Ludwig Drums 1965

TheOutpost

Joined: May 26, 2020
Posts: 192
Highlands Ranch
United States

Posted on May 22 2023 11:01 PM

I scored a vintage Ludwig Snare and kick today on FB Marketplace. Anyone able to tell me more about it?

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Sonichris

Joined: Mar 06, 2006
Posts: 1839
Wear gloves - I'm in the Rockies
United States

Posted on May 23 2023 07:35 AM

https://www.ludwig-drums.com/en-us/ludwig/serial-guide

According to this guide, this is a '65 set.

Pretty cool!

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"You can't tell where you're going if you don't know where you've been"

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futureboy

Joined: Aug 28, 2008
Posts: 102
East Coast
United States

Posted on May 23 2023 10:18 AM

Based on the brackets this looks like it could be a Club Date model.

http://www.vintageludwigdrums.com/60sclubdate.html

The snare drum looks like it would be a Pioneer model. I think it is considered a poor man's Jass Festival snare.

I'm no expert, so don't quote me on that.

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DaveMudgett

Joined: Mar 17, 2019
Posts: 106
Central PA
United States

Posted on May 23 2023 11:20 AM

There are 8 lugs on that snare, it looks like a Jazz Festival - 8 bow tie lugs. Pioneers have 6 bowtie lugs. Yes, 1965 from the serial number. There may be a stamped date inside the shell. Looks like 5x14". Nice drum.

The kick looks like it was indeed off a Club Date, but the photo doesn't give a lot of detail. One could reasonably put either a Pioneer or Jazz Fest with a Club Date.

The finish on both is pretty oxidized. It looks painted black, hard to tell if it's original or not, or even if it's flat black or gloss. I'd take it apart, see what you really have, and clean it up some. I wouldn't go crazy trying to make it look new. Also don't know about the silver sparkle inlay on the drum hoop - might be original, they made some that way, but not sure I've seen one on an original black kick drum.

I've had two Club Dates, one pre-serial keystone badge early-60s in Sky Blue Pearl, another serial number keystone badge roughly '65 in Champagne Sparkle. Never should have gotten rid of the SBP - it needed a floor tom, I shoulda just stuck it out until I found one. It was an absolute powerhouse. But I'm primarily a guitar/steel-guitar player that just likes to play drums sometimes. I'm down to a 60s Blaemire bop (18" kick) kit. Portable, sounds great.

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The Delverados
Kristi Jean and the Ne'er Do Wells and Facebook
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TheOutpost

Joined: May 26, 2020
Posts: 192
Highlands Ranch
United States

Posted on May 23 2023 11:26 PM

DaveMudgett wrote:

There are 8 lugs on that snare, it looks like a Jazz Festival - 8 bow tie lugs. Pioneers have 6 bowtie lugs. Yes, 1965 from the serial number. There may be a stamped date inside the shell. Looks like 5x14". Nice drum.

The kick looks like it was indeed off a Club Date, but the photo doesn't give a lot of detail. One could reasonably put either a Pioneer or Jazz Fest with a Club Date.

The finish on both is pretty oxidized. It looks painted black, hard to tell if it's original or not, or even if it's flat black or gloss. I'd take it apart, see what you really have, and clean it up some. I wouldn't go crazy trying to make it look new. Also don't know about the silver sparkle inlay on the drum hoop - might be original, they made some that way, but not sure I've seen one on an original black kick drum.

I've had two Club Dates, one pre-serial keystone badge early-60s in Sky Blue Pearl, another serial number keystone badge roughly '65 in Champagne Sparkle. Never should have gotten rid of the SBP - it needed a floor tom, I shoulda just stuck it out until I found one. It was an absolute powerhouse. But I'm primarily a guitar/steel-guitar player that just likes to play drums sometimes. I'm down to a 60s Blaemire bop (18" kick) kit. Portable, sounds great.

Great info the club date seems to track. I will pop the heads off this weekend and see a little more on them. Nice find by my wife for free on FB Marketplace for sure. There is also a rack tom that appears to be a 1971. no matching Floor tom though.

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Social Media
https://www.facebook.com/TheOutpost/
https://www.instagram.com/theoutpostmusic/
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murph

Joined: Dec 16, 2010
Posts: 322
Chapel Hill, NC
4 Calendar Pins

Posted on May 25 2023 06:30 AM

Definitely appears to be a 20" club date kick in black lacquer. And yep, the silver inlay is pretty common. Looks like the tom bracket was modified to accommodate two rack toms. Club dates were typically configured with a single rack and floor tom. Nickel hardware too, which really gives these drums a vibe.

As others have said, also looks like a Pioneer snare. While not as crisp sounding or as responsive as an 8 or 10-lug snare, the 6-lug pioneer has a mojo all it's own. They sound absolutely fantastic for early rock-n-roll, country, and swing. I've got two that match my club date kits, and a 3rd just because.

Assuming the finish on the drums are in good shape (lacquer is notorious for flaking and easily scratched up) these will clean up nicely. If you intend to keep them and play them, with a little patience you can likely find a matching 12" rack tom. With a LOT of patience (and deep pockets) you may find a matching 14" floor tom. A 16" FT would be easier to find, but tonally, there's just something magic about the club date 12/14/20 configuration. Congratz!

-murph

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http://www.reverbnation.com/aminorconspiracy

"I knew I was in trouble when the Coco-Loco tasted like water!" -- morphball

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DaveMudgett

Joined: Mar 17, 2019
Posts: 106
Central PA
United States

Posted on May 25 2023 07:50 AM

Oops - yeah, the snare is a 6-lug Pioneer. Mistook the 8 lugs on kick photo.

Pioneers sound good, they're just not as controllable as the 8-lug Jazz Fest. I have a 5.5x14" Black Diamond Pearl '65 Pioneer. I like it tuned down for blues, classic country, Americana, and so on. Doesn't have the crack of the higher-end drums, but sounds very good.

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The Delverados
Kristi Jean and the Ne'er Do Wells and Facebook
Chicken Tractor Deluxe and Facebook

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surfbeatnik

Joined: Apr 01, 2007
Posts: 340
Sea Country, CA, USA
United States

Posted on May 25 2023 10:13 AM

TheOutpost wrote:

"Nice find by my wife for free on FB Marketplace for sure."

Free is always nice! And, it's great to have a partner on the lookout for deals like this!

Congrats on both!

—

Surfbeatnik

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TheOutpost

Joined: May 26, 2020
Posts: 192
Highlands Ranch
United States

Posted on May 25 2023 06:14 PM

Thanks all. This will get cleaned up and used at home for sure.

—

Social Media
https://www.facebook.com/TheOutpost/
https://www.instagram.com/theoutpostmusic/
Music
https://theoutpostmusic.bandcamp.com/
https://soundcloud.com/theoutpostmusic/
Merch
https://the-outpost-7.creator-spring.com/

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TheOutpost Joined: May 26, 2020 Posts: 192 Highlands Ranch	Posted on May 22 2023 11:01 PM I scored a vintage Ludwig Snare and kick today on FB Marketplace. Anyone able to tell me more about it? — Social Media https://www.facebook.com/TheOutpost/ https://www.instagram.com/theoutpostmusic/ Music https://theoutpostmusic.bandcamp.com/ https://soundcloud.com/theoutpostmusic/ Merch https://the-outpost-7.creator-spring.com/ Top
Sonichris Joined: Mar 06, 2006 Posts: 1839 Wear gloves - I'm in the Rockies	Posted on May 23 2023 07:35 AM https://www.ludwig-drums.com/en-us/ludwig/serial-guide According to this guide, this is a '65 set. Pretty cool! — "You can't tell where you're going if you don't know where you've been" Top
futureboy Joined: Aug 28, 2008 Posts: 102 East Coast	Posted on May 23 2023 10:18 AM Based on the brackets this looks like it could be a Club Date model. http://www.vintageludwigdrums.com/60sclubdate.html The snare drum looks like it would be a Pioneer model. I think it is considered a poor man's Jass Festival snare. I'm no expert, so don't quote me on that. Top
DaveMudgett Joined: Mar 17, 2019 Posts: 106 Central PA	Posted on May 23 2023 11:20 AM There are 8 lugs on that snare, it looks like a Jazz Festival - 8 bow tie lugs. Pioneers have 6 bowtie lugs. Yes, 1965 from the serial number. There may be a stamped date inside the shell. Looks like 5x14". Nice drum. The kick looks like it was indeed off a Club Date, but the photo doesn't give a lot of detail. One could reasonably put either a Pioneer or Jazz Fest with a Club Date. The finish on both is pretty oxidized. It looks painted black, hard to tell if it's original or not, or even if it's flat black or gloss. I'd take it apart, see what you really have, and clean it up some. I wouldn't go crazy trying to make it look new. Also don't know about the silver sparkle inlay on the drum hoop - might be original, they made some that way, but not sure I've seen one on an original black kick drum. I've had two Club Dates, one pre-serial keystone badge early-60s in Sky Blue Pearl, another serial number keystone badge roughly '65 in Champagne Sparkle. Never should have gotten rid of the SBP - it needed a floor tom, I shoulda just stuck it out until I found one. It was an absolute powerhouse. But I'm primarily a guitar/steel-guitar player that just likes to play drums sometimes. I'm down to a 60s Blaemire bop (18" kick) kit. Portable, sounds great. — The Delverados Kristi Jean and the Ne'er Do Wells and Facebook Chicken Tractor Deluxe and Facebook Top
TheOutpost Joined: May 26, 2020 Posts: 192 Highlands Ranch	Posted on May 23 2023 11:26 PM DaveMudgett wrote: There are 8 lugs on that snare, it looks like a Jazz Festival - 8 bow tie lugs. Pioneers have 6 bowtie lugs. Yes, 1965 from the serial number. There may be a stamped date inside the shell. Looks like 5x14". Nice drum. The kick looks like it was indeed off a Club Date, but the photo doesn't give a lot of detail. One could reasonably put either a Pioneer or Jazz Fest with a Club Date. The finish on both is pretty oxidized. It looks painted black, hard to tell if it's original or not, or even if it's flat black or gloss. I'd take it apart, see what you really have, and clean it up some. I wouldn't go crazy trying to make it look new. Also don't know about the silver sparkle inlay on the drum hoop - might be original, they made some that way, but not sure I've seen one on an original black kick drum. I've had two Club Dates, one pre-serial keystone badge early-60s in Sky Blue Pearl, another serial number keystone badge roughly '65 in Champagne Sparkle. Never should have gotten rid of the SBP - it needed a floor tom, I shoulda just stuck it out until I found one. It was an absolute powerhouse. But I'm primarily a guitar/steel-guitar player that just likes to play drums sometimes. I'm down to a 60s Blaemire bop (18" kick) kit. Portable, sounds great. Great info the club date seems to track. I will pop the heads off this weekend and see a little more on them. Nice find by my wife for free on FB Marketplace for sure. There is also a rack tom that appears to be a 1971. no matching Floor tom though. — Social Media https://www.facebook.com/TheOutpost/ https://www.instagram.com/theoutpostmusic/ Music https://theoutpostmusic.bandcamp.com/ https://soundcloud.com/theoutpostmusic/ Merch https://the-outpost-7.creator-spring.com/ Top
murph Joined: Dec 16, 2010 Posts: 322 Chapel Hill, NC	Posted on May 25 2023 06:30 AM Definitely appears to be a 20" club date kick in black lacquer. And yep, the silver inlay is pretty common. Looks like the tom bracket was modified to accommodate two rack toms. Club dates were typically configured with a single rack and floor tom. Nickel hardware too, which really gives these drums a vibe. As others have said, also looks like a Pioneer snare. While not as crisp sounding or as responsive as an 8 or 10-lug snare, the 6-lug pioneer has a mojo all it's own. They sound absolutely fantastic for early rock-n-roll, country, and swing. I've got two that match my club date kits, and a 3rd just because. Assuming the finish on the drums are in good shape (lacquer is notorious for flaking and easily scratched up) these will clean up nicely. If you intend to keep them and play them, with a little patience you can likely find a matching 12" rack tom. With a LOT of patience (and deep pockets) you may find a matching 14" floor tom. A 16" FT would be easier to find, but tonally, there's just something magic about the club date 12/14/20 configuration. Congratz! -murph — http://www.reverbnation.com/elmiragesurf http://www.reverbnation.com/aminorconspiracy "I knew I was in trouble when the Coco-Loco tasted like water!" -- morphball Top
DaveMudgett Joined: Mar 17, 2019 Posts: 106 Central PA	Posted on May 25 2023 07:50 AM Oops - yeah, the snare is a 6-lug Pioneer. Mistook the 8 lugs on kick photo. Pioneers sound good, they're just not as controllable as the 8-lug Jazz Fest. I have a 5.5x14" Black Diamond Pearl '65 Pioneer. I like it tuned down for blues, classic country, Americana, and so on. Doesn't have the crack of the higher-end drums, but sounds very good. — The Delverados Kristi Jean and the Ne'er Do Wells and Facebook Chicken Tractor Deluxe and Facebook Top
surfbeatnik Joined: Apr 01, 2007 Posts: 340 Sea Country, CA, USA	Posted on May 25 2023 10:13 AM TheOutpost wrote: "Nice find by my wife for free on FB Marketplace for sure." Free is always nice! And, it's great to have a partner on the lookout for deals like this! Congrats on both! — Surfbeatnik Top
TheOutpost Joined: May 26, 2020 Posts: 192 Highlands Ranch	Posted on May 25 2023 06:14 PM Thanks all. This will get cleaned up and used at home for sure. — Social Media https://www.facebook.com/TheOutpost/ https://www.instagram.com/theoutpostmusic/ Music https://theoutpostmusic.bandcamp.com/ https://soundcloud.com/theoutpostmusic/ Merch https://the-outpost-7.creator-spring.com/ Top

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Ludwig Drums 1965