Las_Barracudas wrote:

I just have little fondness for the days of picking up the needle and moving it back & forth on vinyl albums..... uugh

haha, thanks for rousing that memory. Actually, it was probably a faster method than some digital systems -- if'n you found the right groove.

Thanks for that insight Stevel.

I am teaching myself to sight read flatpicking guitar from a bunch 60's folk music song books.
It would be a hell of a lot easier if every song was in the same key/tuning.
How many versions of Wildwood Flower are there?
Check youtube and are they playing it the way Mother Maybelle did? Bare Thumb picking, with a thumb pick or flatpicking it?

Even with the notation is it an open B string or B on the G string, open A or A on the E string... closed notes sound better to me but are not always possible and how do you tell from a recording by ear made on a 78 from way back in the day.

Oh wait if I had the tab it would tell me.....

"Maybe there aren't any surf bands; there's only surf music?" Tuck

Last edited: Feb 03, 2013 17:57:30

No one is denying tablature's place in history or its usefulness in documenting how to play complex parts.

All a few of us are saying is: if you are an intermediate guitarist who is looking to go to the next level and all you have been doing so far is playing music from tabs, try developing your ear. You'll become a better guitar player and musician as a result. Don't use tabs as a crutch or you'll stagnate. The most important tool in your toolbox is your ears.

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Last edited: Feb 04, 2013 07:48:46

Oh I understand the need for learning by ear for sure...

But telling some one to not use tabs if available is like saying don't use Google just look it up in the Encyclopedia...
or
well back in the day I carried a boom box around on my shoulder why do you kids need these ipod thingys...
or
you know back when I wore neon and popped my collar, my cordless phone was carried in a shoulder bag... why do you need this new fangled tablet/phone/video camera/music player/encyclopedia...

Yea Noel that Carter Scratch is a whole lot harder than she makes it look.
I've been working on it for the last few months and even with some Clawhammer Banjo skills it is tough!!!
Learning guitar with a flat pick then trying to play with a thumb pick and strumming (the country boom chuck) with your fingers took some work and I still cant play it clean all the time.
Up next is putting on a finger pick to start some up picking like she did.
I don't know how those folks that do it with just a bare thumb.

I thought learning that tremolo glissando thing was hard!!!!

"Maybe there aren't any surf bands; there's only surf music?" Tuck

Last edited: Feb 04, 2013 14:39:21

I never said "Don't use tabs" I said you "shouldn't" use them.
When people ask for tabs of stuff like Mr. Moto, I really wonder just how much they are actually applying themselves to learning guitar. Songs like that are the perfect challenge for nascent guitarists to develop listening and transposing skills. I mean really, if you know an open Dminor chord, you should be able to figure that song out. To say "I have no time" to learn by ear is a poor excuse because learning an instrument requires that you devote time to it. Ear training is much more important in my view than music theory or reading music (you should know these too however). Do it how you like, but as a somewhat accomplished guitarist I offer my experience of having learned a lot more from figuring stuff out by ear than by reading music or tablature. Of course you are all free to follow the method which suits you best.

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I am not sure if I am joking or not to be honest.

I am of a mind that there are 2 kinds of people that play musical instruments I guess...
Some that want to learn to play music for a reason, like to be in a band, write their own songs, play in a coffee shop or something along those lines.

Then there are folks like myself.
Those that want to just play songs they like... to be totally honest I like to play easy songs for fun I play a lot of the stuff from Martin Cilia like December Sun & Twilight Surfer thanks to his tab site.
Tabs make that happen I would rather play 10 songs that I can learn from a tab today than spend a week trying to learn a single song by ear.

This being said I am slooowwwwly trying to learn to play Bass by ear and it is coming along.

"Maybe there aren't any surf bands; there's only surf music?" Tuck

Last edited: Feb 04, 2013 15:58:00

Brian wrote:

A better analogy is, do you do your own homework or do you look up the answers in the back of the book or on the internet?

I disagree Brian.

I don't see using notation, TAB, chord diagrams, or whatever as "cheating" when you're learning something that couldn't otherwise be learned without those aids. So to me, TAB is more like what we might today call a "pro tip" - advice, or information already learned by someone else and stored and disseminated for use.

Yes, reliance on TABs without learning anything else is going to stagnate a player for sure. But I used tabs in my "formative" years.

And maybe here's a good example: in the days of yore, before you tube, when I was learning to play I heard Van Halen on the radio and wanted to play that. My ear told me he was playing arpeggiated chords, very fast (I'm always amazed that my ear could even pick that up at that point in time). So I played triad shapes on the B G and D strings like a classical player would. I got pretty good at it. But I didn't have MTV in the house. It wasn't until I saw it tabbed out (and tapping explained by a school chum) that I understood what was really going on.

I don't feel like I cheated my learning process in any way. Quite the contrary. I jump started my playing by opening up a whole new world of possibilities by learning this new technique rather than playing what I thought my ear told me was what he was doing, but it still didn't quite sound right.

In other words, I think TAB gets a bad rap. Yes, it has it's limitations, and a primary one that it's amazingly easy for it to become a crutch. However, I would never recommend (not that I felt everyone here was doing that either) people to avoid it. I might caution players to be aware of its limitations and dark side, but when used effectively, it can be very effective.

Best,
Steve

Last edited: Feb 04, 2013 21:16:45