I don't know much about effects pedals, which did the Denver men use?

WaimeaBay

Joined: Jul 05, 2006
Posts: 969
United States

Posted on Mar 25 2015 08:19 PM

The Denver men used some really cool effects. Does anyone know what they have going on here? I am assuming some type of delay?

Last edited: Mar 25, 2015 20:24:54

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shake_n_stomp

Joined: Jan 09, 2014
Posts: 615
Vancouver BC
Canada

Posted on Mar 25 2015 08:35 PM

Most likely a tape echo device that would have been in production at that time like the Echolette.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUxr4RZL6IQ
Or the Ray Butts Echosonic amp:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5I3rWiseBU

—

Lorne
The Surf Shakers: https://www.facebook.com/TheSurfShakers
Vancouver BC Canada

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Brian

Joined: Feb 25, 2006
Posts: 19294
Des Moines, Iowa, USA
United States

Posted on Mar 25 2015 08:55 PM

I believe they used a Klempf Echolette tape echo unit, ~~the same as their heroes The Shadows from England~~. If you like that song, check out Hank Marvin and The Shadows.

—

Site dude - S3 Agent #202
Need help with the site? SG101 FAQ - Send me a private message - Email me

"It starts... when it begins" -- Ralf Kilauea

Last edited: Mar 25, 2015 21:55:50

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WaimeaBay

Joined: Jul 05, 2006
Posts: 969
United States

Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:08 PM

thanks for the replies guys. I guess the UK Eagles used something similar as well?

Yeah, I like the Shadows, but don't know enough of their material. It seems the echo they used is a bit more subtle, at least in the tracks I know.

Is there an affordable tape echo pedal on the market that does a good job capturing the sounds of the Eagles or Shadows?

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IvanP

Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 10331
southern Michigan
United States

Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:18 PM

The Denvermen indeed used a German-made Klemt Echolette tube tape echo unit, as did the Atlantics. But no British bands, including the Shadows, used this unit - the Shadows used the Italian-made Meazzi Echomatic in the very early days, and later on another Italian-made unit, the Binson Echorec (and then in the '70s and '80s, the Echoplex and Roland units). (See this website for the full rundown.)

The Shadows used very heavy echo on more than a few songs from '60 and '61, but toned it down after that. Check out something like My Resistance is Low, for an example of heavy echo.

Any echo pedal will get you roughly into this territory, but what was unique about those early '60s tape echo units is that they had multiple (and staggered) recording heads which created unique effects usually not reproducible with modern pedals. There are a few pedals that have multi-head (or as they're sometimes known, multitap) echo settings: I use a Strymon El Capistan dTape Echo pedal, but that's pretty expensive. Line 6 Echo Park is probably the most affordable pedal with that capability.

Hope that helps! Have fun with it!

—

Ivan
Lords of Atlantis on Facebook
The Madeira Official Website
The Madeira on Facebook
The Blair-Pongracic Band on Facebook
The Space Cossacks on Facebook
The Madeira Channel on YouTube

Last edited: Mar 25, 2015 21:44:15

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WaimeaBay

Joined: Jul 05, 2006
Posts: 969
United States

Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:26 PM

Thanks for the informative reply Ivan. I am going to have to pick at your expertise just a bit more!

In the above example the Denver Men get that tape echo sound, then right into that reverb sound. Obviously in a studio that can be easily done. Are you able to switch between those two sounds with your pedal. Does the pedal work with a reverb tank or is it a one or the other type deal?

I hope I am articulating my thoughts properly here.

I am going to go check out that Shadows suggestion now :). Most obliged.

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WaimeaBay

Joined: Jul 05, 2006
Posts: 969
United States

Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:30 PM

Oh and Happy 15th Ivan

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IvanP

Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 10331
southern Michigan
United States

Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:32 PM

My guess is that there's no reverb on that guitar - it's the same echo setting through the entire song, no switching of any kind necessary. They get the exaggerated echo sound at the beginning of the song by right-hand palm-muting the notes to make the echo 'pop out', after which they switch into long, flowing lines where the echo is not so obvious and exaggerated, but it's still there, if you listen closely to the notes.

BTW, below is one my favorite Denvermen tracks, with lovely echo, from the great (and only) album they put out, "Let's Go Surfside". Brian is right to compare them to the Shadows - I don't think I know of another '60s band that was able to sound SO MUCH like the Shadows as the Denvermen!

—

Ivan
Lords of Atlantis on Facebook
The Madeira Official Website
The Madeira on Facebook
The Blair-Pongracic Band on Facebook
The Space Cossacks on Facebook
The Madeira Channel on YouTube

Last edited: Mar 25, 2015 21:33:41

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WaimeaBay

Joined: Jul 05, 2006
Posts: 969
United States

Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:38 PM

Yes, I totally agree. I listened to "My Resistance". Wow, you can clearly see how influenced the Denver Men were by the Shadows sounds.

Thank you all for the tape echo 101 course tonight.

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IvanP

Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 10331
southern Michigan
United States

Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:47 PM

WaimeaBay wrote:

Yes, I totally agree. I listened to "My Resistance". Wow, you can clearly see how influenced the Denver Men were by the Shadows sounds.

Oh yeah, definitely! On more than a few occasions I've played the game of 'which Shadows song are the Denvermen copying here?'

Thank you all for the tape echo 101 course tonight.

Glad to be of help!

Oh and Happy 15th Ivan

Thank you!! Hard to believe....

—

Ivan
Lords of Atlantis on Facebook
The Madeira Official Website
The Madeira on Facebook
The Blair-Pongracic Band on Facebook
The Space Cossacks on Facebook
The Madeira Channel on YouTube

Top

Badger

Joined: Nov 16, 2013
Posts: 4536
Wisconsin
United States

Posted on Mar 26 2015 06:08 AM

IvanP wrote:

Line 6 Echo Park is probably the most affordable pedal with that capability.

Good call - and well-deserved anniversary wishes too. (You'll probably get slapped around like that for awhile now, lol).

I have the Behringer exact clone of the Echo Park, which is actually quite good now that company quality control folks are onsite at the factory. That pedal - if you do your reading & tweaking - has a couple Multitap settings that will get you close, especially for a performance situation. Multi-2 will give you a really good Shadowy echo for general use, Multi-1 has a varying rhythm to the repeats and is great for setting up a "go-to" Apache type setting.

(Note: The Chinglish in the Behringer pedal's doc isn't good, so even if you buy one to play with some echo as a start, download the Echo Park manual and use that.)

—

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

Last edited: Mar 26, 2015 06:08:53

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WaimeaBay Joined: Jul 05, 2006 Posts: 969	Posted on Mar 25 2015 08:19 PM The Denver men used some really cool effects. Does anyone know what they have going on here? I am assuming some type of delay? Last edited: Mar 25, 2015 20:24:54 Top
shake_n_stomp Joined: Jan 09, 2014 Posts: 615 Vancouver BC	Posted on Mar 25 2015 08:35 PM Most likely a tape echo device that would have been in production at that time like the Echolette. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUxr4RZL6IQ Or the Ray Butts Echosonic amp: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5I3rWiseBU — Lorne The Surf Shakers: https://www.facebook.com/TheSurfShakers Vancouver BC Canada Top
Brian Joined: Feb 25, 2006 Posts: 19294 Des Moines, Iowa, USA	Posted on Mar 25 2015 08:55 PM I believe they used a Klempf Echolette tape echo unit, ~~the same as their heroes The Shadows from England~~. If you like that song, check out Hank Marvin and The Shadows. — Site dude - S3 Agent #202 Need help with the site? SG101 FAQ - Send me a private message - Email me "It starts... when it begins" -- Ralf Kilauea Last edited: Mar 25, 2015 21:55:50 Top
WaimeaBay Joined: Jul 05, 2006 Posts: 969	Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:08 PM thanks for the replies guys. I guess the UK Eagles used something similar as well? Yeah, I like the Shadows, but don't know enough of their material. It seems the echo they used is a bit more subtle, at least in the tracks I know. Is there an affordable tape echo pedal on the market that does a good job capturing the sounds of the Eagles or Shadows? Top
IvanP Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 10331 southern Michigan	Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:18 PM The Denvermen indeed used a German-made Klemt Echolette tube tape echo unit, as did the Atlantics. But no British bands, including the Shadows, used this unit - the Shadows used the Italian-made Meazzi Echomatic in the very early days, and later on another Italian-made unit, the Binson Echorec (and then in the '70s and '80s, the Echoplex and Roland units). (See this website for the full rundown.) The Shadows used very heavy echo on more than a few songs from '60 and '61, but toned it down after that. Check out something like My Resistance is Low, for an example of heavy echo. Any echo pedal will get you roughly into this territory, but what was unique about those early '60s tape echo units is that they had multiple (and staggered) recording heads which created unique effects usually not reproducible with modern pedals. There are a few pedals that have multi-head (or as they're sometimes known, multitap) echo settings: I use a Strymon El Capistan dTape Echo pedal, but that's pretty expensive. Line 6 Echo Park is probably the most affordable pedal with that capability. Hope that helps! Have fun with it! — Ivan Lords of Atlantis on Facebook The Madeira Official Website The Madeira on Facebook The Blair-Pongracic Band on Facebook The Space Cossacks on Facebook The Madeira Channel on YouTube Last edited: Mar 25, 2015 21:44:15 Top
WaimeaBay Joined: Jul 05, 2006 Posts: 969	Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:26 PM Thanks for the informative reply Ivan. I am going to have to pick at your expertise just a bit more! In the above example the Denver Men get that tape echo sound, then right into that reverb sound. Obviously in a studio that can be easily done. Are you able to switch between those two sounds with your pedal. Does the pedal work with a reverb tank or is it a one or the other type deal? I hope I am articulating my thoughts properly here. I am going to go check out that Shadows suggestion now :). Most obliged. Top
WaimeaBay Joined: Jul 05, 2006 Posts: 969	Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:30 PM Oh and Happy 15th Ivan Top
IvanP Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 10331 southern Michigan	Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:32 PM My guess is that there's no reverb on that guitar - it's the same echo setting through the entire song, no switching of any kind necessary. They get the exaggerated echo sound at the beginning of the song by right-hand palm-muting the notes to make the echo 'pop out', after which they switch into long, flowing lines where the echo is not so obvious and exaggerated, but it's still there, if you listen closely to the notes. BTW, below is one my favorite Denvermen tracks, with lovely echo, from the great (and only) album they put out, "Let's Go Surfside". Brian is right to compare them to the Shadows - I don't think I know of another '60s band that was able to sound SO MUCH like the Shadows as the Denvermen! — Ivan Lords of Atlantis on Facebook The Madeira Official Website The Madeira on Facebook The Blair-Pongracic Band on Facebook The Space Cossacks on Facebook The Madeira Channel on YouTube Last edited: Mar 25, 2015 21:33:41 Top
WaimeaBay Joined: Jul 05, 2006 Posts: 969	Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:38 PM Yes, I totally agree. I listened to "My Resistance". Wow, you can clearly see how influenced the Denver Men were by the Shadows sounds. Thank you all for the tape echo 101 course tonight. Top
IvanP Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 10331 southern Michigan	Posted on Mar 25 2015 09:47 PM WaimeaBay wrote: Yes, I totally agree. I listened to "My Resistance". Wow, you can clearly see how influenced the Denver Men were by the Shadows sounds. Oh yeah, definitely! On more than a few occasions I've played the game of 'which Shadows song are the Denvermen copying here?' Thank you all for the tape echo 101 course tonight. Glad to be of help! Oh and Happy 15th Ivan Thank you!! Hard to believe.... — Ivan Lords of Atlantis on Facebook The Madeira Official Website The Madeira on Facebook The Blair-Pongracic Band on Facebook The Space Cossacks on Facebook The Madeira Channel on YouTube Top
Badger Joined: Nov 16, 2013 Posts: 4536 Wisconsin	Posted on Mar 26 2015 06:08 AM IvanP wrote: Line 6 Echo Park is probably the most affordable pedal with that capability. Good call - and well-deserved anniversary wishes too. (You'll probably get slapped around like that for awhile now, lol). I have the Behringer exact clone of the Echo Park, which is actually quite good now that company quality control folks are onsite at the factory. That pedal - if you do your reading & tweaking - has a couple Multitap settings that will get you close, especially for a performance situation. Multi-2 will give you a really good Shadowy echo for general use, Multi-1 has a varying rhythm to the repeats and is great for setting up a "go-to" Apache type setting. (Note: The Chinglish in the Behringer pedal's doc isn't good, so even if you buy one to play with some echo as a start, download the Echo Park manual and use that.) — Wes SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices. Last edited: Mar 26, 2015 06:08:53 Top

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I don't know much about effects pedals, which did the Denver men use?