Woodsurfer
Joined: Feb 07, 2009
Posts: 310
Bel Air, MD USA
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 06:25 PM
As someone who started studying the guitar rather late in life (mid-40's) I've always felt wistful about not having a grounding in music theory and, especially reading. Although I've put a lot of effort into reading, I'm still at the "See spots! Run spots run!" level. How about y'all?
-- Woody
— It takes a lot of mussel memory to avoid clams.
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Surfabilly
Joined: Apr 21, 2006
Posts: 852
Connersville, Indiana, USA
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 06:33 PM
Q: Want to know how to stop a guitar player from playing?
A: Put sheet music in front of him.
I'd just let a note or chord sustain long enough to turn it around, and keep playing.
I picked the last choice.
Matt
— Fast Cars & Loud Guitars!
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Jagshark
Joined: Nov 05, 2008
Posts: 745
Colorado, home of The Astronauts
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 06:40 PM
I read it when I played trumpet in high school. But for guitar, no.
— (defunct) Thee Jaguar Sharks
Plus! Other stuff not surf: https://soundcloud.com/jamesmileshq
Enjoy every minute
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DannySnyder
Joined: Mar 02, 2006
Posts: 11046
Berkeley, CA
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 06:41 PM
I'm somewhere between the top 2 choices. I too learned how while playing trumpet in grade school.
— Danny Snyder
"With great reverb comes great responsibility" - Uncle Leo
Playing keys and guitar with Combo Tezeta
Formerly a guitarist in The TomorrowMen and Meshugga Beach Party
Latest surf project - Now That's What I Call SURF
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TommyD
Joined: Feb 11, 2008
Posts: 85
Salina, Kansas
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 06:52 PM
I re-started playing guitar later in life as well. I took lessons in Jr. High 40 years ago and went no where with it... to caught up in other things I suppose. Decades later I started playing again when my son picked up the guitar. If I take my time I can read the notes. I know I'll never play outside my own music room, but I love to noodle arond wth it and learn new songs.
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Sonichris
Joined: Mar 06, 2006
Posts: 1892
Wear gloves - I'm in the Rockies
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 06:54 PM
I'm very good on the piano at reading music, although I'm way out of practice - but it comes back pretty quickly if I work at it a little.
Not too much practice on guitar - seems like a lot less sheet music for guitar, other than chord charts. I can pick out a basic melody by sheet music - translate the notes on paper to the correct ones on the guitar.
Music theory, that's a whole other can of worms. I should have paid more attention during piano lessons.
— "You can't tell where you're going if you don't know where you've been"
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wooza
Joined: Apr 24, 2006
Posts: 1618
Ithaca, NY
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 06:59 PM
I chose the second option. Up until recently the only music theory I knew was just stuff I'd heard or encountered casually. Two weeks ago I finished taking an introductory music theory course, which helped a LOT. The problem is it was taught at breakneck speed, with no time to dwell on any subjects and gain familiarity with their applications... and actually there was no application. That stuff is so much more useful when learned with an instrument in hand and I didn't get that kind of exposure. So I can read really slowly, and translate that to a guitar even slower.
Now I'm trying to go back over what I learned and get a feel for it in practice. Just yesterday I started trying to see if I could write out one of my own songs, and Brahms's Hungarian Dance #3!... with some success.
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Staredge
Joined: Sep 27, 2008
Posts: 1149
Damascus, Maryland
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 07:07 PM
I've had a semester of theory, so I know what everything means. Using it is a different story. I've got a couple of books I'm working through, as I'd like to remember enough of it to actually put it to use. I can find the notes I read on a keyboard, but haven't learned the fretboard yet.
— Will
"You're done, once you're a surfer you're done. You're in. It's like the mob or something. You're not getting out." - Kelly Slater
The Luau Cinders
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Mel
Joined: Feb 25, 2008
Posts: 321
Canada's Wet Coast
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 07:09 PM
I learned in elementary school, in grade 5 when I started playing the trumpet. Later, I started taking guitar lessons when I was 12, it was an easy transition and my teacher insisted I know how to read music so there wasn't much of a choice.
I can site read pretty easy and find it easier to read than tab (I fumble a lot trying to read tab), but that's probably because I learned to read sheet music first.
— Mel
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Tuck
Joined: Sep 02, 2006
Posts: 3166
Denver, CO
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 07:18 PM
I learned "how to read music" studying violin in grade school back East where the stringed instruments are occasionally studied in school. I understand the system fairly well in the abstract, and still remember it, given a few refreshers with kids taking lessons and needing help, but even when I remembered how to apply it to violin my practical fluency was at a very mechanical level and for the violin only. I could never look at sheet music and hear the song. I could only look at it and play it on a violin (woodenly, and in the first position only).
I never considered what I was doing to be truly "reading music," though some people thought it was and thought I was holding out on them when I denied reading music and later admitted that I could play a violin from music notation. At that point my notion of "reading music" was "reading it for the piano" or "for any instrument" or at least being able to do more than the simple mechanical thing that I could do a little for that one instrument. "Being able to read music for real" was some mysterious elevated state of being that I couldn't conceive in concrete form.
I am beginning to realize that if a person put some moderatetly extended serious effort into it it might be possible to get so you could hum or vocalize something from music and not just play it on a certain instrument. Maybe only in relative pitch. It never really occurred to me that anything like that was possible when I was young. I thought you would always need some instrument to know what the note actually was.
With so many improvements in elementary music teaching these days, I hope they will eventually think of ways to address the question of what music is and how to read and write it.
One breakthrough for me was realizing that Enstrume'n'tal's Sol Si Do Si Mi Re La is named for its opening notes and that I could work out the sequence from the name. (OK, quit laughing! That was a big step! I missed the point of that part of the Sound of Music.)
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tonetti
Joined: Aug 20, 2008
Posts: 654
California
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 07:27 PM
DannySnyder
I'm somewhere between the top 2 choices. I too learned how while playing trumpet in grade school.
Put me down as another former trumpet player Could there be some sort of link between playing the trumpet in our youth, and surf music in our adulthood???
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Mel
Joined: Feb 25, 2008
Posts: 321
Canada's Wet Coast
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 08:46 PM
tonetti
DannySnyder
I'm somewhere between the top 2 choices. I too learned how while playing trumpet in grade school.
Put me down as another former trumpet player Could there be some sort of link between playing the trumpet in our youth, and surf music in our adulthood???
Well, it was either surf music for me or the Tijuana Brass..but you might be on to something...;-)
— Mel
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zak
Joined: Sep 24, 2007
Posts: 2728
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 09:04 PM
This post has been removed by the author.
Last edited: Sep 27, 2009 19:58:36
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mom_surfing
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 5297
the outer banks of north carolina
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Posted on Apr 02 2009 09:20 PM
i learned how to read music in jr. high school playing clarinet and also started playing guitar in my 40's. can i sight read? absolutely not. but i can take a piece of music and very slowly pick out the notes. i find it's easier to learn by ear.
— www.surfintheeye.com
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Surfgitar
Joined: Mar 16, 2007
Posts: 1342
Ft. Lauderdale, Florida
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Posted on Apr 03 2009 09:22 AM
Does reading CD jackets count?
(I picked #2)
— CUTBACK
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P2gee
Joined: Jul 05, 2006
Posts: 264
Waco Texas
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Posted on Apr 03 2009 09:58 AM
We lived in Seattle for a couple of years when I was about 10 or so. Took guitar lessons from a lady named Gerry Allen. There was no question about music or music therory she could not answer or explain. I only wish I could have spent 10 or 12 years studying with her......no telling where I would be with my playing and I could have easily answered #1. Instead I answered #3 although I am probably between 2 and 3.
— 2012-2013: FILTHY POLAROIDS
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Ruhar
Joined: Jun 21, 2007
Posts: 3909
San Diego, CA
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Posted on Apr 03 2009 10:09 AM
I started a music minor in college, but ditched it because I really wasn't into composing Gregorian chants
I can read for piano a bit, but not quickly at sight, and not much for guitar.
— Ryan
The Secret Samurai Website
The Secret Samurai on Facebook
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Woodsurfer
Joined: Feb 07, 2009
Posts: 310
Bel Air, MD USA
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Posted on Apr 03 2009 11:43 AM
i can take a piece of music and very slowly pick out the notes. i find it's easier to learn by ear.
That pretty much sums up my condition. When I was studying guitar a few years ago, my teacher made reading music a condition of his tutelage. We went over simple tunes and he got me to the point where I could slowly follow the score while clumsily plucking out the notes. Later, I sat in on his jazz session where the accomplished players would play melodies with improvisations out of the Real Books and the rest of us would chunk along on rhythm. He also had sessions dedicated to reading out of a tutorial book. I sat in on these a couple of times but got lost easily and would just freeze up. I think this is what caused me to stop taking lessons (that and losing my job and thus, the ability to pay for those lessons).
-- Woody
— It takes a lot of mussel memory to avoid clams.
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Doctor_Morbius
Joined: Oct 26, 2008
Posts: 608
This Planet Earth
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Posted on Apr 03 2009 02:15 PM
I used to read music when I played Sax in High School, but I can't now. That was eons ago. These days I stick with tabs.
— Cats 'n' Strats, 'cause that's how I roll - I eat reverb for breakfast!
Fenderus Collecticus
Strat Blender Pot Modification HERE
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Surfabilly
Joined: Apr 21, 2006
Posts: 852
Connersville, Indiana, USA
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Posted on Apr 03 2009 04:04 PM
Maybe it's on the easy end of things, but last night CCR's "Susie Q" was playing on the 'net-based "radio" station I listen to, so I grabbed my nearest guitar and started picking. Didn't quite get it on the first try, but started picking along with the second try...what I missed on one phrase, I tried for the next time it came around. With a bit more work, I can add "Susie Q" to my repertoire; lead, rhythm and bass, if I get ambitious enough.
I don't necessarily have to be listening to a song, in order to start picking it out by ear, however. Sometimes, I'll just think about a particular song, and start picking notes until I'm playing that song. That's how I came up with my arrangement of "Green Onions," with the Hammond organ part transposed to two guitars. I've added to my CD collection, at times, for wanting to be able to listen to a particular song, to help me pick out parts that eluded my memory.
Learning songs by ear isn't without any dangers, though. I've been frustrated, at times, for not being able to pick out certain guitar parts in Pink Floyd's The Dark Side Of The Moon, then several years back a The Making Of...DVD came out. Imagine my surprise, to learn that those particular parts I couldn't pick out were because Gilmour did them using a pedal steel guitar.
Matt
— Fast Cars & Loud Guitars!
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