describes nothing. I guess is as good a definition as any...
— Squink Out!
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JObeast
Joined: Jul 24, 2012
Posts: 2762
Finknabad, Squinkistan
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Posted on Oct 27 2015 11:30 PM
THe way that guy pronounces 'nice' and 'night'...
(Ummm, the girl in the middle is hot)
skeeter wrote:
I don't care, they can label it whatever they want.
Just as long as they don't mess with the "windsurfing" genre!
— Squink Out!
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Syndicateofsurf
Joined: Oct 08, 2014
Posts: 1073
Northern Ohio
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Posted on Oct 28 2015 06:12 AM
You know these guys will dry up and blow away like fog off the bay. Not sure anymore why we care. They're mediocre. Taking a stab at the brass ring. Who isn't? And it seems most of us agree their big strength is a hot drummer who, let's give her some credit, plays way better than Meg White.
Anyways...
— Da Vinci Flinglestein,
The quest for the Tone, the tone of the Quest
The Syndicate of Surf on YouTube
http://www.syndicateofsurf.com/
http://sharawaji.com/
http://surfrockradio.com/
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