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SurfGuitar101 Forums » Surf Music General Discussion »

Permalink Shadows okay for a Surf band?

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I recently was talking to some guys from another band that does mainly instrumental/surf music. I mentioned were planning on doing some Shadows. We mainlydo old school surf and Ventures.
They promptly said well then you're not a surf band.
My question we consider ourselves a surf band as that was our common love to why we did the band in the first place. We also love other guitar instrumental stuuf including blues (Freddie King), country stuff and bands like the Shadows.

My question to be a surf band why couldn't you do this other music and still be calling yourself a Surf band? Or do need to strictly do ONLY 'Surf' music?

Why would you care what they think?
Seems like they pride themselves of being 'pure' surf, and want to distinguish themselves from the lesser 'pure'. That is ego driven and not quite historically correct too, as many surf bands from all eras dabbled in other instro stuff to some extent. The limits of the genre aren't that cut and dry.
OTH, if most of your material is Shadows / Ventures /Freddie King / country based and then some surf, it might be more honest to define yourselves "old school instro stuff", or something. ('Surf' is catchier, yes).
So, depends on the percentage I guess. It will help you as a band and for future promotions to decide what you are, but then again, who cares.

Last edited: Nov 15, 2019 00:47:16

meh, i think surf is a good catch all for most of the reverb/echo. my band has plenty of non-surf elements but it's mostly surf. i'd say if your band is 51% surf you might as well call it surf to simplify things

-Pierre
The Obsidians! (Ottawa surf)
The Obsidians debut EP

Whether or not The Shadows are technically a surf band (and sure, they're not), playing Shadows songs doesn't make you not a surf band. By that logic, Dick Dale is not a surf musician for playing Misirlou.

Storm Surge of Reverb: Surf & Instro Radio

Ariel wrote:

Seems like they pride themselves of being 'pure' surf and want to distinguish themselves from the lesser 'pure'. That is ego driven and not quite historically correct too, as many surf bands from all eras dabbled in other instro stuff to some extent. The limits of the genre aren't that cut and dry.

Well said. I think it is safe to include a great deal of instrumentals from The Shadows and The Ventures catalogs in your sets and still be called a surf band. When I was writing up my Classic Instrumental Surf Music Timeline, I could not tell the story accurately without including many “Proto-Surf” instrumentals.

Just for grins, I thought it would fun to list those “safe” instrumentals and see what else the SG101 community could add. In keeping with my “Classic” theme let’s limit the pool to 1969 or earlier.

Here’s the link to my full timeline, if you are interested:
https://surfguitar101.com/forums/topic/31843/?page=1#p426008

Timeline of “Proto-Surf” from the Classic Instrumental Surf Music Timeline – Surf’s First Wave

Guide to code keys:
[Proto-Surf] – Instrumentals that pre-date the generally accepted “Let’s Go Trippin’” & “Mr. Moto” Birth of Surf in late 1961, or Non-surf instrumentals that are a significant influence and/or sometimes included in surf band repertoire.
[BillboardYE100/xx] – Top Position on National Billboard Year-End Hot 100 Charts
[BillboardTop10/x] – Top position on weekly National Billboard Top 10.
[NorthSeaSurf101/xx] – Position in the SurfGuitar101/North Sea Surf Radio Top 101 in the December 2016 vote.
MM/YY – Month and Year of single release. If not available, it’s the date of the album release.*
[[ 1957 ]]

”Raunchy” – Bill Justis 9/57 [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/55] This Alabama sax man convinced Sam Phillips to make him Sun Records' music director. It was during this tenure that Bill wrote and recorded the #2 1957 smash. Raunchy is one of first to use the twangy lead guitar effect, which was later developed by others and became a staple for the next few years. Soon after the hit, guitarist Duane Eddy and producer Lee Hazlewood took it upon themselves to develop that style to an ultimate degree. They greatly enhanced the reverberation in their recordings, creating a far from light lead guitar sound.


[[ 1958 ]]

"Rumble" - Link Wray 3/58 [Proto-Surf, NorthSeaSurf101#67]

This is the earliest “Surf” track awarded a place in the North Sea Surf Radio / SurfGuitar101 Classic Top 101 Surf Music Poll.

”Tequila” – The Champs [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/8]

“Rebel Rouser” – Duane Eddy [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/46] Duane Eddy’s influence on the birth of Surf Music is cited by many surf guitarists.

Duane Eddy (born April 26, 1938) is an American guitarist. In the late 1950s and early 1960s, he had a string of hit records produced by Lee Hazlewood which were noted for their characteristically "twangy" sound, including "Rebel Rouser", "Peter Gunn", and "Because They're Young". He had sold 12 million records by 1963.
Eddy devised a technique of playing lead on his guitar's bass strings to produce a low, reverberant "twangy" sound. In November 1957, Eddy recorded an instrumental, "Movin' n' Groovin'", co-written by Eddy and Hazlewood. As the Phoenix studio had no echo chamber, Hazlewood bought a 2,000-gallon (7570-litre) water storage tank which he used as an echo chamber to accentuate the "twangy" guitar sound.


[[ 1959 ]]

"Bulldog" - The Fireballs 1/59 [Proto-Surf, NorthSeaSurf101#101]

Dick Clark's American Bandstand show, January 4, 1960, featured them performing "Bulldog". Little did the Fireballs know by now that their guitar instrumental music was one of the foundational influences of the Surf music culture that was starting to make big waves. Later, coupled with a new vocalist, the Fireballs savored success in a new dimension. "Sugar Shack", a vocal released in 1963 on DOT records, was a #1 hit and the largest selling single of that year. More vocal singles and albums followed. It was a very unique transition in the music business for an 'instrumental guitar band' to become 'vocal' and retain prestige in both fields.

“Sleep Walk” – Santo & Johnny [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/11]

“Red River Rock” – Johnny & The Hurricanes [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/31]

“Guitar Boogie Shuffle” – The Virtues [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/35]

“Teen Beat” – Sandy Nelson [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/36]

“Forty Miles of Bad Road” – Duane Eddy [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/59]

“The Peter Gunn Theme” – Ray Anthony [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/67]


[[ 1960 ]]

“Because They’re Young” – Duane Eddy [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/37]

“Apache” – The Shadows 6/60 [Proto-Surf, NorthSeaSurf101#90] Number 1 in Britain, 7/60. What The Ventures did for guitar-based instrumental bands in the U.S., The Shadows’ Apache did in England. In 1961, Danish jazz guitarist Jørgen Ingmann's cover of "Apache" (which he recorded in the fall of 1960) went to No. 2 in the US and No. 2 in Canada.

A 1973 version by the Incredible Bongo Band has been called "hip-hop’s national anthem". Although this version was not a hit on release, its long percussion break has been sampled countless times on hip hop and dance tracks since the 1980s.]

”Walk Don’t Run” – The Ventures 12/60 [Proto-Surf, NorthSeaSurf101#23, BillboardYE100/25] Personal note: Purist don’t consider this to be surf music, but I do. This was the blueprint for what was to come and launched a thousand garage bands.

”Although not considered a surf band, their influence and inspiration strongly affected every surf instrumental band that followed. They are the number one instrumental rock band in pop music history” (J. Blair)

"Moon Dawg!" - The Gamblers ?/60 [Proto-Surf, NorthSeaSurf101#82] Predates the earliest surf instrumentals, but influential to the surf music genre.

[[ 1961 ]] - There was no shortage of Billboard Hot 100 instrumental music in ’61. That would change by ’65, but with Rock & Roll on the ropes with Elvis in the army and the death of Buddy Holly and Ritchie Valens, the rise of the solo Singer, and with the public very accepting of instrumental music, the stage was set for a new sound of rock in the form of surf music.

“Wheels” – String-a-longs [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/8] Released in 1960, the tune peaked at #3 on the Billboard Hot 100 and was the #8 single of the year.

”Underwater” – the Frogmen 4/61 [Proto-Surf]

The April 17, 1961 issue of Billboard touted the song as a breakout single in Seattle and Los Angeles. It peaked at #44 on the Billboard Pop Hot 100. “Underwater” is considered by some to be the first surfing instrumental, predating Dick Dale's influential “Let's Go Trippin'” and The Marketts’ “Surfer's Stomp” by several months.

In a June 1992 interview with author Stephen McParland, Jack Andrews, the writer of the song, said that The Frogmen were a four-piece band from Culver City (called The Corsairs, J. Blair) that he met at a party. He took them into American Recording and cut "Underwater." (The tune was originally called "The Happy Frog, J. Blair) Andrews told McParland, "I shopped it to every record company in town and got booted out...by every [one]. Then my friend Joe Saraceno told me I should overdub something on it to make it more interesting, so I went back in the studio. H.B. Barnum had just done a session and he had a bunch of percussion stuff around. [Engineer Frank DeLuna] happened to pick up a guiro [pronounced "wee-ro," this is a Spanish percussion instrument typically consisting of a long-necked gourd that is sounded by scraping a stick over ridges cut into its surface] and he began making this croaking sound [with it] as we were playing the tape. I said, 'Hey, can you do that on mike?' and he said, 'Yeah, but who's gonna engineer it?' and I said, 'I will.' So, he went out and played and I engineered. Then I took it out and shopped it again."

Saraceno worked for Candix Records and helped get the record released on that label, but was not involved in the recording, itself. According to Andrews, Saraceno also came up with the name Frogmen. Little is known about the band because the members were all under 18 years old at the time "Underwater" was recorded. They were basically a high school band that recorded a few singles and then broke up.

"Jack the Ripper" - Link Wray 7/61 [Proto-Surf, NorthSeaSurf101#21]

“Apache” – Jorgen Ingmann 7/60 [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/35] It was Ingmann, not The Shadows, that scored a hit with “Apache” in the United States. In 1961, Danish jazz guitarist Jørgen Ingmann's cover of "Apache" (which he recorded in the fall of 1960) went to No. 2 in the US and No. 2 in Canada.

[[ Ground Zero – The Birth of Surf - September 1961 ]]

"Intoxica" - The Revels ?/61 [Proto-Surf, NorthSeaSurf101#80]


[[ 1962 ]] - The Surf Craze – High gear period of instrumental surf music.

“James Bond theme” - 10/62 [Proto-Surf]

Telstar – The Tornados 12/62 [Proto-Surf] a 1962 instrumental written and produced by Joe Meek for the English band the Tornados. The track reached number 1 on the U.S. Billboard Hot 100 in December 1962]


[[ 1963 ]]

“Wild Weekend” – The Rockin’ Rebels [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/22] Released in 1961, Originally a vocal song, it was written by Tom Shannon and Phil Todaro as a theme song for Shannon’s radio show. The Buffalo Rebels, or Rebels, asked Shannon to play at a record hop and also asked if they could play his theme song. They did and Shannon and Todaro thought there was something to it. They moved the group to a recording studio in the same building where they had a production office. The record came out locally and was a hit, but since it wasn't on a major label, the song just stopped. In 1963 the track was re-issued on Swan Records (Swan 4125) and reached #8 on the national charts. To avoid confusion with Duane Eddy and his Rebels, the Rebels became the Rockin' Rebels. Swan pressings can be found with either name.


[[ 1964 ]] - The Beatles appear on Ed Sullivan. They have 9 Billboard Top 100 year-end hits. The British Invasion begins. Hot Rod music (esp. Vocal) kicks in.


[[ 1965 ]] – The Year that Surf Music’s First Wave Ended


[[ 1966 ]]

“No Matter What Shape (Your Stomach’s In)” – The T-Bones [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/66]


[[ 1967 ]] There is nothing remotely surfy in the Billboard Year-End Hot 100)


[[ 1968 ]]

“The Good, The Bad and the Ugly” – Hugo Montenegro [Proto-Surf, BillboardYE100/8] Embraced by surf musicians, the Spaghetti Western lives on as a sub-genre of instrumental surf rock. "While surf music gives you the feeling of riding the waves, spaghetti western music conjures images of riding tall in the saddle," says Ted James, owner of Deep Eddy Records in Austin, Texas, a label that specializes in surf, instrumental rock and garage.]

-Tim
MyYouTubeChannel
My Classic Instrumental Surf Music Timeline
SSS Agent #777

I love music snobs! That friend of yours is being utterly ridiculous. Utterly, utterly ridiculous. Just tell him:

“Surf is a style, and we’re a surf band.”

Daniel Deathtide

The Challengers (Foot Tapper, Dance On, Apache, Guitar Tango) and The Sandals (Jet Black) can’t be wrong.

The Exotic Guitar of Kahuna Kawentzmann

You can get the boy out of the Keynes era, but you can’t get the Keynes era out of the boy.

So now we have trve kvlt svrf like the black metal guys?

Post deleted by author.

Last edited: Mar 10, 2020 15:46:36

We first learned about "The Rise and Fall of Flingel Bunt" from The Challengers!

http://www.satanspilgrims.com
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Satans-Pilgrims/8210228553
https://satanspilgrims.bandcamp.com/
http://www.surfyindustries.com

In my opinion, if the music was predominantly Shadows and Atlantic covers, it would be a stretch too far to say "surf". If was, as el camello pointed out, predominantly surf with a healthy dose of non-surf instro, surf can still be used (again, IMO).
Lots of original, celebrated surf groups adapted soundtrack songs, pre-surf instro, and world music into their performances/records.

Lorne
The Surf Shakers: https://www.facebook.com/TheSurfShakers
Vancouver BC Canada

I've played in surf bands that have done vocals through necessity or desire. Beach Boys is not surf, but they played surf. Our band is surf, but we play a few things not surf. What does your gut tell you? Does the ocean and surf inspire your troops to greatness on stage?? Then I say damn the critics and wear the label "surf band" proudly!!!

BTW - do you have a link to your band's site? I didn't see it.

Surfcat

2023 SG101 Compilation - Tribute to Noel
The Journey Home - Agent Octopus (Our SG101 Comp download)

From Atlantis with Love - Released - July 2023
Agent Octopus-Spotify
Christmas on the Beach - NEW SINGLE Dec 2023!!
Reverb Galaxy - Angle of Attack CD - BANDCAMP

Surf, the most dangerous of all musical genres...

Ariel wrote:

Why would you care what they think?
Seems like they pride themselves of being 'pure' surf, and want to distinguish themselves from the lesser 'pure'. That is ego driven and not quite historically correct too, as many surf bands from all eras dabbled in other instro stuff to some extent. The limits of the genre aren't that cut and dry.
OTH, if most of your material is Shadows / Ventures /Freddie King / country based and then some surf, it might be more honest to define yourselves "old school instro stuff", or something. ('Surf' is catchier, yes).
So, depends on the percentage I guess. It will help you as a band and for future promotions to decide what you are, but then again, who cares.

Yeah I don't really, I was just curious. About 60% of our stuff is Surf style with quite a few obscure tunes in the mix. Where I am there a no real Surf bands or instrumental bands apart from this other guys band and they mix a punk feel in with it. We are pretty authentic sounding to the original sounds. I was just interested to see what others thought. We really promote ourselves as an instrumental band that cover Surf and other stuff fraturing both guitars and sax.
But we got together out of the love to learn early surf stuff...but we had all played blues and non-surf instrumental stuff...I do alot of rock and jazz and know people in each of those style can get very worked up sbout different styles etc and that everything has to be a certain way in sound and instruments to be pure. This other band have all the gear and look but are definitely more hard rock/punk influenced in feel. I mentioned that off handly after his comment and he didn't like that...

Last edited: Nov 21, 2019 18:45:00

I was thinking about this story, and I wondered if this Real Surf fellow is on this site? After all it’s hands down the best place to get the skinny on Real Surf. (By the way, I feel certain I would get along well with this person haha!)

Daniel Deathtide

DeathTide wrote:

I was thinking about this story, and I wondered if this Real Surf fellow is on this site? After all it’s hands down the best place to get the skinny on Real Surf. (By the way, I feel certain I would get along well with this person haha!)

Actually I am not sure...funy if he saw this...lol...but we get along and their band are nice guys...just that comment was weird..

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