How do you avoid clichés or ripping off other people's riffs in your songs? I'm having such a hard time with this. Last night, for instance, I came up with a song that I was really proud of. Turns out, it was "The Sweeper" by Link Wray. In a genre with such a distinct sound (reverb, gilssando, tremolo picking, etc) and that is based entirely on instrumentals, how do you keep your songs sounding new and unique, while simultaneously keeping within the confines of what is "Surf". I generally bypass this by adding non-Surf elements like Blues, Country, or Rockabilly into my playing, but I'm wondering for those who are strictly Surf, how do you do it?

"Music is an extension of my soul"-Dick Dale

TheSavage63
How do you avoid clichés or ripping off other people's riffs in your songs? I'm having such a hard time with this. Last night, for instance, I came up with a song that I was really proud of. Turns out, it was "The Sweeper" by Link Wray.

If it sounds familiar, it most possibly is. Just let it go. Let anything fall to the ground that is not convincing enough for your attention - with regards to memorability and originality. Otherwise you lose a lot of time instead of finding uniqueness.

On the other hand, of course I’m a fan of covers. All these notions that true artists only play their own music is wrong. The history of popular music took a turn for the worse. Not all good musicians, not even the great, have a lifetime’s worth of original music in their systems.

The Exotic Guitar of Kahuna Kawentzmann

You can get the boy out of the Keynes era, but you can’t get the Keynes era out of the boy.

TheSavage63
How do you avoid clichés or ripping off other people's riffs in your songs? I'm having such a hard time with this. Last night, for instance, I came up with a song that I was really proud of. Turns out, it was "The Sweeper" by Link Wray.

It's pretty hard to be completely unique. Chances are that almost anything you come up with will share at least the chord progression with some other song. The only two songs I can think of that have chord progressions I've never seen used elsewhere are A C Jobim's "Wave" and the Beach Boys "Warmth of the Sun" and I wouldn't bet my last dollar that either of those are actually unique. That's only one aspect of it.

(Actually, now that I think about it there's a Bossa Nova I wrote that has very unique changes but I don't know that it would have any potential as Surf.)

The other extreme is Blues where many of the songs share the exact same changes yet take on their own identity in the details. Kansas City Blues and Johnny B. Goode have the same structure but no one is going to cunfuse them with one another.

My point is that you'll probably write things that at least resemble existing songs but you can create a hook that makes it unique. Likewise, you can start down a familiar path and surprise your listeners with an unexpected diversion. If you set up a turn around into a root Major chord but land on the parallel minor chord that opens some new doors. The changes to "Warmth of the Sun" play all sorts of these games and sound great.

Kawentzmann
If it sounds familiar, it most possibly is. Just let it go. Let anything fall to the ground that is not convincing enough for your attention - with regards to memorability and originality. Otherwise you lose a lot of time instead of finding uniqueness.

On the other hand, of course I’m a fan of covers. All these notions that true artists only play their own music is wrong. The history of popular music took a turn for the worse. Not all good musicians, not even the great, have a lifetime’s worth of original music in their systems.

Well stated. Like yourself, I have nothing against covers, especially if they are done well. Even the vaunted Beatles did quite a few covers in their early years. Up into the early Rock'n' Roll era the song was the star of the show and various artists covered it in their own fashion. If there was a hit song playing on the radio you might buy a copy by your favorite artist. The same song could be had by Pat Boone or Dean Martin or Johnny Mathis or whomever and it was the consumer's choice not the label or songwriter's choice.

In a way first wave surf was a lot like that as well. It seems like most bands had their own songs and also covered a bunch of Surf standards. Pipeline was more well-known than the Chantays, Wipeout than the Surfaris . . . you get the picture. I've written some songs in my day but I can have just as much fun with a cover. You can copy someone else's arrangement verbatim for one verse, ape a different artist on the second verse and so forth. Then, the second time through you can do your own take on it without so much as a nod to the original artist.

Another thought is to convert other music into Surf. Malaguena, Miserlou, Hava Nagila, all of these are examples that have been circulating in the 'surf world since the beginning. The Ventures did an entire album of classical tunes and I think that some of these could be Surfed up a bit and put to good use. Mozart's 40th transposed to Em would be interesting. How about some Gypsy Jazz played as Surf? It has all the right elements, good melody, straightforward harmonic structure and you can listen to Django cutting loose for inspiration. Had he lived a decade or two later I'd betcha that he'd have done some twangy sounds drenched in reverb with that Brie eatin' grin on his face.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

My suggestion would be don't listen to other surf songs for inspiration. It's cool to get pumped by those songs but don't necessarily try to copy them. Try getting into the idea of coming up with a strong melody and stay away from 1,4,5 when possible. Also, try adapting some 'standards" of your own like the originators did. Some of the best surf tunes are based on "standards". At the SG101 convention this year Secret Samurai did "Carioca" and it blew me away.

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synchro
Mozart's 40th transposed to Em would be interesting.

From 1980 (thus the disco influence), here's the Shadows doing something like that:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqdK2IP5vjk

Thank you . . . bless you, for bringing that to my attention. In 1971 there was a version of Mozart's 40th getting airplay on the Top 40 stations in Denver but I've never been able to find out who it was. (The DJs never mentioned the performer, they just made jokes about a "super oldie".) This couldn't be that recording but it's damn close. Close enough for me. I'll be finding it on CD if it takes another 38 years.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

Haole-Jim
Personally, 'do not even try to be original; 'have no idea how to write music, like learning to breathe underwater without a tank, to this mind.

'Just play stuff and it comes out the way it comes out.

Chet Atkins once said that the trick to being a gutiar player was to make the hard stuff look easy and the easy stuff look hard. I think that this goes for songwriting too. Sometimes even the simplest concepts can really sound great if properly arranged. I recently starteddoing some Neil Diamond vocals. I like to sing his songs because we have similar vocal ranges and I like his songs as well. Most of his songs are simple, 3 or 4 chord tunes but used imaginatively. He may not be challenging Gershwin, Brian Wilson or any other prolific songwriter for complexity but he has sold a heap of records over the years and his songs are enduring and recognized decades after they were released.

Good Blues is simple, at least in overall concept, ditto for much of the good Surf music. I don't write many songs these days and usually forget them before I get around to notating or recording them. I really wish that I had the imagination it takes to craft 3 chords into a memorable song but alas, I'm hooked on complex harmony, at least as a writer.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

I've always kind of liked Tav Falco's Panther Burns' take on Brazil, which Sandy Surfsonic tells me is properly Aquarela do Brasil. I suppose it could be done by a surf band, but with a recommendation of a retread of a retread of a retread, however delightful, things are kind of getting off track here.

It seems to me that originality is greatly overrated and mainly deemed desirable due to a mixture of false expectations and goals (as Kawentzmann says) and modern legal-financial considerations.

I suspect (by analogy with my experience in other fields) that if you have originality in you it will burst out of you if you train it properly by assiduously studying the standards and anything else you like. Then try adapting them to different keys and rhythms, or playing them backward or whatever. If you have it in you you'll eventually reach the exalted point where without realizing what you are doing you can seamlessly assemble a set of "lost chords" into something that seems new or at least only hauntingly familiar.

If it turns out to be Link Wray's Deacon Jones then maybe sit down and take it apart and figure out how to change it into Bible Thumpin' Smith for practice.

Last edited: Dec 05, 2009 21:42:36

TheSavage63, thanks for instigating this thread.

If you enjoy writing, write as much as you can and eventually your own gems will appear, and you'll enjoy the process.

Tim O
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I basically just write everything in Em or Am, that way I'm assured that no one else has ever copied my songs before I write them.

I just steal everything I do from Korla Pandit.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.