Surfzilla
Joined: Aug 08, 2011
Posts: 42
Columbia, SC
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Posted on Dec 04 2014 07:36 PM
Love my 4-10 Bassman for surf. Last time I took her to a really nice amp builder for repair, I asked about more headroom.
He suggested changing out the speakers to something that will not break up as soon. It has the standard MojoTone super sweet Bassman lovely speakers right now. Cranked it goes to a Link Wray sound.
So anyone here put Jensons in a Bassman to remove a big reason they sound so sweet, and get more headroom? I wish it wasn't a four speaker gamble.
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Badger
Joined: Nov 16, 2013
Posts: 4537
Wisconsin
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Posted on Dec 05 2014 06:57 AM
Just curious, when you use the word headroom. Are you certain this is speaker breakup, or could the amp simply benefit from not running quite as hot a pre-amp gain section? (e.g., NOS 5751 vs. 12AX7) Again, just curious. I'd be reluctant to dive in on swapping 4 speakers also.:-)
— Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel
DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.
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mad_dog
Joined: Sep 23, 2008
Posts: 349
Montclair, NJ
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Posted on Dec 05 2014 08:20 AM
A 12ay7 in V1 would help. That's what's in my Sterling made tweed bassman. Which also has 4 of the weber 10A125 30 watt speakers. Not sure how they compare to mojo speakers. Sure do sound fine ... Haven't yet cranked my bassman. It's a pretty loud amp. If I was going to run it that way and wanted max headroom, I'd probably get 4 of the WGS G10C ceramics, or 2 or them, two of the G10C/S. The G10C sounds like an even better old Jensen ceramic. They're not quite as efficient as some higher power 10" speakers, but your amp does not lack for volume.
MD
Last edited: Dec 05, 2014 08:22:28
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BJB
Joined: Jul 28, 2008
Posts: 413
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Posted on Dec 05 2014 10:16 AM
A solid-state rectifier will help, if you don't have one in there already. Back in the 90's, before all of these custom speakers were available, people cleaned up these amps by installing the CTS speakers that were used in Super Reverbs.
— If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
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Badger
Joined: Nov 16, 2013
Posts: 4537
Wisconsin
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Posted on Dec 05 2014 03:44 PM
BJB wrote:
A solid-state rectifier will help, if you don't have one in there already. Back in the 90's, before all of these custom speakers were available, people cleaned up these amps by installing the CTS speakers that were used in Super Reverbs.
That's a neat little piece of history, thanks. 
— Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel
DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.
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derekirving
Joined: Nov 03, 2011
Posts: 660
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Posted on Dec 05 2014 03:59 PM
You maybe able to get more headroom out of your baseman 4x10 (assuming it's a tweed baseman reissue) by putting Ceramic speakers in it. I've owned a few reissue 4x10 tweed baseman's and found that I did't like the character of the amp when I changed speakers. Tweed amps are more midrange focus'ed so they will have less headroom then say a Silverface/Blackface amp. Using alnico speakers will reduce headroom a bit more but add warmth. Those tweed baseman reissues with a 5AR4 rectifier, a Weber Copper cap or stock solid state rectifier plug are quite loud and clean though. Maybe you're looking for a different tone stack, try a Super Reverb or Twin Reverb for the heck of if to see if you get the headroom you want. Additionally your guitar come's into play as well, lower output pickups will drive the amp less. You can also try less midrange too (lower the eq knob). A 12AY7 as others have mentioned is a good suggestion but you may not like the change. I just used the 12AX7 as I thought they sounded best at least in my application. Good luck ...
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tubeswell
Joined: Sep 24, 2011
Posts: 1424
Wellington, NZ
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Posted on Dec 05 2014 07:59 PM
Changing to higher-wattage speakers (with stiffer cones) is an option.
Putting in something like a copper cap solid state rectifier will increase the B+ and give more headroom. You just want to make sure that the filter caps are rated for the additional increase in B+ voltage.
Tube swapping is also an option which is cheap and easy. Any one or more of the following will clean the signal up
- 12AY7 in V1 (already suggested above)
- 5751 in V2
- 12AT7 in V3 (phase inverter)
— He who dies with the most tubes... wins
Surf Daddies
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Surfzilla
Joined: Aug 08, 2011
Posts: 42
Columbia, SC
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Posted on Dec 12 2014 12:49 PM
I've done the summary from Tubeswell:
12AY7 in V1 (already suggested above)
5751 in V2
12AT7 in V3 (phase inverter)
The '59 is boutique built based on '59 schematics and built correctly which I understand is incorrect (for all you super geeks out there). Great points on the rig for sure. The amp breaks quicker with humbucker and lipsticks. My G&L Legacy is really sweet on the amp and Reverb Unit.
Thanks for the input. I've heard good things about those WGS G10C's. I might put one in my '60 Vibrolux which sounds pretty close to my '59, just 3 less speakers. And, if it's good, I can get the other 3 later.
Last edited: Dec 12, 2014 12:50:43
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eddiekatcher
Joined: Mar 14, 2006
Posts: 2779
Atlanta, GA
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Posted on Dec 12 2014 03:05 PM
Try lowering your pickups. That's another way of reducing the initial signal to your amp's preamp. Bolder Bob had his Jazzmaster set up with the pickups set really low and his rig sounded great.
I have never owned a 4-10 Bassman but I have always been under the impression that the spongy sag and easy ramp to distortion was one of their best features to most guitar players.
I got a brand new Super Reverb amp for Christmas in 1964 and it didn't have much headroom either. One of the guys in the band had a piggyback Blonde Bassman that would stomp my Super Reverb. It also didn't have very reliable speakers as I blew eight of them before Fender changed over from paper voice coil formers to aluminum ones. After that I had no more speaker issues. Weber is supposed to have one Mackdaddy 10" speaker. I have one of Gerald's 12" ones lying around that was a monster the early 90's Concert amp I had around for a while. I ended up with a D-120 in that amp to help the reverb which was a bit wimpy.
Reverbs,
ed
— Traditional........speak softly and play through a big blonde amp. Did I mention that I still like big blonde amps?
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Surfzilla
Joined: Aug 08, 2011
Posts: 42
Columbia, SC
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Posted on Dec 15 2014 10:16 AM
eddiekatcher wrote:
Try lowering your pickups. That's another way of reducing the initial signal to your amp's preamp. Bolder Bob had his Jazzmaster set up with the pickups set really low and his rig sounded great.
You're right about that. And, operating a phillips screwdriver while the amp is cranked sounds way more fun and significantly less expensive. I've seen pickups high, and I've seen them low. Recently I've been looking at my Stewmac setup guide and a whole lot of well-known guitar players run the pickups high so I've been trying that. My lipsticks in my Dano Hornet with JM trem/mustang saddle are as high as possible without touching string. That guitar will snarl at any slight indication of a heavy right hand.
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alphaking
Joined: Jan 02, 2013
Posts: 214
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Posted on Dec 15 2014 07:57 PM
I have a '59 Bassman 4x10 clone. It came with Eminence Ceramics and had headroom for days (which was NOT what I wanted in that amp) and I swapped to Jensen p10r RI Alnicos. It gets dirtier a lot quicker and that why I bought that particular set of speakers for it. If you're going for clean headroom, I would not recommend those speakers for that. I also am running a set of NOS Tung Sol 5881's in it, and an NOS Mullard 5AR4 Rectifier. You might want to try some JJ's or a set of Winged C 6L6GC's. If you're running a 5881 it will be a lot warmer and break up sooner (in my experience), and a cleaner power tube may help as well. But as mentioned above, I think a good set of ceramic speakers would get you most of the way there.
Oh... And I'd highly recommend plugging up another cab before buying speakers if you have access to one. Just make sure you match your impedance correctly.
Last edited: Dec 15, 2014 19:59:18
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JObeast
Joined: Jul 24, 2012
Posts: 2762
Finknabad, Squinkistan
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Posted on Dec 15 2014 11:58 PM
My limited experience with tweed-type amps is through my '60 Gibson GA-20T Ranger, comparable to a Fender Deluxe of same period. I was unhappy with the sound of the original(?) speaker, a Jensen 12" AlNiCo, which broke up awful early in the amp's power curve lot, and had an ice-picky treble coupled with farty bass. Perhaps that guitar speaker had just earned its retirement after a half century... I switched it out for a ceramic Eminence Cannabis Rex and enjoy the sound of the amp more now – I am hearing more of its output now through this more neutral, higher-wattage-rated speaker. Being a 'tweed' circuit, the Ranger is not engineered to produce a high output signal that isn't laden with harmonic distortion, but the heavier speaker with more robust voice coil and stiffer cone designed to handle some 50 W RMS (the amp runs nominally about 17W RMS output) gives me confidence that what distortion I am hearing is mostly in the power amp section and not an artifact of cone breakup or voice-coil warping. That latter was what made the old Jensen so unpleasantly sibilant. Much smoother and heftier – though not the least bit 'pristine' – response with the Eminence 50W.
— Squink Out!
Last edited: Dec 16, 2014 00:00:12
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