abdul_tom
Joined: Dec 04, 2006
Posts: 251
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Posted on Jan 23 2017 05:02 PM
Can someone recommend anything? I like to play with a bit of hair on the tone but still basically within the zone. I play through large JBLs. I would really rather not use a pedal full of plastic to get that hair.
The FX loop is a must.
I have tried the Twin Reverb II, but the clean channel is utterly clean and the dirt channel is horrible and too distorted.
I have tried Mesa Boogie, but same deal.
I am really looking for a just slightly dirty sound.
Obviously there's stuff like the red knob Twins, but I imagined it was going to be the same deal with the two channels. Is that right?
What about Rivera? Do they do good reverb? do they sound Fendery?
A Twin Reverb sound is basically what I like, but not clean as a whistle. Any help appreciated.
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Chippertheripper
Joined: Mar 11, 2011
Posts: 819
Semass
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Posted on Jan 23 2017 06:08 PM
Supersonic?
All the other stuff is normally recommend lacks an effects loop.
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Chippertheripper
Joined: Mar 11, 2011
Posts: 819
Semass
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Posted on Jan 23 2017 06:11 PM
Peavey classic 30. Final answer.
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abdul_tom
Joined: Dec 04, 2006
Posts: 251
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Posted on Jan 23 2017 06:24 PM
i thought the supersonics were bassy and woolly. is that not correct?
will check the PV despite the low power
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stratdancer
Joined: Dec 11, 2013
Posts: 2532
Akron, Ohio
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Posted on Jan 23 2017 07:26 PM
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Chippertheripper
Joined: Mar 11, 2011
Posts: 819
Semass
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Posted on Jan 23 2017 08:49 PM
The low power is how you get the dirts.
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JakeDobner
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 12159
Seattle
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Posted on Jan 23 2017 09:12 PM
abdul_tom wrote:
I would really rather not use a pedal full of plastic to get that hair.
Decent pedals generally have less plastic than amps do. Transparent overdrives are what you are looking for. Klon KTR, JHS Morning Glory, Foxpedals Kingdom, Emerson Em-Drive, EHX Soul Food, etc...
What about Rivera? Do they do good reverb? do they sound Fendery?
Had to play one for a gig once. Reverb was abominable, had to use the onboard. They don't sound like a Fender, clean being very sterile.
I'm curious as to why the effect loop is a must? That is a severely limiting 'must'. We are in the middle of an amazing time for 'new' tube amps. Fender is killing it with the new 'Silverface' reissues, Supro is putting out awesome stuff, Vox HWs are amazing. Then there are the 'boutique' stuff like Morgan, Benson, Satellite. What I'm trying to say, amps with the tone you are looking for rarely come with effects loops. Amps with effects loops are generally meant for high-gain. The mid-grade Vox amps have an effects loop, so you might want to check out the new AC30 CC2
The benefit of an effects loop is so the pedals in the loop are placed after an amps on-board gain/distortion. But if you don't like gain...
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jdmcduders
Joined: Jan 14, 2013
Posts: 137
Indianapolis, IN
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Posted on Jan 23 2017 09:38 PM
Budda Superdrive 18. It's got an effects loop and master volume so you can set it clean or get some grind on the clean channel. It also is the loudest 18W I've ever heard. I've payed in bands with guys with Peavey Classic 30s and I never have to turn above 9 of clock. It also has a bright switch (pull pot)
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duncanjames
Joined: Dec 20, 2011
Posts: 150
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Posted on Jan 23 2017 09:42 PM
I also feel you'd be better off with a good dirt pedal and a non-channel switching amp. I spent so much time trying to find what you're looking for, and always came back to a clean/cleanish old Fender type amp with any effects loop pedals between the dirt and the front of the amp. This also gives you more of a usable volume range, instead of always playing at the one volume where your amp's sounding how you'd want.
The AC30 CC2 Jake mentioned is the only amp I've found roughly fitting the bill with an effects loop. The reverb probably isn't what you're looking for if you need it onboard, but the master volume works pretty well to some extent.
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JObeast
Joined: Jul 24, 2012
Posts: 2762
Finknabad, Squinkistan
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Posted on Jan 24 2017 03:26 AM
I see the OP lives in Great Britain, where the availability of gear is different than it is in the States. Why is an effects loop de rigeur? For surf, less is more. My suggestion is just get a good loud native British amp like a Vox AC 15 or 30 that can run into overdrive and feed it with some good reverb like a Surfy Bear's. Keep it simple. A dinky pedal board with a couple gain pedals might add to the fun, but an A/B switch to allow a direct link between a reverb unit and guitar piclups may be preferable.
— Squink Out!
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abdul_tom
Joined: Dec 04, 2006
Posts: 251
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Posted on Jan 24 2017 05:44 AM
Guys, thanks for the inputs. To answer the questions and comments"
Chippertheripper wrote:
The low power is how you get the dirts.
but lose the low end. You need a fat output transformer to get a decent frequency range
JObeast wrote:
I see the OP lives in Great Britain, where the availability of gear is different than it is in the States. Why is an effects loop de rigeur? For surf, less is more. My suggestion is just get a good loud native British amp like a Vox AC 15 or 30 that can run into overdrive and feed it with some good reverb like a Surfy Bear's. Keep it simple. A dinky pedal board with a couple gain pedals might add to the fun, but an A/B switch to allow a direct link between a reverb unit and guitar piclups may be preferable.
Indeed, old British amps are my speciality. I'm currently using a late 60s Laney 100W PA head that I modded and which actually has a buffered FX loop as standard (they were not uncommon on PA amps), but no verb. I cascaded three of the channels to give me some different preamp overdrive options and I put a Magnatone style tube reverb circuit and long two spring pan but it ain't quite doing the do. I could try and put in a Fender transformer based reverb.
In terms of the FX loop, it's because I have a Jim Thomas style complicated routing with stuff going through a mixer and out in all directions before coming back into the power amp.
Jim uses red knob Showmen but avoids the overdrive on them and I think uses an outboard tank. If i can cutback the size of my rig that would be nice.
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Chippertheripper
Joined: Mar 11, 2011
Posts: 819
Semass
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Posted on Jan 24 2017 08:25 AM
You clearly have way more specific needs than any of us originally thought.
Low end can have a powerful presence with cab, speaker, eq adjustment, and a zillion other ways, but if you're set on something I'll not attempt to change your mind.
I'm intrigued to see what you end up with, for sure.
Last edited: Jan 24, 2017 08:25:35
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GatoStrato
Joined: Jul 20, 2016
Posts: 39
Sjobergastan,a small nation state hidden in the mountains of Taos Co. NM.
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Posted on Jan 24 2017 12:06 PM
Hay Abdul Tom, my rig is also inspired partly by Jim Tomas. (I'm sure you all ready know this stuff,but here I go)... I feel that to create a sound that has a big fat frequency range I need a higher power amp with a large output tranny and tubes, even at "lower" volumes. Lower power amps tend to compress to soon. To to get some, or a lot of dirt, and still keep some sparkle, I run into a tube overdrive into a volume pedal into the front end of a big clean tube amp(s). I'm not even so sure the amp's manufacturer maters to me any more,(all though I prefer 6L6 tubes for surf). I use an 80's B.K.Butler Tube Driver, J.T. uses a later Tube Works Real Tube II. From the preamp out into my mixing board into my Lexicon MPX 100 and other stuff (J.T. runs 3 Lexicon LPX units and other stuff) back to the mixer,out to poweamp in.... J.T. said he couldn't get his sound with the reverb in the front end, but I've gotten great sound with a EH Holy Grail up front.
All that being said, I'd love to check out the Quilter gear. Lugging these big amps around does get old.
Good luck and happy hunting!
— Salud!
Mark
Last edited: Jan 24, 2017 16:09:28
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Las_Barracudas
Joined: Apr 24, 2011
Posts: 1087
Surf City, NC
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Posted on Jan 24 2017 02:34 PM
The Peavey Delta Blues might fit the bill. They're capable of a nice clean sound and have an FX loop.
— METEOR IV on reverbnation
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abdul_tom
Joined: Dec 04, 2006
Posts: 251
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Posted on Jan 24 2017 03:05 PM
it's not just your feeling that you need a big amp to get more low end, it's fact. why do you think bass amps run at 200W and up? The output transformer is literally not capable of outputting low frequencies below a certain level on smaller amps. Using a powered sub is another approach and I have actually got one of those.
I agree with Jim and tend to prefer the verb at the mixer stage so i can EQ it on its own channel etc. I also run a mic into the mixer all of which outputs through the guitar amp.
I had a very nice outboard spring reverb, just a crappy 70s british thing, which i sold for £60 in desperate times and the now the guy won't sell me back.
I remember asking about Quilters before. I eschewed them because they are tranny. Are they responsive to picking like tubes? I like having it on the edge so you get hair if you dig in and I have never achieved that with tranny so far.
Btw, Jake, thanks for letting me know about the Supro reissues. Didn't know about those.
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Agent71857
Joined: Apr 15, 2014
Posts: 164
Pittsburgh, Pa
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Posted on Jan 25 2017 01:04 AM
I never hear about people in the Surf community using them... but I'm a big believer in tech21/sansamp stuff. I've used their trademark 60 for years! Every gig. Never fails. I run it w/ an xotic ac+ in front. A tc electronics hall of fame & voodoo labs tremolo in the fx loop. It's light, compact & loud as hell!!! I go for a little more dirt than most folks, but it sounds amazing clean too. Here's an example from one of our gigs... the thunder effects are real!!!
— www.instagram.com/_the.outer.limits_
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCX7iIpcAvL8In2HY9I7QoPw
www.theouterlimits.bandcamp.com
www.facebook.com/vertigogo.surf
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GatoStrato
Joined: Jul 20, 2016
Posts: 39
Sjobergastan,a small nation state hidden in the mountains of Taos Co. NM.
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Posted on Jan 25 2017 09:48 AM
Most excellent video Agent71857! Thanks for sharing.Great tone,very cool tune. Living prof that tone is in the hands of the believer.....
— Salud!
Mark
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Agent71857
Joined: Apr 15, 2014
Posts: 164
Pittsburgh, Pa
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Posted on Jan 25 2017 09:55 AM
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abdul_tom
Joined: Dec 04, 2006
Posts: 251
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Posted on Feb 03 2017 12:36 PM
Thanks for the suggestions.
I just hooked a Kustom Coupé 36 for very low money. I'll stick a JBL in it and if I like it then I'll hold out for the 72.
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JObeast
Joined: Jul 24, 2012
Posts: 2762
Finknabad, Squinkistan
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Posted on Feb 04 2017 02:44 AM
Agent71857 wrote:
I never hear about people in the Surf community using them... but I'm a big believer in tech21/sansamp stuff. I've used their trademark 60 for years! Every gig. Never fails. I run it w/ an xotic ac+ in front. A tc electronics hall of fame & voodoo labs tremolo in the fx loop. It's light, compact & loud as hell!!! I go for a little more dirt than most folks, but it sounds amazing clean too. Here's an example from one of our gigs... the thunder effects are real!!!
Badass tones there Agent. Reminds me of Gilmour's WEM amp sound on Money - gritty angry yet expansive.
— Squink Out!
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