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SurfGuitar101 Forums » Gear »

Permalink Tube vs digital amps….does it still matter? RI vs Tone Master

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In the age of highly sophisticated computer processors and sound emulators it is 98% impossible to tell the fundamental difference between a ri Fender tube amp vs its Tone Master counterpart….

I myself have a hell of a time telling the difference which means the audience absolutely can’t tell….

My biggest reservation to the tone master is its LONGEVITY….. WILL YOU BE ABLE TO PURCHASE A TONE MASTER AND BE ABLE TO USE IT NON STOP WITHOUT AND EXPENSIVE UPDates, repairs etc…. In 10 -20 years…?

Discuss…..

Last edited: Mar 09, 2023 21:32:27

They sound great and audience surely will nor hear any difference. But for me it’s a huge difference in feel, response and fun when you are playing. That is the only reason I still stick to tube and solid state amps and pedals.

Waikiki Makaki surf-rock band from Ukraine

New Single is out!

https://waikikimakaki.bandcamp.com/album/rhino-blues-full-contact-surf-single

Waikiki Makaki

https://linktr.ee/waikikimakaki

Lost Diver

https://lostdiver.bandcamp.com
https://soundcloud.com/vitaly-yakushin

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Last edited: Feb 02, 2024 16:05:59

Agree with tqi's points.

Updates and repairs - I think major PCB repairs will be next to impossible, but the market will be full of used ones and/or parts so it won't be hard to put one back together, or just buy one used cheap. Just like my 90's tube amps. These Tonemasters aren't connected to anything (no "internet of things"), so updates aren't necessary, unless some dummy programmer built a stop-clock to make the thing die at a certain date. The amps will just run-as is like an old cell phone with no available updates, until it doesn't work any more.

As to the cost/value - it's an overpriced one trick pony (or a few tricks anyway). There are better multi-amp sim units out there for sure, in my case I weighed lugging a cab with one of those multi units around, and just came to the conclusion that a straight 1 for 1 swap for what I use now worked better. I have a Princeton DRRI, a Princeton Tonemaster, a Delxue Reverb RI, and a DR Tonemaster (along with some other amps, but those are primaries).

I use tube for studio and Tonemasters for gigs (ease of use, lightweight, XLR out, etc, etc, etc).

Not super passionate about it, they're just tools.

Bango Rilla!


DiPintos, Fenders and Reverb (oh, my!)

The GO-GO Rillas
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Personally, I would be much more excited about an analog solid state version of any of the classic Fender amps using FETs, like Tqi discusses. You can get great tones, portability, reliability, and longevity that way, but most amp makers don't bother to even try.

edwardsand wrote:

Personally, I would be much more excited about an analog solid state version of any of the classic Fender amps using FETs, like Tqi discusses. You can get great tones, portability, reliability, and longevity that way, but most amp makers don't bother to even try.

But we have them. They are called Quilter.

Waikiki Makaki surf-rock band from Ukraine

New Single is out!

https://waikikimakaki.bandcamp.com/album/rhino-blues-full-contact-surf-single

Waikiki Makaki

https://linktr.ee/waikikimakaki

Lost Diver

https://lostdiver.bandcamp.com
https://soundcloud.com/vitaly-yakushin

-

Last edited: Feb 02, 2024 16:05:47

Tqi wrote:

Samurai wrote:

But we have them. They are called Quilter.

I mean, sort of? Don't get me wrong, they're super cool amps - but they're still emulations with a Class-D power stage - What I was describing is really more a component by component reproduction of the original circuit, in full Class A mode. Smile

Got you. Like Surfybear copies Fender unit with FET transistors.

Waikiki Makaki surf-rock band from Ukraine

New Single is out!

https://waikikimakaki.bandcamp.com/album/rhino-blues-full-contact-surf-single

Waikiki Makaki

https://linktr.ee/waikikimakaki

Lost Diver

https://lostdiver.bandcamp.com
https://soundcloud.com/vitaly-yakushin

People listen with their eyes, and I’m as guilty of that as the next fellow. Tonemasters command the price that they do, because they look like Classic, vintage, amps. They sound pretty good, according to many people whose comments I’ve read on various forums, so I guess that they are good enough for a lot of folks.

As to durability; who knows? Repairability is probably not all that good, but consumer electronics can be very long-lived, so it’s probably not a worry, for most of us.

Personally, I’ll carry a tube amp. I have a couple of Fender amps, four Winfield amps and a Crate Power Block that I take along as an emergency backup on gigs. Most of the time, I use a small amp, 5-15 watts, and mic’ it.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

I have an orange super crush…and it’s every bit as good as my bassman and ampeg mercury…check out the orange super crush…you’ll be pleasantly surprised by the depth, attack and warmth of that solid state amp…I personally could never bond with any of the tone master except the blonde twin…I have played a lot of solid state amps and orange hands down is the best

Last edited: Mar 10, 2023 21:05:09

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Last edited: Feb 02, 2024 16:05:38

I owned one of the first reissue deluxe reverbs in the mid 90s. DRRI. With some upgrades (tubes, speaker), it became a solid, quite useful amp.

I traded into one of the TM DRs recently. It is exactly as advertised and described. A very good sounding, easy amp to transport and use. I'd rather have the TM version than the RI tube DR. Cheaper, lighter, close enough in sound and feel. Neither of these modern options can replace the vintage BF or SF DR, should you have one. I do, which gives me the context in which to assess both the reissue and tonemaster DR offerings.

As the boomers reach a certain age I expect that amp weight has or will become an issue. Perhaps that's why the digitals are popular considering the need to haul a heavy tube amp across a parking lot and/or up two flights of stairs to a gig or rehearsal. Yes, you can do it with separate cabs and amps but that's a couple of more trips during load in and out. To my ears I can still hear the difference between tube and digital but the digital is improving every year narrowing the gap.

Happy Sunsets!

I greatly prefer tube amps to digital. That said, I am of the age that weight is a big factor. My preference, now, is neither tube, nor digital, but Quilter, class D analog, It's close enough to tube sound and feel, and to my ears, much more natural sounding than digital.

Bob

RobbieReverb wrote:

I greatly prefer tube amps to digital. That said, I am of the age that weight is a big factor. My preference, now, is neither tube, nor digital, but Quilter, class D analog, It's close enough to tube sound and feel, and to my ears, much more natural sounding than digital.

I just use a small amp. Mic’ a good 5 watt amp through the PA and it will sound as big as a Showman. I played an outdoor gig a few years back, using a Winfield Typhoon (Vox front end, 5 watt class A power section) with a mic’ in front of it. During the set, I wandered to the very front of the stage, where I could hear the mains, and it sounded *huge!* Stage volume was at living room levels, and the amp was clean, but the PA did the heavy lifting, which beats the hell out of me doing heavy lifting. Smile

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.

Last edited: Mar 11, 2023 16:50:01

Synchro, I totally agree that that's a great way to go.

Bob

I've been using a Universal Audio Dream 65 through a Headrush FRFR 8" speaker. I think the sound is close enough to a Fender clean sound. It's got a nice reverb sound.

I also own a Tone King Imperial MKII tube amp. I sold all my heavy amps to get that one. It needs new tubes. I just haven't gotten around to buying them. The last time I attempted to, every place was out due to supply chain issues.

I'm a couch surfer and play mostly clean / dirty clean. I use a Fender Mustang GTX50 (digital modeling amp). It offers many clean tones from different amp models (not just one clean amp and many overdriven/distorted amps like it's competitor the Boss Katana). There must be 15 or so Fender amp models in it. Fox and Marshall too. I tend to use the '65 Twin and Dual Showman.

I really like the GTX50. Can't believe digital got this good this quickly at this price. Easy to use and to get your tone. Presets are useable right out of the box and you can very easily tweak them to your taste, either on the amp or with the well designed app. Many types and versions of effects too. I only use reverb, trem and delay so haven't really explored into that part of it. It's got wifi, bluetooth, aux microphone and headphone, effects loop and USB connectivity. Come on now. A package you can't beat at that price. The $80 foot switch (extra) really completes it.

One caveat: it doesn't offer a proper drippy reverb. So I think I'm putting a Surfy Bear in front of it.

I don't even use my 40 watt Fender Deluxe VM. It's too loud for a couch surfer. Gonna sell that one.

Last edited: Mar 12, 2023 03:14:33

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Last edited: Feb 02, 2024 16:05:18

synchro wrote:

RobbieReverb wrote:

I greatly prefer tube amps to digital. That said, I am of the age that weight is a big factor. My preference, now, is neither tube, nor digital, but Quilter, class D analog, It's close enough to tube sound and feel, and to my ears, much more natural sounding than digital.

I just use a small amp. Mic’ a good 5 watt amp through the PA and it will sound as big as a Showman. I played an outdoor gig a few years back, using a Winfield Typhoon (Vox front end, 5 watt class A power section) with a mic’ in front of it. During the set, I wandered to the very front of the stage, where I could hear the mains, and it sounded *huge!* Stage volume was at living room levels, and the amp was clean, but the PA did the heavy lifting, which beats the hell out of me doing heavy lifting. Smile

I am getting pretty good results recording 1 watt tube head through 12 inch cab and mic. I’ve also ordered Blossom Point to saturate it on low volumes cause even 1 watt is the hell loud for home recording. I may show the results soon if anyone interested.

Waikiki Makaki surf-rock band from Ukraine

New Single is out!

https://waikikimakaki.bandcamp.com/album/rhino-blues-full-contact-surf-single

Waikiki Makaki

https://linktr.ee/waikikimakaki

Lost Diver

https://lostdiver.bandcamp.com
https://soundcloud.com/vitaly-yakushin

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