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SurfGuitar101 Forums » Gear »

Permalink Ventris Dual Reverb/True Spring Reverb pedal

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Did you use a chorus on #A?

The Hicadoolas

Last edited: Feb 27, 2018 20:16:36

I’m betting that #1 is the Fender unit.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.
My Guitar WebSite
Dead Thread

SanchoPansen wrote:

Did you use a chorus on #A?

no extra effects used, just guitar > Pedal > 6g15 > amps

http://dinosaurghost.bandcamp.com/
http://sixtycyclehum.podbean.com

A is the Fender

Paul
Atomic Mosquitos
Bug music for bug people is here!
Killers from Space

A sounds like butt. It's stupid delays sounds awful because they aren't in time with your playing.

Some one above asked if A had chorus. That is hilarious. To me it is more of a harmonic abberation.

1 is the Fender unit. It sounds alright, and amazing compared to the Ventris.

Thanks for clarifying, Ryan. I thought that A had an additional effect on top, like e.g. chorus, flanger, phaser. But it's simply the out of sync trails, generating a wobbling sound.
So A has to be the Ventris and both examples don't sound nowhere close. I might add that I am also not too convinced of the sound of sample 1 (geez, next time please use A and B or 1 and 2 Wink )
This might be due to an unmodified RI tank or the guitar used for recording or the recording method itself.

The Hicadoolas

JakeDobner wrote:

A sounds like butt.

it is more of a harmonic abberation.

Best reverb pedal review I’ve read in a long time. Thanks Jake!

A bit harsh, both, this is not bad for this specific test IMHO, it's revealing. A more classical sound through Brownfaces and vintage mics might have MASKED differences even more.
A=VENTRIS

It sounds way better than the previous gen popular pedals, i.e. Topanga and FRV1. It's a better platform to build on.

Either way goes without saying, as a double Surfy-Bear operator, I will never buy a digital reverb.
It's amusing to me, that in this day and age, the wonderful amazing nature of SPRINGS, is still baffling our best scientists!

Last edited: Feb 28, 2018 07:54:22

Ariel wrote:

A bit harsh, both, this is not bad for this specific test IMHO, it's revealing. A more classical sound through Brownfaces and vintage mics might have MASKED differences even more.
A=VENTRIS

It sounds way better than the previous gen popular pedals, i.e. Topanga and FRV1. It's a better platform to build on.

Either way goes without saying, as a double Surfy-Bear operator, I will never buy a digital reverb.
It's amusing to me, that in this day and age, the wonderful amazing nature of SPRINGS, is still baffling our best scientists!

Your last sentence says a lot. Springs behave randomly, chaotically and as brilliant as computers are, they do not lend themselves to randomness and chaos as easily as they do to orderliness. That having been said, I think that the Ventris is quite good, but I find my Topanga adequate.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.
My Guitar WebSite
Dead Thread

It is an unmodified RI tank.
SanchoPansen wrote:

Thanks for clarifying, Ryan. I thought that A had an additional effect on top, like e.g. chorus, flanger, phaser. But it's simply the out of sync trails, generating a wobbling sound.
So A has to be the Ventris and both examples don't sound nowhere close. I might add that I am also not too convinced of the sound of sample 1 (geez, next time please use A and B or 1 and 2 Wink )
This might be due to an unmodified RI tank or the guitar used for recording or the recording method itself.

http://dinosaurghost.bandcamp.com/
http://sixtycyclehum.podbean.com

SanchoPansen wrote:

It doesn't matter if the audience won't notice any difference. It is about us surf guitar enthusiasts trying to get 'that sound' and feeling while playing.

That's why I also said buy what YOU like. If you like it & think it has "that sound", then you will be confident in your sound, which conveys to the audience. I'm not debating reverb tanks & pedals, I'm pointing out that "that sound" is subjective & varies with each person. If a pedal works for you, great! If it just has to be a tank (I share this opinion with many others), that's great too! No wrong answers here.

Otto & The Ottomans
Kennedy Custom Guitars

Bob_Kennedy wrote:

SanchoPansen wrote:

It doesn't matter if the audience won't notice any difference. It is about us surf guitar enthusiasts trying to get 'that sound' and feeling while playing.

That's why I also said buy what YOU like. If you like it & think it has "that sound", then you will be confident in your sound, which conveys to the audience. I'm not debating reverb tanks & pedals, I'm pointing out that "that sound" is subjective & varies with each person. If a pedal works for you, great! If it just has to be a tank (I share this opinion with many others), that's great too! No wrong answers here.

I can get behind these thoughts. If I only played my Deluxe or my Twin, I'd probably not have even on pedal and I doubt that I'd bother with my tank. I get a sound that I love from either of these amps, right out of the box. Is it the sound of a vintage tank through a Showman? NO! However, it is a very good sound and I'm pleased with it.

Much of the time, I use a Winfield Cyclone or a Winfield Typhoon, both amps using a preamp circuit with an EF-86 pentode and having a much different response curve than the 12AX7 front ends found in most tube amps. I happen to like that sound and am very pleased with it for Surf. Because neither of these amps have any effects whatsoever I have to use something external and have used an FRV-1, a Topanga and occasionally some other effects as well, although I do not use overdrive pedals as a rule.

But I don't claim to be the keeper of any sacred fire. I appreciate vintage Surf and was around to hear it in the early sixties. Much of my playing, Surf or otherwise, is informed by the music of the early '60s and that's as I want it. I play Surf, I play Roger Miller, I play Johnny Rivers, I play Buck Owens; all sounds that I heard in my grade-school days.

If I was doing a bespoke Surf gig, I probably would bring my tank and the Twin I have converted to a piggyback. It's an awesome sounding rig, albeit one that requires that I drive my pickup to a gig and not my Miata.

The artist formerly known as: Synchro

When Surf Guitar is outlawed only outlaws will play Surf Guitar.
My Guitar WebSite
Dead Thread

Big_Ryan wrote:

The surfy bear is a well established great option, but can you fit it on a pedalboard?

skeeter wrote:

Or, you could also take your $400 and spend it one something like this.

https://www.surfyindustries.com/surfybear

I was in the midst of rewiring my pedal board to accommodate the Surfybear pedal (even custom ordered another pedal with top jacks to make everything fit), but then I got a Ventris... Now I have extra space on my board. Will probably still keep the Surfybear for recording, etc., especially since the brown tolex so nicely matches my amp...

Last edited: Feb 28, 2018 11:57:45

I seem to be in the minority here, but I'm sticking with my guess that #A is the Fender.
I'm going off the tone suck on #1 (especially on the low strings) from Ryan's initial sample of the Ventris. Also the trails on #1 sound digital to me.
Plus #A sounds a bit louder than #1 from the slight Fender boost.

That's my story and I'm sticking with it. Unless I'm wrong, then I'll deny everything. Smile

Paul
Atomic Mosquitos
Bug music for bug people is here!
Killers from Space

Bob_Kennedy wrote:

SanchoPansen wrote:

It doesn't matter if the audience won't notice any difference. It is about us surf guitar enthusiasts trying to get 'that sound' and feeling while playing.

That's why I also said buy what YOU like. If you like it & think it has "that sound", then you will be confident in your sound, which conveys to the audience. I'm not debating reverb tanks & pedals, I'm pointing out that "that sound" is subjective & varies with each person. If a pedal works for you, great! If it just has to be a tank (I share this opinion with many others), that's great too! No wrong answers here.

Agreed. Just wanted to point out that the usual statement 'it doesn't matter because the audience won't notice' is not correct. It does matter - to the musician. That's the most important part.

The Hicadoolas

synchro wrote:

Ariel wrote:

It's amusing to me, that in this day and age, the wonderful amazing nature of SPRINGS, is still baffling our best scientists!

Your last sentence says a lot. Springs behave randomly, chaotically and as brilliant as computers are, they do not lend themselves to randomness and chaos as easily as they do to orderliness.

I know what you mean, and from an emotional point I stand with you! I threw the term randomness (*R) earlier, so I want to expand on it.
Computers do R pretty great. Better than humans, and find me one true random occurrence in nature. Things like digital currency or encryption were never possible before.
A pocket calculator from the 1980's could generate enough R numbers to accommodate a spring reverb algorithm. Oftentimes R math is just a quicker and low-computetional-cost way to emulate a natural phenomena, but it's never correct in that application. Is a way to falsely represent a lot of detail. Fractal math should do better in this realm, while R is kept only for the fuzziest of details, and dithering.
Spring reverb is only semi-random, if at all (That's coming to a question about nature itself - I believe nothing is truly R and that nature is not chaotic! Chaos math is another approximating theory, not reality). The Tank, is an intensely reactive device, not unlike an explosive. You have those suspended tiny magnets, that move so little but affect so much.
So the rest of it would be very very complex sets of interaction between input tone and feedback, that to emulate correctly would require research that expands way beyond any that these companies have yet to do.

Every emulation is a approximation, any mathematical representation will miss something, be 'compressed' to a degree. The right way, is to compress the most unnecessary info. It's the fact that 'they' don't implement it right - never deep enough, not in the right points of the signal path. Usually ignoring note pitch, attack and velocity. Never ever wild enough, polite and safe as programmers tend to, keeping numbers from going too crazy and messing up the works.

Still literally, any modern game's physical nature modeling is infinitely more complex than what's needed here. Maybe Rockstar should get into pedals.

Last edited: Mar 01, 2018 14:03:32

If it sounds right, it is right.

A was the Ventris
1 was the Fender

http://dinosaurghost.bandcamp.com/
http://sixtycyclehum.podbean.com

image

Hahahahahahahah!

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