Your advice needed surf dudes and dudettes.

OK. Right now I'm playing only at my tiny home, but hopefully that will change (I'm actually getting better .) I currently have a Blues Jr., and I'm not happy with it, just doesn't sound right to me. Don't wanna start messing around with modding it etc.
My guitar is a wonderful ThinSkin Jazzmaster (bought after been recommended here, thank you all), and it's absolutely amazing. It's a marriage, forever. The only thing that slows her down is me. Not so with the amp, it's holding me back. I feel the need for the real deal, a vintage Fender, also to keep forever (I'm like that). I want my JM so sing with full Surf glory, no compromises. (A Reverb tank is also on the menu, but I need my amp situation sorted first.)

Locally there's not much to find, and importing an amp is crazy expensive. It's expensive anyway - but I just found a Showman 1965 head, 85v, retolexed (white. nice.) for 1300$ (thats equivalent to 700$ for you, US folks), haven't heard it yet but supposed to be in great condition and the seller is reliable. I still have to match a cab for it, but let's take it step by step.

My goal is to have a great space for recording in the future, and some gigs here and there (weddings, some open space gatherings).

So, is it too much? Am I going in over my head? Will it make me happy? (yeah, super subjective but the collective wisdom here was right for me once. I trust you guys.)
Also, will it sound good at low volumes? Will it take an attenuator and sound good at low volumes?
Obviously a Showman in not meant for home use, but still, that's where it will be most of the time anyway. And it's such a classic that my GAS gets the better of me.

Any thoughts on this?

Last edited: Oct 31, 2011 14:20:26

Thanks Matt, duly noted.

Just wanna add this:
My real fear is, as I said, it may be too much wattage. Although I like the idea of having the freaky torque, I also don't mind a little breakup. I'm not necessarily looking for the super clean sound (although I do use pedals when I need grit), just looking for the real sound. Maybe I should wait for a Bassman?

It just seems wrong and douchy for me to buy an amp only to keep it's volume on 1.5 or 2 most of the time. Like buing a Hummer only to drive to the supermarket around the corner, with the occasional road trip vacation (where you can also find other solutions i.e. micing it). But I'm well aware that logic is not all in life, and a monster amp might give me inspiration. I ride bikes, and I know when I'm sitting on a 1L machine, even when riding slowly, it blows my mind.

Gigs will be very sporadic. Mostly I want it for recording, in a good space I'm hopefully going to build.

Last edited: Oct 22, 2011 18:02:17

Are there any Deluxe Reverbs avaialbale in your area? I think that 20 watts is a lot more reasonable for your needs. I think that the Showman is overkill for your application. Great amp, fair price, but you'll need to crank it pretty loud for it to sound good. My 2 cents....

Bob

Bob

I've heard you could halve the wattage by removing 2 of the power tubes, basically making it a Bandmaster. That said, I have a Bandmaster and it's nearly too loud for home use, but I don't regret getting it.

Great input guys, thank you very much! (and keep 'em coming)

I'm going for it. Screw logic!
Vintage fenders are very scarce here indeed, and the price can't be beat. 1960's gear is already so rare even worldwide, and I'll have the chance to hold a pre-CBS original, not to hoard but to play (Surf redemption).

I'll figure out the practicalities later, cabs and whatnot, maybe even start with a cheapo 12" (I already have the BJr...), there will be time to build an immaculate custom cab later on.

I'm going to check it with my guitar tech in a couple of days, hopefully to return home with the beast. Will report here as soon as I (wishy wish) get it.

Since I'm so very exited , here's a pic of my Jazzy:

Doesn't it deserve a complimentary amp?

Thanks again.
BTW what about attenuators(or other methods)? Anyone cares to share any success stories taming the Showman?

DreadInBabylon wrote:

BTW what about attenuators(or other methods)? Anyone
cares to share any success stories taming the Showman?

I use an attenuator with my tweed Deluxe. My Deluxe ( a '53 ), is only between 10 and 15 watts and is very loud nonetheless. Loud enough to play with a drummer. Certainly too loud to crank at home. Believe it or not, even with the attenuator it's still kinda loud -- to run it at 'Bedroom' levels I have to set the attenuator to almost Zero!

Attenuators do what they are supposed to do, but they also kill alot of the high end. Most have a switch to compensate for this. Most are simply a rheostat with a resistor attached. I recomend the Weber attenuators, because they use an actual speaker motor inside, this emulates your amp and speaker interaction giving you a more natural sound. Keep in mind that some of 'that tone' comes from the speakers being pumelled as well as from the amp being cranked.

Make sure you get one that's rated at least twice the amps wattage in order to keep the amp from over heating and to preserve your tubes. And mind the ohm's!

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DreadInBabylon wrote:

Before anyone jumps, I did do a search and read
anything containing attenuators on this site. Just
want to know more specifics with the Showman, because I
am going to play it at home mostly (I know it sounds
wrong...)

Read this:
http://www.tedweber.com/atten.htm
and this:
http://www.tedweber.com/understandingattenuators.html
pretty much applies to all big, loud amps
It's a bit like capturing lightning in a bottle

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Hi Ariel,

Any update? Did you get your new baby? Had a test drive with the JM yet?
I'm sure many SG101ers have been pulling for you.

Just curious, are you familiar with The Astroglides? You many or may not know that one of their former most important members, Ran Mosessco (kick the reverb) is an active member of this forum. I'm sure you guys could share all sorts of Israel surf music stories! Incidentally, if you haven't already, be sure to check out his current AMAZING surf band, The Sand Devils. Info on the recently released album HERE

Just my $.02: If you currently have the means (as it seems you do), without question, grab that Showman!!! Keep it in reserve for your live shows--that's really what it's meant for. I wouldn't spend too much time or energy trying to figure out how to tame that beast for quiet home use.

Now, what I'm seeing as the more important issue here is your personal daily-playing tone satisfaction. This is an absolutely crucial aspect of enjoying daily practice. I've found that this has much more to do with reverb and 'unplugged technique' than anything. To a certain degree, it doesn't matter what guitar or amp you're using, if you're getting 'the drip,' you're going to be somewhat satisfied. I would've suggested investing in an actual tank, before a pro vintage head, especially if you won't be using it live for some time. I guarantee that if you got an FRV-1, you'd be extremely satisfied with your sound--not perfect, but enough to really enjoy your home practice.

Here's the other side of the coin...unplugged technique. I personally believe that a vital component to achieving 'the sound' or 'the tone' is getting as close as possible to it with nothing but your guitar and a pick--no effects, no amp, NO ELECTRICITY! I know this might sound crazy, but it becomes a huge revelation when you strip things down to that bare minimum and begin the tone quest from there. It's amazing how much your playing can improve this way. You start to become highly aware of the profound difference all the variables actually make: the type (round vs flat) and gauge of strings, the type and thickness of the pick, the angle and placement of pick attack, etc, etc, etc. It's a real eye-opener when you're axe starts to sound 'surfy' without even being plugged in!!!

Insect Surfers
The Tikiyaki Orchestra
The Scimitars
Lords Of Atlantis
Fiberglass Jungle - Surf Radio

Hi, thanks for the interest, Jonpaul!

JONPAUL wrote:

Any update? Did you get your new baby? Had a test drive
with the JM yet?
I'm sure many SG101ers have been pulling for you.

Well, it's been postponed to next week, will report as soon if/as I get it. The seller is a reputable amp builder and tech (that does know his stuff), says the amp is perfect and fully original (expect for the white Tolex, some old owner tried to make it a Blonde ... but it's cool.) Still, everything is possible... hope for the best.

Just curious, are you familiar with The
Astroglides? You many or may not know that one of
their former most important members, Ran Mosessco
(kick the reverb) is an active member of this forum.
I'm sure you guys could share all sorts of
Israel surf music stories!

Yeah I do know him, but only from this forum. We exchanged a couple of words, cool guy. Sadly, when he had the Astroglides thing, I wasn't into surf yet... Didn't even know they existed, even of the rock 'scene' here being really small . And then he left, with his tank . So no stories here... but I reckon the dude is a pro.

The only current band here I know of that reminiscent Surf are "Boom Pam", and they're great (a tuba-gypsy-elec.gtr thing, hard to describe and very original and well played) Check out their record, recommended! They have some success touring in Europe, good for them!

Just my $.02: If you currently have the means (as it
seems you do), without question, grab that Showman!!!

I'm certainly going to try. For the first time in my life I can afford a big vintage amp, and I'm not getting any younger...

Keep it in reserve for your live shows--that's really
what it's meant for. I wouldn't spend too much time or
energy trying to figure out how to tame that beast for
quiet home use.

I'll try anyway just for the hell of it. The Weber attenuators look like really good products. Can give me a lot of versatility in recording.

I would've suggested investing in an actual tank,
before a pro vintage head, especially if you won't be using it
live for some time.

Sure, I agree that ideally that's the correct order of things, but the opportunity came... no so with a Reverb unit. Stuff like that is rare to non-existent here. I believe I'll build myself a custom unit, when the time comes.

I guarantee that if you got an FRV-1, you'd be
extremely satisfied with your sound--not perfect, but
enough to really enjoy your home practice.

But I do own one, my good sir! It does surf, no other pedal comes close to it. I enjoy it a lot, it's on 99% of the time. But alas, digital is digital.

...unplugged technique...

Great advices man, thanks. Yeah, it's quick and easy just to pull the guitar off the stand and bond with it, with the most intimate vibrations, with the bare sound of it. Great for developing expressiveness, no place to hide, here the musicality speaks.

I also have my Blues Jr., for more reasonable home use, but I just don't like it. Maybe I will tinker with it - speaker, tubes and such. Just one year ago I got my first real instrument (I "played" 20 years on various cheapo crap), and hopefully will hold a real manly amp soon. This stuff gives me inspiration, and I already have some musical material that needs to be arranged, performed and recorded properly.
I've been around making music, around bands, my friends are musicians, I worked in sound reinforcement, played with all kinds of 80's boxes, wrote a thousand bits of little tunes, into the whole thing my whole life, but never got around to actually doing it like it should.
I used to joke that I live the Rock'n'Roll lifestyle without the sex, drugs or Rock'n'Roll. (well, just a little... oh, and bikes yeah.)
So I'm learning, gathering gear, and praying.

If you stayed through this scroll... thanks for letting me share.
This is the only forum I participate in, so forgive my letting myself open up.
Jah love, peace

That is a beautiful Jazzmaster! That seems like a good enough deal on the Showman. You can pull two tubes as mentioned to halve the output power - adjust the speaker impedance accordingly. Check with the tech, I don't remember if the impedance goes up or down (?).
Some of the early blackface amps, Showman included, were covered in blonde Tolex originally although those were '64's.