shivers13
Joined: Jul 29, 2009
Posts: 2605
Boss Angeles, CA
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Posted on Jun 26 2010 02:13 PM
merc50
Man, Gary Usher is getting left out of a "greats" toned thread again...everybody else gets mentioned but him.
He was a strat guy too, correct?
I'm glad you brought that up! Gary Usher was the most prolific of the surf/hot rod session producers. The Superstocks are my number one favorite surf/hot rod session group. His regular guitarists were... Richie Podolor (Strat), Jerry Cole (Jazzmaster), Glenn Campbell (Strat), and Billy Strange (Jazzmaster). The Superstocks best and most "surf" album is Surf Route 101 and the two key players on that were Podolor and Strange.
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merc50
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Flower Mound, Texas
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Posted on Jun 26 2010 06:32 PM
It is too bad somebody does not do a box set of all Gary Ushers stuff, I am still bitter over the Ghouls and other CD's being canceled after those cool Dick Dale and Super Stock CD's came out.
I have seen very few pictures of Usher playing, anybody got some of him playing?
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shivers13
Joined: Jul 29, 2009
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Boss Angeles, CA
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Posted on Jun 26 2010 07:34 PM
merc50
It is too bad somebody does not do a box set of all Gary Ushers stuff, I am still bitter over the Ghouls and other CD's being canceled after those cool Dick Dale and Super Stock CD's came out.
There's a bunch of Gary Usher collections out there but no "definitive" one for sure. "Barefoot Adventure" from Sundazed is a 2 CD collection of his stuff , but I wasn't that jazzed about many of the songs they picked. Wish I could have put the songlist together!  The problem with a complete box set of his would be that Gary recorded over 350 surf/hot rod/biker tunes and more than 60 albums! That would be huge and very pricey box set!
merc50
I have seen very few pictures of Usher playing, anybody got some of him playing?
There may be a picture of Gary with a guitar (possibly with The Four Speeds) but I don't recall off the top of my head. He was first and foremost a singer/songwriter/producer. His massive contribution to surf and hotrod music includes co-writing early Beach Boys songs with Brian, The Hondells, The Superstocks, The Four Speeds, etc... He even did stuff for well known non-session surf acts like Dick Dale, The Surfaris, and The Pyramids. A full list of credits could probably fill this whole page. He is the undisputed king of hot rod/surf in my book!
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Voodoo_Idol
Joined: Jul 30, 2008
Posts: 94
Pasadena, CA
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Posted on Jun 27 2010 04:24 AM
J_Razor
Jerry Cole did an interview last year or so with Vintage Guitar where he stated that he did those sessions with a Tele. Fender gave him a Jazz but he did not like it and rarely used it.
I missed that article back then but just dug it out to read. VGM, Nov 2006, page 28, 'Surf All Day, Race All Night' by Dan Forte.
Although often pictured with a white Fender Jazzmaster, Cole's main session guitar was a Broadcaster. "The Jazzmaster was free from Fender. On most of that stuff I played the Tele through a Fender Twin with reverb in the amp."
...
Cole jokes, "I'm the only guy who did 15 surf albums and hated surf music -- unless I could do it my way, like when I did the Capitol stuff. But I played it balls up, man."
The article also points out that the session bands got started much earlier in the '60s than I had thought, referring to 'Surfer's Stomp' by the Marketts (Tedesco on guitar) as the first instrumental song with "surf" in the title. Apparently, the Marketts pre-dated the Wrecking Crew.
It also talks about Cole writing and arranging songs under contract from Gary Usher.
So I still think the truth is somewhere in the middle. The session players' surf output was dominated by Tedesco and Cole, both on Tele. Podolor, Campbell and Strange were mostly on Strat and JM. James Burton, Tele player, was prolific, but his surf-ish recordings were limited to Dick Dale, Duane Eddy, Merrell & Exiles, Impacts, and Jan & Dean. Davie Allan and Paul Johnson were mentioned before, but they weren't nearly as active as session men as those listed above. Also, Lolly Vegas (Tele) was on the Deuce Coupes sessions. So it's mixed bag, but the session work has gotta be at least 50-70% Tele just based on Tedesco, Cole and Burton alone. On the other hand, Teles were rare among the mainstream surf bands, as far as we know.
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Voodoo_Idol
Joined: Jul 30, 2008
Posts: 94
Pasadena, CA
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Posted on Jun 27 2010 04:40 AM
shivers13
In addition, The Deadly Ones is not a Wrecking Crew album, so we can only speculate what is being played on that.
I know it's not Wrecking Crew. It was arranged by Joe South, recorded probably in Nashville or LA. Not sure if South is on guitar or some other session player. Regardless, that is the distinctive sound of a Tele bridge pickup. There is no substitute. From what I understand, South was primarily a Gretsch guy back in that era, but that's not what I hear on that album.
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BillAqua
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 1054
Chicago IL.
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Posted on Jun 27 2010 10:41 AM
Voodoo_Idol
I missed that article back then but just dug it out to read. VGM, Nov 2006, page 28, 'Surf All Day, Race All Night' by Dan Forte.
Although often pictured with a white Fender Jazzmaster, Cole's main session guitar was a Broadcaster. "The Jazzmaster was free from Fender. On most of that stuff I played the Tele through a Fender Twin with reverb in the amp."
...
Cole jokes, "I'm the only guy who did 15 surf albums and hated surf music -- unless I could do it my way, like when I did the Capitol stuff. But I played it balls up, man."
Excellent post! Thank you for actually citing a source.
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BillAqua
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
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Chicago IL.
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Posted on Jun 27 2010 10:44 AM
JakeDobner
Bill, I can't get the argument that they are too twangy for surf. I can't understand that... Especially since the player can make a tele more or less twangy if they know what they are doing.
Jake, I really think the argument that they are too twangy for surf comes from those who have not tried a Tele.
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shivers13
Joined: Jul 29, 2009
Posts: 2605
Boss Angeles, CA
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Posted on Jun 27 2010 10:49 AM
I'm still not buying the Tele's were widely used in surf sessions argument. I'm not saying they were entirely not used (especially on some of the dryer twangier hot rod stuff) just that Elliot was way over selling their use.
Elliot's claim is based mostly on Tedesco and conveniently ignores Podolor (Strat) and Strange (JM) who did the vast majority of Usher's surf stuff, Campbell (Strat) Strange (JM) who did the Jan and Dean hits, and Davie Allan (JM) whos output in the genre was massive. Not to mention Paul Johnson (Strat) who played on a lot of The Challengers stuff.
You have to remember that these session guys were chameleons. They were trying to copy what the "real" bands were doing and that would mean using the same equipment that was popular with surf... Strat's, Jazzmasters. Jaguars.
And Speaking of Tedesco. Read this interview clip where he talks about being a chameleon in the studio
Being such a diverse guitarist, does it cause a problem being a musical chameleon and retaining your own stylistic and artistic identity?
Tedesco: No, because my artistic identity is all these things. When I pick up a guitar, I am all these things. I might be playing live, it might be a jazz date, but youre gonna hear some Spanish influences in there, maybe some fake oriental experiences, all these things Ive picked up, thats part of me.
But what about when youre inside the studio, does that stay the same?
Tedesco: No, when Im inside the studio, I turn a switch. I am whatever they want me to be. If theres a part that commands a Greek bouzouki player, I turn myself into that bouzouki player.
Seems to me the man would naturally play a guitar that was right for the job.
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FredBaltazar
Joined: Apr 11, 2010
Posts: 138
London
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Posted on Jun 27 2010 03:16 PM
This is a great thread and I've been learning loads with it. However, I believe so far nobody mentioned the Trashmen. On the booklet that comes with their Sundazed box Bird Call! The Twin City Stomp of the Trashmen there's some photos of them with Telecasters.
I consider also that Telecasters with their single coils pu can be great surf machines through the right amps and loads of reverb, IMHO.
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shivers13
Joined: Jul 29, 2009
Posts: 2605
Boss Angeles, CA
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Posted on Jun 27 2010 04:20 PM
The photo of Tony Andreason of The Trashmen that you're talking about is a live shot of them from '66. Here is what they used during the Surfin Bird era...
P.S. Tele's are fine guitars. No one is disputing whether they are good or bad for surf but whether they were widely used in surf sessions in the 60's. From what I've discovered they were not.
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BillAqua
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
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Chicago IL.
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Posted on Jun 27 2010 04:41 PM
shivers13
P.S. Tele's are fine guitars. No one is disputing whether they are good or bad for surf but whether they were widely used in surf sessions in the 60's. From what I've discovered they were not.
Ok. Cool... I was originally responding to your below quote regarding Teles.
"Tele's are really twangy and great for country sounding stuff. That's why Barfield is using one on those tunes. They are more twangy country than surf."
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shivers13
Joined: Jul 29, 2009
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Boss Angeles, CA
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Posted on Jun 27 2010 04:47 PM
BillAqua
shivers13
P.S. Tele's are fine guitars. No one is disputing whether they are good or bad for surf but whether they were widely used in surf sessions in the 60's. From what I've discovered they were not.
Ok. Cool... I was originally responding to your below quote regarding Teles.
"Tele's are really twangy and great for country sounding stuff. That's why Barfield is using one on those tunes. They are more twangy country than surf."
I still however stand by that statement. Barfield doesn't use Tele's for everything. In fact, he switches guitars up quite a bit.
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IvanP
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
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southern Michigan
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Posted on Jun 27 2010 04:54 PM
I believe Barfield used a Jazzmaster almost exclusively during the first run of the Huntington Cads, but I'm open to correction by anyone that actually saw them live back then.
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shivers13
Joined: Jul 29, 2009
Posts: 2605
Boss Angeles, CA
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Posted on Jun 27 2010 04:56 PM
That sounds correct. But maybe Barfield will chime in.
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cirecc
Joined: Mar 06, 2006
Posts: 304
seattle, wa
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Posted on Jul 02 2010 12:40 PM
Voodoo_Idol
The article also points out that the session bands got started much earlier in the '60s than I had thought, referring to 'Surfer's Stomp' by the Marketts (Tedesco on guitar) as the first instrumental song with "surf" in the title. Apparently, the Marketts pre-dated the Wrecking Crew.
if i remember correctly, the markett's "surfer's stomp" was more or less ripped off of the beat of "let's go trippin" (which was based on the r n b "stomp" that were popular at the time) and was titled after the already existing surfer's stomp dance craze in southern california. the song "surfer's stomp", i believe, was originally intended for the Belairs or Dick Dale (i don't remember which right now) but, either way, they refused to record it and therefore it went the session musician group known as the marketts. basically, it was a corporate produced song meant to cash in on a new trend. as for whether or not they used teles, beats me, but based on the corporate context i would not necessarily hold it as being true to or completely in touch with the surf music movement of the early '60s.
also the dick dale's surfer's choice lp i believe was released just after "surfer's stomp"
correct me if i am not remembering this correctly
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shivers13
Joined: Jul 29, 2009
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Boss Angeles, CA
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Posted on Jul 02 2010 08:49 PM
cirecc
the markett's "surfer's stomp" -- basically, it was a corporate produced song meant to cash in on a new trend.
100% correct. Dick Dale and The Beach Boys are what set the surf music craze in motion in a big way, not the Marketts or any other "studio" group. "Let's go Trippin " by Dick Dale was released in 1961 and "Surfin" by The Beach Boys was also released in 1961. Surfer's Stomp by The Marketts was released in 1962. In addition, the claim that Surfer's Stomp was the first instrumental to use the term surf in the title doesn't mean much since The Beach Boys had a hit first with Surfin' (1961).
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FredBaltazar
Joined: Apr 11, 2010
Posts: 138
London
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Posted on Jul 09 2010 05:20 AM
shivers13
Also, on the early Beach Boys Hot Rod and Surf Songs they didn't use session guys... Carl played a Jazzmaster and Al Jardine played a Strat. David Marks from the BB also played a Jazzmaster.
According to the book "The Lost Beach Boy", David Marks played a Fender Stratocaster and later a Fender Jaguar (you can see some photos of him with the Jaguar on the book). Later on, influenced by the Beatles, he changed to one black hollowbody Rickenbaker with 12 strings if I'm not wrong and that some point he was using one Gibson ES 335.
Joel Scott Hill from the Strangers, recorded and played live with what seems to be one Telecaster (but could possibly be a nocaster or broadcaster - because it has the neck pick up wasn't definitely the esquire).
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shivers13
Joined: Jul 29, 2009
Posts: 2605
Boss Angeles, CA
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Posted on Jul 09 2010 06:16 AM
Thanks Fred, yes I know. That was a miss type on my behalf. I covered that in one of my later posts. I'm very familiar with The Lost Beach Boy book. It's one of my favorite bios of all time!
David played a Strat in the BB, then a Jag in The Marksmen. And Carl played a Jag in the BB though I've also seen him pictured recording with a Strat but maybe he was just jamming on Al Jardine's. When The Beatles hit big in '64 Carl switched to using a Rickenbacker for the time. So many guitars to keep up with... but not too many Teles were seen in those days for surf as was also covered earlier.
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blackheartsfan
Joined: Jun 13, 2009
Posts: 274
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Posted on Jul 10 2010 09:46 PM
Having recently seen Pat Benatar with husband Neil Giraldo @ The Bergen Performing Arts Center in Engelwood N.J. I can attest that a Tele properly configured can suit all needs. Neil played both of his favored Teles that night, each equipped with Bigsbys' and switched between lead and rhythm effortlessly. The band had only three musicians, Neil, a bass player, and a drummer with Pat Benatar on vocals. Note: They were fabulous, as great as ever, never missing a beat. Now if I could be only half as profecient as he is with any of my guitars.
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BillyBlastOff
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 1070
Ventura County, Calif.
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Posted on Jul 10 2010 11:52 PM
Personally speaking,
I would like to see lots of different guitars out there being played in the Surf world. Not just Jazzmasters, Jags, Strats, Mosrites, etc.. It's nice to mix it up a little bit. 99.9% of it is the player anyways.
In other words, just because you own a Strat, sure as hell don't mean your gonna sound like Hendrix!
— Be careful following the masses. Sometimes the "M" is silent...........................
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