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SurfGuitar101 Forums » Recording Corner »

The Loudness War - any thoughts?

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Kawentzmann Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 1062 Berlin, Germany	Posted on Sep 29 2009 01:42 PM Surfgitar Very loosely related, proposed legistlation for the loudness war in televison broadcast is a bill that would require the FCC to "preclude commercials from being broadcast at louder volumes than the program material they accompany." Thats where that sound-kill-switch comes handy. — The Exotic Guitar of Kahuna Kawentzmann You can get the boy out of the Keynes era, but you can’t get the Keynes era out of the boy. Last edited: Sep 29, 2009 16:31:52 Top
JakeDobner Joined: Feb 26, 2006 Posts: 12159 Seattle	Posted on Sep 29 2009 02:48 PM The worst is in movies and TV shows where you can hardly hear the characters speaking but when there is any sort of action it wakes the neighbors. Top
oestmann Joined: Mar 06, 2008 Posts: 584 Adelaide	Posted on Sep 29 2009 10:29 PM IvanP I posted a recent Wall Street Journal article on this very issue in this thread. Apologies Ivan, I had a quick look before I posted. Good article. — Tim O oestmann guitar tunes clips Top
bigtikidude Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 25620 Anaheim(So.Cal.)U.S.A.	Posted on Sep 30 2009 11:07 AM so how does the New Beatles "Remasters" fall into this loudness war. I have read that the original mixes in 87 that were used to make the cds were not as good as the master tapes. So the new mixes make things sound punchier and clearer. but did they do this newer Loud process on it too? — Jeff(bigtikidude) Top
Jagshark Joined: Nov 05, 2008 Posts: 745 Colorado, home of The Astronauts	Posted on Sep 30 2009 11:54 AM I don't know specifically how to answer that. The Beatles, when they first were recording in the 60's were in a loundness war of their own. They were "Beat" music because of the big sound of the drums. They really wanted to record in the U.S. because the sound of Motown bass cut so much more than what they were achieving in Britain. Here is a blog about the new reissues. http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-10351798-47.html A quote from the blog: "Thing is, with the 2009 remasters we're talking about fairly subtle improvements in clarity, especially in high-frequency detail, overall spaciousness, and naturalness. And the music seems more dynamically alive. Too bad those qualities evaporate over iPods, computer speakers, and car systems." I personally favor buying the vinyl and listening that way (though I also have the old school Beatles cds). — (defunct) Thee Jaguar Sharks Plus! Other stuff not surf: https://soundcloud.com/jamesmileshq Enjoy every minute Last edited: Sep 30, 2009 12:00:17 Top
bigtikidude Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 25620 Anaheim(So.Cal.)U.S.A.	Posted on Sep 30 2009 11:56 AM just wondering if the Remasters were over mixed in this new super loud way, as the new Metalica etc.... or just better than the old cds, and not over distorted? — Jeff(bigtikidude) Top
JakeDobner Joined: Feb 26, 2006 Posts: 12159 Seattle	Posted on Sep 30 2009 12:07 PM bigtikidude just wondering if the Remasters were over mixed in this new super loud way, as the new Metalica etc.... or just better than the old cds, and not over distorted? They used compression in a couple places, four total I hear. But that was all they did. Really all they did was clean the master tapes and make a clean digital master that was as clear and accurate as possible. Top
bigtikidude Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 25620 Anaheim(So.Cal.)U.S.A.	Posted on Sep 30 2009 12:35 PM thanks Jake, that's what I assumed. not that I'm gonna be buying the box any time soon. but when I do, I would hate to have it be all distorted like newer releases. — Jeff(bigtikidude) Top
psychonaut Joined: Dec 08, 2007 Posts: 1303	Posted on Sep 30 2009 12:36 PM Jagshark I don't know specifically how to answer that. The Beatles, when they first were recording in the 60's were in a loundness war of their own. They were "Beat" music because of the big sound of the drums. They really wanted to record in the U.S. because the sound of Motown bass cut so much more than what they were achieving in Britain. Actually there was one Beatles 45 ( I forget which one ) that the volume level made the needle skip and EMI was forced to recall several thousand 7"'s and repress them. As a result all Beatles records were cut 3db's lower than any other EMI release. So the Beatles were effectively precluded from participating in the 'volume wars', by company decree! — https://www.facebook.com/coffindagger http://coffindaggers.com/ http://thecoffindaggers.bandcamp.com Top
Jagshark Joined: Nov 05, 2008 Posts: 745 Colorado, home of The Astronauts	Posted on Sep 30 2009 01:41 PM Ah. Poor Beatles! I gleaned the Motown bit from Geoff Emerick's excellent book Here, There, and Everywhere. — (defunct) Thee Jaguar Sharks Plus! Other stuff not surf: https://soundcloud.com/jamesmileshq Enjoy every minute Top
Kawentzmann Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 1062 Berlin, Germany	Posted on Sep 30 2009 02:15 PM Again, the loudness war as we know it today was technically not possible in the sixties. They had other compressors (and used them differently). If you turn the old records way up the snare and toms will kick in your stomach. With modern records at the same level your ears will bleed but the drums wont do much. — The Exotic Guitar of Kahuna Kawentzmann You can get the boy out of the Keynes era, but you can’t get the Keynes era out of the boy. Top
00Diablo Joined: Mar 15, 2006 Posts: 135 Alameda, CA/Las Vegas, NV	Posted on Sep 30 2009 05:48 PM so how does the New Beatles "Remasters" fall into this loudness war I believe the mono box has no compression at all, with the new stereo releases using some compression - done with a very light hand in the mastering process. There are multiple threads on this over at the Steve Hoffman forums, and the general consensus (from a very critical crowd, mind you) seems to be that EMI hit it out of the ballpark on this one, sound-wise. What's weird about the Beatles mono mixes is, I expected to like their earlier material better in mono and their later stuff better in stereo. Which to my ears, turned out not to be the case. For their middle to later material my preference changes on a track by track basis. But their early material like "Beatles For Sale" sounds spectacular on the newly remastered stereo CD and just trounces the mono, IMO. Perhaps the record industry has turned the corner on the loudness war, and the focus will be on good sound again. Top
Paisley Joined: Sep 15, 2008 Posts: 110 Melbourne, Australia	Posted on Oct 07 2009 04:35 PM I have a couple of copies of Midnight Oil's "10,9,8..." on vinyl; one was the local Australian release, the other an import from England. The English one appears to have been mastered with less compression, it's easily 2-3db lower in volume than the Australian copy, but there is so much more depth in the sound of the English one. It retains a greater dynamic range, and despite the drop in volume it actually comes across as more solid & punchy than the louder version. Top
mom_surfing Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 5310 the outer banks of north carolina	Posted on Oct 07 2009 05:55 PM Paisley I have a couple of copies of Midnight Oil's "10,9,8..." on vinyl; one was the local Australian release, the other an import from England. The English one appears to have been mastered with less compression, it's easily 2-3db lower in volume than the Australian copy, but there is so much more depth in the sound of the English one. It retains a greater dynamic range, and despite the drop in volume it actually comes across as more solid & punchy than the louder version. i have the usa pressed vinyl but only the cd to compare it with. i'll have to drag it out and compare the two. — www.surfintheeye.com Top

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