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SurfGuitar101 Forums » Gear »

Permalink Do BOSS pedals suck …?

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Do BOSS pedal suck or am I just unlucky?

I had a digital delay die on me a while ago and now my beloved TR-2 won’t turn on anymore…I thought BOSS pedals were rugged built and were supposed to last you at least several years before giving out…

is this why people drop 300 bucks on boutique pedals ? Lol

racingsnail84 wrote:

Do BOSS pedal suck or am I just unlucky?

I had a digital delay die on me a while ago and now my beloved TR-2 won’t turn on anymore…I thought BOSS pedals were rugged built and were supposed to last you at least several years before giving out…

is this why people drop 300 bucks on boutique pedals ? Lol

As a rule, I’ve had great luck with Boss pedals. That’s unfortunate, but I wouldn’t take it as an indication that Boss has joined the ranks of the junque vendors.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

synchro wrote:

racingsnail84 wrote:

Do BOSS pedal suck or am I just unlucky?

I had a digital delay die on me a while ago and now my beloved TR-2 won’t turn on anymore…I thought BOSS pedals were rugged built and were supposed to last you at least several years before giving out…

is this why people drop 300 bucks on boutique pedals ? Lol

As a rule, I’ve had great luck with Boss pedals. That’s unfortunate, but I wouldn’t take it as an indication that Boss has joined the ranks of the junque vendors.

I’ve had better luck with BEHRINGER pedals which are direct clones of Boss pedals costing sometimes 5 times as much lol

I’ve been thinking about getting a JHS pedal because they have a Harmonic Tremolo for only 99 bucks and it’s gotten great reviews thus far… have you tried it?

racingsnail84 wrote:

synchro wrote:

racingsnail84 wrote:

Do BOSS pedal suck or am I just unlucky?

I had a digital delay die on me a while ago and now my beloved TR-2 won’t turn on anymore…I thought BOSS pedals were rugged built and were supposed to last you at least several years before giving out…

is this why people drop 300 bucks on boutique pedals ? Lol

As a rule, I’ve had great luck with Boss pedals. That’s unfortunate, but I wouldn’t take it as an indication that Boss has joined the ranks of the junque vendors.

I’ve had better luck with BEHRINGER pedals which are direct clones of Boss pedals costing sometimes 5 times as much lol

I’ve been thinking about getting a JHS pedal because they have a Harmonic Tremolo for only 99 bucks and it’s gotten great reviews thus far… have you tried it?

Harmonic Tremolo is a great effect.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

Most pedal failures are a direct result of poor power supplies and or the sequence of powering them up relative to your amp and audio input.
Always power pedals up first and amplifier last.
Cheap China power supply banks are not properly grounded or isolated.

I have never had any issues with numerous Boss pedals powered on quality power supplies like Voodoo labs.
My only issue with Boss pedals is that they always turn on effects when powering up for first time and you then need to manually foot switch off each one.
No other pedals I own operates like that.

IceratzSurf wrote:

Most pedal failures are a direct result of poor power supplies and or the sequence of powering them up relative to your amp and audio input.
Always power pedals up first and amplifier last.
Cheap China power supply banks are not properly grounded or isolated.

I have never had any issues with numerous Boss pedals powered on quality power supplies like Voodoo labs.
My only issue with Boss pedals is that they always turn on effects when powering up for first time and you then need to manually foot switch off each one.
No other pedals I own operates like that.

that’s an interesting point you make about the power supply…. Never heard about that till now.

thanks!

IceratzSurf wrote:

Most pedal failures are a direct result of poor power supplies and or the sequence of powering them up relative to your amp and audio input.
Always power pedals up first and amplifier last.
Cheap China power supply banks are not properly grounded or isolated.

I have never had any issues with numerous Boss pedals powered on quality power supplies like Voodoo labs.
My only issue with Boss pedals is that they always turn on effects when powering up for first time and you then need to manually foot switch off each one.
No other pedals I own operates like that.

That’s a characteristic of the flip/flop circuit which controls the bypass switch. The DM-2W I use on my living room board usually doesn’t come on spontaneously, when I power up the board, buts sort of a coin toss, decided by which transistor in the flip/flop wakes up first.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

I am not fan of them in terms of the sound but there wasn’t much choice in 90s here so I have used them on scene for years, with heavy abuse including fighting with them, spilling beer with vodka and dropping them down the floor and then I sold them in totally working condition. I think they still work.

Waikiki Makaki surf-rock band from Ukraine

New Single is out!

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Waikiki Makaki

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-

Last edited: Feb 02, 2024 16:14:49

Tqi wrote:

Depends on the pedal?

I'm using a TU-2 on my board without any issues for a decade now. But on my older DS-1, the microswitch is problematic. Probably fixable, but a Taiwan DS-1 isn't a sound I need anymore, so I don't stress about it.

As a general rule I prefer proper clicky switches - but I always have the Boss TU in as a buffer, as well as a Tuner. I use a pedal tremolo and an AB/Y to two amps, both of which pedals need the buffer in the chain to work right. It's not had any issues in ten years.

Boss, for the good, or for the bad, uses a momentary switch to control bypass. My DD-5 sometimes takes a couple of clicks, but I don’t use it all that often, these days. Probably fixable, but it’s been put out to pasture at this point, so I doubt that I’ll bother.

Boss gave us some very good things. Some people dislike buffered bypass, but buffers give us some good things. IMO, there should be a buffered pedal at the beginning of the pedalboard, offering a high input impedance after the patch cable between the guitar and the board. On my boards, the last pedal is a Blossom Point, which is not buffered bypass, but is always on, so it functions as an exit buffer, providing a low impedance to the patch cable between the board and the amp.

In between, the first and last pedal, non-buffered bypass probably won’t cause any problems, but if you have a long string of such pedals, you might have to insert a buffer, or a buffered pedal, somewhere along the line. It’s also important to understand that virtually every pedal is buffered when it’s engaged.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

Considering the fact that nearly all the fancy boutique pedals are some version/direct copy of a Boss pedal, I’d say no. I’ve never had one stop working or know anyone personally that has. Too much time is wasted fussing over whether there is any noticeable difference in a Boss pedal or the same exact pedal in a different box for $300 more. As far as the “buffer” issue, wasn’t anything anyone was concerned with until the internet. Also, if your tone is drastically changed or “sucked” because of pedals, maybe take off half the pedals on the board. Too many people play with too many pedals. I’m not attacking anyone here, but this is a dead horse of a thread that I repeatedly see on other forums.

That said, the Boss/Fender reverb pedal everyone loves and is now a ridiculous price used is the single worst reverb pedal I’ve ever heard. It sounds nothing like an actual Fender reverb unit.

J

Last edited: May 20, 2023 13:30:56

nismosurf wrote:

Considering the fact that nearly all the fancy boutique pedals are some version/direct copy of a Boss pedal, I’d say no. I’ve never had one stop working or know anyone personally that has. Too much time is wasted fussing over whether there is any noticeable difference in a Boss pedal or the same exact pedal in a different box for $300 more. As far as the “buffer” issue, wasn’t anything anyone was concerned with until the internet. Also, if your tone is drastically changed or “sucked” because of pedals, maybe take off half the pedals on the board. Too many people play with too many pedals. I’m not attacking anyone here, but this is a dead horse of a thread that I repeatedly see on other forums.

That said, the Boss/Fender reverb pedal everyone loves and is now a ridiculous price used is the single worst reverb pedal I’ve ever heard. It sounds nothing like an actual Fender reverb unit.

J

I like your point. The more pedals you have on your board, the more chance there is to experience signal losses. Buffers themselves are unity gain op amps with a high input impedance, and a low output impedance. Unless it’s an absolute junk circuit, it will be essentially transparent.

I think of it like this, if I were to put a single pane of glass between myself and the picture hanging on my wall, there would be little, if any loss. If I kept adding additional layers of “essentially transparent” glass, eventually the picture would lose definition and as I added additional layers, the effect would become more profound, to the point of obscuring the picture, entirely.

There was a YouTube video where I guy stacked 10 buffers, and indeed, the sound had some minor losses. It wasn’t terrible, but it wasn’t ideal either. The video made a point, but it was hardly a scathing indictment of buffers. No device has perfect fidelity, so each added device multiplies the fidelity by a number less than one, so stacking 10 of anything will have a negative effect.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

I've had/have good luck with Boss, currently use Boss TR2 and Boss TU waza. Both have been reliable. Pedals do fail at times, could be just a pedal with component failure, could be bad power supply that caused the failure, physical abuse from travel etc. I have a 20 year old Boss TU2 that's kind of finicky but I've replaced with TU waza.

If using a power supply have you make sure it's the correct volate and mA

Last edited: May 21, 2023 10:07:49

I've used Boss pedals off and on for pushing 4 decades, and I don't recall any of them ever outright failing. I haven't bought a new one in a pretty long time, and perhaps there are more issues now - a lot of pedal makers (including Boss) have moved to surface-mounted components. A general review here - https://stinkfoot.se/archives/3203

I confess I don't like surface-mounted stuff. I just don't feel like getting into dealing with modding or fixing electronics made like this. It can be done, but it is a different paradigm and requires special tools and a deft technique. I don't know if this creates any additional reliability issues. However, I am slightly suspicious of tiny components, as that seems to me to rely on tighter control to maintain a reaonable margin of error. But I don't have stats to back that up one way or another.

But my main issue with Boss pedals is that I have come to strongly prefer true-bypass pedals, and they decided a long time ago to go all-in on buffered bypass. It is a cottage industry modifying older Boss (and other) pedals to true bypass. Ergo, with the move to surface-mount technology, I refuse to have anything to do with rougly post-2016 Boss pedals.

In most situations, I want to be able to pull everything out of the pedal signal chain but a straight wire to get the actual sound of the amp. If I want an always-on buffer, I put a buffer in front. Sometimes I use a buffered pedal to accomplish that, but I often use Brad Sarno's Freeloader (which has a variable input impedance knob) or occasionally his Black Box, which is tube-based. Brad tends to makes stuff oriented towards pedal steel players, but they work great for guitar also - this page gives links to everything he's doing these days - https://www.sarnomusicsolutions.com/store.html#

Of course, there is a pretty wide assortment of pedal bypass techniques, and at least Boss does use a well-designed active buffer. Many pedals, especially a lot of cheap ones, use bypass techniques that load down the signal in undesirable ways. A lot of the 'classic' pedals did this. But at least they were easy to mod to true bypass, or even add a buffer if you want. To me, the ideal scenario would be to be able to switch between actual true bypass and a well-designed active buffer, as the Klon KTR has. Too bad those aren't being made anymore - the price has shot up the last couple of years. Here we go again ...

The Delverados - surf, punk, trash, twang - Facebook
Chicken Tractor Deluxe - hardcore Americana - Facebook and Website
The Telegrassers - semi-electric bluegrass/Americana - Facebook

DaveMudgett wrote:

I've used Boss pedals off and on for pushing 4 decades, and I don't recall any of them ever outright failing. I haven't bought a new one in a pretty long time, and perhaps there are more issues now - a lot of pedal makers (including Boss) have moved to surface-mounted components. A general review here - https://stinkfoot.se/archives/3203

I confess I don't like surface-mounted stuff. I just don't feel like getting into dealing with modding or fixing electronics made like this. It can be done, but it is a different paradigm and requires special tools and a deft technique. I don't know if this creates any additional reliability issues. However, I am slightly suspicious of tiny components, as that seems to me to rely on tighter control to maintain a reaonable margin of error. But I don't have stats to back that up one way or another.

But my main issue with Boss pedals is that I have come to strongly prefer true-bypass pedals, and they decided a long time ago to go all-in on buffered bypass. It is a cottage industry modifying older Boss (and other) pedals to true bypass. Ergo, with the move to surface-mount technology, I refuse to have anything to do with rougly post-2016 Boss pedals.

In most situations, I want to be able to pull everything out of the pedal signal chain but a straight wire to get the actual sound of the amp. If I want an always-on buffer, I put a buffer in front. Sometimes I use a buffered pedal to accomplish that, but I often use Brad Sarno's Freeloader (which has a variable input impedance knob) or occasionally his Black Box, which is tube-based. Brad tends to makes stuff oriented towards pedal steel players, but they work great for guitar also - this page gives links to everything he's doing these days - https://www.sarnomusicsolutions.com/store.html#

Of course, there is a pretty wide assortment of pedal bypass techniques, and at least Boss does use a well-designed active buffer. Many pedals, especially a lot of cheap ones, use bypass techniques that load down the signal in undesirable ways. A lot of the 'classic' pedals did this. But at least they were easy to mod to true bypass, or even add a buffer if you want. To me, the ideal scenario would be to be able to switch between actual true bypass and a well-designed active buffer, as the Klon KTR has. Too bad those aren't being made anymore - the price has shot up the last couple of years. Here we go again ...

I’m with you on the idea of switchable bypass.

I’m not real enthused about SMD in pedals, but that’s the way of the world, and one of the big reasons that pedal prices are no higher than they already are.

I’m basically pretty positive on Boss. As you say, their buffers are decent. I have several Waza Craft pedals, and the buffers are about as transparent as any I’ve ever heard. I wish that Boss would change their circuits to allow switchable bypass, and hopefully, replace the flip/flop with a more positive way to control the power on state of their pedals.

Boss’ current reverb pedal is surprisingly good.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

-

Last edited: Feb 02, 2024 16:14:44

Tqi wrote:

synchro wrote:

I’m not real enthused about SMD in pedals, but that’s the way of the world, and one of the big reasons that pedal prices are no higher than they already are.

I'd take a £60 pedal that can be fixed if it breaks over a £40 pedal that can't. Same as why I avoid digital amps. I'm genuinely concerned that as the last niches of TH electronics vanish, amateur design and repair is either going to vanish, or become far less accessible. Most ten year olds can solder a simple PCB full of passives and DIP stuff with basic support and a little practice. Same board in SMD, not so much. SMD soldering gear is far more expensive, and doing SMD with old TH tools by hand is very possible, but a very difficult skill.

Death to SMD in guitar gear!

I’m with you in principle but … SMD is the future, because it’s a lot simpler to manufacture, robotically. I don’t like it, for many of the same reason you mention, but short of hand built pedals from specialty makers, that’s what we’ll be seeing.

I work on computerized communications devices, as part of my occupation. These are basically specialized computers which are used for various data communications functions. Most have a CR 2032 cell which powers the non-volatile RAM, and if this cell fails, instead of swapping it out in the field, they want you to ship it back to them to have that cell replaced. That’s the degree to which they don’t want us to so much as open the enclosure, in the field, amd many of these devices have tattletale protection of one sort or another. Pop off the cover, and all support is null and void. I don’t like it, but it’s the world I live with.

Sadly, we live in a world where our electronic devices are essentially considered disposable.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

Most have a CR 2032 cell which powers the non-volatile RAM, and if this cell fails, instead of swapping it out in the field, they want you to ship it back to them to have that cell replaced. That’s the degree to which they don’t want us to so much as open the enclosure, in the field, amd many of these devices have tattletale protection of one sort or another. Pop off the cover, and all support is null and void. I don’t like it, but it’s the world I live with.

Sadly, we live in a world where our electronic devices are essentially considered disposable.

Yes, this is embodied in many service/warranty plans for guitar electronics for the last 10+ years - do not service and replace if under warranty. Personally, I think this type of 'disposable goods' philosophy is madness, from multiple points of view.

First - I do not intend to constantly have to re-purchase guitar electronics because of planned obsolescence. The situation with communications/computing hardware has been, for a long time, quite different because of extremely rapid improvements in computing power and speed, plus the need to keep the device size and especially heat dissipation down. Modern electronics design and SMD makes total sense here, and is often mandatory. My technical background is electrical engineering and computer science. I get it.

However, with some exceptions - e.g., sophisticated devices like harmonizers and some modern time-based effects - the technology of a large proportion of guitar pedals is ancient and fairly simple. I just don't see much rationale to do, e.g., SMD overdrive/distortion and other old-school effects. Many, many guitarists crave the old-school effects, and IMO there's no real engineering reason to build them differently. Save a few bucks for what? From the consumer point of view, this seems penny-wise/pound-foolish to me. But they'll keep on doing it if people keep buying them.

Second - many of the same companies pushing this are yacking incessantly about environmental concerns which, again, seems to me, frequently has much more to do with marketing. I'm not dumping on anybody in particular - this seems to be fairly pervasive in the music biz. The disposable culture - especially when dealing with the toxic stuff in modern electronic devices - makes no sense from this point of view. I think we need to return to a model where we buy stuff that is expected to last, can be repaired, modified to suit, and so on.

I understand using SMD if there is a reasonable engineering rationale - sometimes there is. As far a smaller through-hole builders go - not all of this stuff is priced in the stratosphere. Prices are frequently in the same ballpark as the bigger makers like Boss, Ibanez, and others. I understand someone without a lot of money going with the really cheap clones. I mean, if an SMD pedal is $20-30, I get that. But most of the big makers' pedals are sold as premium products, and priced accordingly. I expect more from a premium product.

The Delverados - surf, punk, trash, twang - Facebook
Chicken Tractor Deluxe - hardcore Americana - Facebook and Website
The Telegrassers - semi-electric bluegrass/Americana - Facebook

Boss pedals that I have bought DO NOT SUCK!!!

They have lasted through many gigs and taken a pounding. I still use them more than any other pedal. Boss pedals I still have/use

DD-3 My 2000-2016 go to delay for recording and live. Beer spilled, abused, dropped, still sounds great

ME-70 Current use dependent on gig or recording. Solid, but I think it doesn't sound as the individual pedals linked. A lot of nuances and I'm not a good nuance guy.

TU-2 Best tuner I've had

RV-5 Reverb - use very rarely

OD-3 Overdrive - use very rarely

AC-2 Acoustic Simulator - fun pedal, but rarely used.

Of course I still have my non boss pedals Surfy Bear Reverb, Blossom Point, Surf Trem, etc., but Boss has been good to me and I like how they respond when you adjust them. Very predictable.

Surfcat

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Surf, the most dangerous of all musical genres...

Have been using BOSS pedals since probably 1986 or '87 and in all that time have only ever had one fail on me - my CE-2 I got in 1988 has finally gotten crackly Sad

I swear by the TU-2 and can't imagine my pedalboard without one. I also use delays (DM-2, DD-7), phaser (PH-2), tremolo, Octaver, a few others on a regular basis.

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