JohnnyMosrite
Joined: Jun 14, 2006
Posts: 858
New York City area
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Posted on Oct 04 2006 01:09 PM
All... I've been away a bit.. quite a forum.. So my 2 cents:
MOSRITES THRU A DUAL SHOWMAN RULE! Use a Roland Space echo or the tank. You get a slightly edgier sound that you'll never get from any stock Fender - even the venerable Strat. The only leg up a Strat has over a Mosrite is the neck.. you can put those heavy-ass strings on it - whoopee! I've gone through a sucession of LesPauls (too blasted heavy) and Strats (with that pesky-in-my-way middle pickup. Jags and Jazzers sound OK - BUT ONLY IF BOTH PICKUPS ARE ON.
Unlunf.. don't feel too bad about that '63 Mosrite.. many of them were handmade and ROUGH. I love Mosrites but I'm not cranking $12,000+ for any axe. (But I'll let you buy one from me for that amount if you want)
Of note:
I supplied the funds to someone that just HAD TO HAVE one (a '63 Mosrite) a few years back. He had constructed (with Bill Gruggett) a replica (with over the hill acccuracy and detail) '63 which I bought so he could get the "real deal". Well, the replica wasted the original - but what do I know?
there are those among us with small hands.. a desire to pick the note and move quickly to the next one with out going over 'speed bumps' that are the frets of most Fenders. And you really can't use a Mosrite for blues.. that's just absolutely GREAT!
To each his own.. but the high action big string surf 'mistique' just never made sense to me and didn't work with my style of playing. MHO.
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Surfabilly
Joined: Apr 21, 2006
Posts: 852
Connersville, Indiana, USA
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Posted on Oct 04 2006 08:58 PM
I'm in the process of "building" my own surf guitars. I've got my Epiphone Les Paul Jr. 90 that I'll be upgrading with Gibson components, and I've decided that I'll put a tremelo on it...more likely a Bigsby. Somewhere along the line, I'll either get an Epiphone Les Paul Standard or Epiphone SG 400, and do a surf guitar conversion, as I'm upgrading...part of the upgrading being to swap Gibson P94s (a humbucker sized P90) in place of the humbuckers. Or, I may very well get a Squier Tele Custom II, add a Bigsby, and replace its P90s with Gibson P90s, along with Fender hardware upgrades.
As I've said before, I'm not afraid to dare to be different, when it comes to my choice of surf guitar. Aside from the above mentioned surf mods to non-surf guitars, however, there will eventually be a Fender Standard Stratocaster added to my arsenal, and I'll also upgrade it with better parts, the same as I'm doing/planning to do with my other cheaper guitars. Even if I could afford to just go out and buy the guitars I'd really want...more expensive than Standard...I probably couldn't leave well enough alone, and upgrade those, as well. In my own reality, I've realized that buying cheaper, then upgrading with better stuff, can give me what I want, and still end up cheaper than had I bought...say...a Fender American Stratocaster.
Matt
— Fast Cars & Loud Guitars!
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Jon
Joined: Mar 15, 2006
Posts: 1076
Columbus, OH
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Posted on Oct 05 2006 10:45 AM
I voted for the Strat. I haven't played any of the others yet.
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casey
Joined: May 18, 2006
Posts: 520
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Posted on Oct 08 2006 04:19 PM
I know this is supposed to be a pick of your favorite SURF guitar, but how many bands play all surf all the time? Our band does some surf but also what I like to think of as surf-style instrumentals ala the Ventures or the Shadows. Its nice to keep it simple and gig with just one guitar, and for me its hard to beat the versatility of the strat. Mine also seems to have a lot of sustain, more than the JM's or Jag's I've seen. That said, I'm looking to pickup a nice Jazzmaster or Jaguar, maybe that will change my mind. Casey
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JakeDobner
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 12159
Seattle
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Posted on Oct 08 2006 05:02 PM
This thread sickens me. I'm such a trad nazi, yet I more eclectic tastes in music than most people here. I think I'm mainly into the look of trad bands and I don't take bands that skew very far from the trad image very seriously, although there are exceptions.
So, 61-67 fender amps, although Silverfaces get a great sound, Jaguars, Mosrites, and Jazzmasters. And get this no p-basses, Jazz bass only. I am lenient on the cab used for bass since using a modern bass cab sounds much better than going through a vintage fender cab.
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WoodyJ
Joined: Apr 05, 2006
Posts: 1534
Bethlehem, GA
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Posted on Oct 08 2006 08:44 PM
You can still look trad and sound modern with a bass rig...how about a late '90's Fender Rumble Bass 300W tube head, through an old Peavey center slot 2x15 cab turned 90 degrees and recovered in blonde Tolex, with EV 15BX 400W speakers?
— Jack
aka WoodyJ
The Mariners (1964-68, 1996-2005)
The Hula Hounds (1996-current)
The X-Rays (1997-2004)
The Surge! (2004, 2011-2012)
Various non-surf bands that actually made money (1978-1990)
Last edited: Apr 28, 2012 21:42:34
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MPoppitt
Joined: Apr 23, 2006
Posts: 133
Austin TEXAS!
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Posted on Oct 09 2006 07:41 PM
I put Fender grillcloth on one of my old Peavey 2x15s, and it looked great.
— 
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JohnnyMosrite
Joined: Jun 14, 2006
Posts: 858
New York City area
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Posted on Oct 11 2006 10:22 AM
JakeDOBNER..
" I'm such a trad nazi, yet I (have??) more eclectic tastes in music than most people here." REALLY??
You sound a bit CONFLICTED. And no P bass - jazz basss only??!!.. that's a strange form of "eclecticism".
I've ripped out Django Rheinhardt stuff on a Mosrite with a guy on P bass and Mosrite bass. (working on a surf version of NUAGES - I have time on my hands) Can your 'trad nazi eclectism' (whatever that is) deal with that??
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eddiewagner
Joined: Aug 12, 2006
Posts: 77
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Posted on Oct 23 2006 05:17 AM
its kinda unpopular imagewise. the last rehearsals i used a stock 52 ri tele and it sounded bombastic in the surf/spy context. until my stat is repaired i will use it with pleasure. its very uncomplicated to play a tele, very little options to confuse you. and the damm thing never breaks a string! i can play misirlou all day long on my tele and nothing happens. before i had stringsaver saddles on my strat the strings broke all the time.
— www.myspace.com/captaintwangandhisrhythmcat
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WaimeaBay
Joined: Jul 05, 2006
Posts: 966
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Posted on Oct 23 2006 08:38 AM
I am only anti-mosrite because of their price  They play fantsatic and sound great.
I am really shocked however, that this did not come down to the JM and Jag. I am assuming most people who voted otherwise (NOT ALL) have not played an American Jag or JM. I say they this because there is no other explanation for everyone not picking a Jag or JM as the best surf guitar! 
I wonder if les paul was included if people would have casted their vote for it. 
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WR
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 3832
netherlands
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Posted on Oct 23 2006 08:52 AM
WaimeaBay
I am really shocked however, that this did not come down to the JM and Jag. I am assuming most people who voted otherwise (NOT ALL) have not played an American Jag or JM. I say they this because there is no other explanation for everyone not picking a Jag or JM as the best surf guitar!
I can think of at least three good explanations:
Dick Dale
Jim Messina
IvanP
(it's true though that a poll that goes "what's you're vavorite .... " is mostly answered as if it read "what do you own ? " )
WR
— Rules to live by #314:
"When in Italy, if the menu says something's grilled, don't assume it is."
https://www.facebook.com/The-Malbehavers-286429584796173/
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IvanP
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 10321
southern Michigan
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Posted on Oct 24 2006 08:43 AM
WR
WaimeaBay
I am really shocked however, that this did not come down to the JM and Jag. I am assuming most people who voted otherwise (NOT ALL) have not played an American Jag or JM. I say they this because there is no other explanation for everyone not picking a Jag or JM as the best surf guitar!
I can think of at least three good explanations:
Dick Dale
Jim Messina
IvanP
Hey Wannes, thanks! But I can provide many more explanations:
Jim Skiathitis & Theo Penglis (both lead guitar, the Atlantics)
Skip Mercier & Willy Glover (lead & rhythm, the Pyramids)
Bob Spickard & Brian Carmen (lead & rhtyhm, the Chantays)
Jim Fuller (lead guitar, the Surfaris)
Paul Johnson (rhythm guitar, the Belairs)
Eddie Bertrand (during the Belairs era, maybe some during E&tS)
Al Nichol (lead guitar, the Crossfires)
Bobby Fuller (lead guitar, Bobby Fuller & the Fanatics, the BF Four)
Larry Weed (lead guitar, the Original Surfaris - he's also seen with a JM)
the list can go on to many more obscure first-wave surf guitarists
(Of the newer guys, both Wronski and Shigeo have used Strats extensively, especially for recording - I think the entire first Slacktone album is recorded with a Strat, and a lot of early Surf Coasters stuff was done with a Strat. And let's not forget John Blair who switched to Strats pretty much exclusively in the nineties. Rip Thrillby also, I'm sure there are more.)
The Strat was definitely the most popular guitar for surf in the first wave. A lot of people these days seem to react against it, maybe because it's become so identified with blooze and hard rock, so it looks a lot better to have a Jag or a Jazzmaster to differentiate yourself from that.
Personally, I've played American JMs and Jags, and they're wonderful guitars. I have a '95 Jap Limited Edition Jazzmaster (w/ swapped pickups) that IMO is as good as the American-made offsets. But the Strat is a much more versatile guitar, even just for surf music. It can get all sweet and sensitive much better than the offsets (e.g. Hank Marvin), and much more aggressive than the offsets, either in a bass-heavy thundering way (e.g. Dick Dale) or in a screaming midrangey way (e.g. the Atlantics). No way the offsets can replicate any of those three sounds - which all happen to be my favorite. The only thing the offsets do better than a Strat is the Astronauts-type low-string reverb chunk - and not much, as evidenced by the Chantays. Even Astronauts-type lead can be done as well on a Strat - just check out the Pyramids or Bobby Fuller.
Having said all this, I don't think just any Strat will give you a good surf sound (I think the US-made '62 reissue is the ultimate surf Strat), and there being SO many different kinds of Strats, it's easy to get it wrong. That's not the case for the offsets - whatever model you choose will sound great for surf. Also, I think a Strat is more difficult to play and get to sound right than the offsets - a Strat always requires a bit more work. Gotta have the action higher than the offsets, can't really use flatwounds successfully, the longer scale and the bridge give you more tension, etc. But I think it's worth it!
Ivan
PS WaimeaBay - combined the JM and Jag score is much higher than the Strat - so you can take solace in that!
— Ivan
Lords of Atlantis on Facebook
The Madeira Official Website
The Madeira on Facebook
The Blair-Pongracic Band on Facebook
The Space Cossacks on Facebook
The Madeira Channel on YouTube
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JakeDobner
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 12159
Seattle
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Posted on Oct 24 2006 10:10 AM
JohnnyMosrite
JakeDOBNER..
" I'm such a trad nazi, yet I (have??) more eclectic tastes in music than most people here." REALLY??
You sound a bit CONFLICTED. And no P bass - jazz basss only??!!.. that's a strange form of "eclecticism".
I've ripped out Django Rheinhardt stuff on a Mosrite with a guy on P bass and Mosrite bass. (working on a surf version of NUAGES - I have time on my hands) Can your 'trad nazi eclectism' (whatever that is) deal with that??
Oh dear lordy! Django through a Mosrite. How dare you sully the surf name... Sarcasm. You way over reacted to my post.
As to your "REALLY??" after the first sentence. Yes, I have a more eclectic taste in music than most people here. Notice how the keyword is 'most'. You seem to take offense to my saying that. Truth is most people here are closed off to a lot of music.
I'm not really conflicted. I stated rather clearly the reasons I assume I am a trad nazi. And I'm a trad nazi when it comes to aesthetics. When you say "And no P bass - jazz basss only??!!.. that's a strange form of "eclecticism". I highly suggest you reread what I type. You took my quote out of context, probably on purpose. I did not say my taste in gear were eclectic. I said my taste in music was more electic than most people's taste on this board.
You also really seemed to not like my use of the word 'eclectic'. Do you know what that word means? So please, lets have a civil discourse next time. Instead of jumping down my throat how about you take some time, lay off the caps, make sure you exclamation and question marks are one to a sentence, and think about what you are typing.
Last edited: Oct 24, 2006 10:11:49
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WR
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 3832
netherlands
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Posted on Oct 24 2006 10:11 AM
Ivan,  for that post!
I thought of Belairs period Eddie Bertrand, but I prefer his sound on the jag just way over his early Belairs sound.  for leaving out the Atlantcs, that's actually one of my fave guitar sounds.
That's not the case for the offsets - whatever model you choose will sound great for surf.
well, that used to be the case when you had the mindblowing wide choice between an AV, a jap, or a vintage one. but since Fender is making bucker equiped jags, jagmasters and what have you, not so any more.
eitherway, I agree with you, with all the knobs and pots and thingies, a jag is pretty much a one trick pony as opposed to the strat, the most versatile guitar ever made.
WR
— Rules to live by #314:
"When in Italy, if the menu says something's grilled, don't assume it is."
https://www.facebook.com/The-Malbehavers-286429584796173/
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Surfabilly
Joined: Apr 21, 2006
Posts: 852
Connersville, Indiana, USA
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Posted on Oct 24 2006 08:40 PM
I should've voted for the Stratocaster, but little did I realize, when I voted and initially replied, that I'd be planning to add TWO Strats to my growing collection. I'll still go for the Strat HH, first, then start the "save my duckies cycle" again, toward the Stratocaster. Even if I initially buy MIM Standards, I'll be upgrading the hardware to Fender American Strat parts, so in the end I won't be doing too bad...still a bit away from the cost of American models.
In the near future, my original surf guitar sound will be "built" with my Epiphone Les Paul Jr. 90 (leads only, with just a P90 at the bridge), converted Fender Strat HH, Fender Stratocaster, Fender Precision Bass. My hot rod guitar sound is pretty much in place, with my Fender So Cal Speed Shop Strat, and I can always do some rhythm guitar behind it, with my Ibanez Jet King (so long as I check to be sure the coil tap switches are in the proper positions for full humbuckers). My Fender Standard Telecaster might come into play, in either case, but it'll ultimately come down to which guitar in my collection is best suited to the soundscape I'm looking to create.
Matt
— Fast Cars & Loud Guitars!
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JohnnyMosrite
Joined: Jun 14, 2006
Posts: 858
New York City area
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Posted on Oct 25 2006 09:18 AM
JakeDobner
Wow.. all that and now you show that you're also anal (retentive) ... Sheesh!! What a joy you must be to play with! I recently played the django/surf stuff at a party.. it went over very well. Glad you weren't there. Do you have a girlfriend or otherwise to mellow you out??
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WR
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 3832
netherlands
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Posted on Oct 25 2006 09:32 AM
guys, keep it civil and on-topic please!?
Jake, Im with you on the visual part (even if I dont have the money to adhere to it myself  ) it surprises me though that you're lenient on the bass cab - to me that would seem to ruin the whole thing. why not just have a fender cab and put a modern speaker in it if they sound better? btw, I happen to think that the crappy sounding bass is large part of the appeal of 1st wave surf recordings, dito with the drums.
also, why not strat in your guitar list? I'd think that a strat (one with vintage looking appeal at least) would be just as trad. as a jag or a JM.
WR
— Rules to live by #314:
"When in Italy, if the menu says something's grilled, don't assume it is."
https://www.facebook.com/The-Malbehavers-286429584796173/
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dp
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 3545
mojave desert, california
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Posted on Oct 25 2006 02:55 PM
WR
...btw, I happen to think that the crappy sounding bass is large part of the appeal of 1st wave surf recordings, dito with the drums....
WR:
funny that you mention this...I whole-heartedly concur!
the lo-fi drum and bass tones of the early 1st wave recordings are actually quite unique sounding...some sort of weird two-headed rhythm monster playing in the far end of a sewer pipe...
real rumble-y!
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JakeDobner
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 12159
Seattle
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Posted on Oct 27 2006 08:54 PM
WR
guys, keep it civil and on-topic please!?
Jake, Im with you on the visual part (even if I dont have the money to adhere to it myself ) it surprises me though that you're lenient on the bass cab - to me that would seem to ruin the whole thing. why not just have a fender cab and put a modern speaker in it if they sound better? btw, I happen to think that the crappy sounding bass is large part of the appeal of 1st wave surf recordings, dito with the drums.
also, why not strat in your guitar list? I'd think that a strat (one with vintage looking appeal at least) would be just as trad. as a jag or a JM.
WR
I'm lenient on the bass cab because we just couldn't get the bass to cut through with a normal cab. Our bassist uses a '65 Bassman. It would be rad if he had a Fender cab custom built that was ported and such like his ampeg, but... Why no strat on my list? You've obviously never heard me play a strat. I sound very cheesy playing them. So it is hatred of the strat. Our lead guitar has a strat, he sounds great with it. I like his guitar.
And JohnnyMosrite, I shall remain to keep it civil. I offered up adequate responses to your original, albeit off base, accusations/comments. If you weren't happy with those then that is too bad. There is no need for vitriolic comments based on somebody's taste in surf guitars. I'm not trying to insult you with this but if you were maybe to read my post with more cognizance then maybe you wouldn't feel the need to fling around attempts at insults. I shall send you a PM with one last thought, that isn't that mean, but I'm sure you wouldn't want me sharing.
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JohnnyMosrite
Joined: Jun 14, 2006
Posts: 858
New York City area
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Posted on Oct 28 2006 08:03 AM
JakeDobner,
In a very civil attitude ---
Y-A-W-N !!!!!!!!
Hugs and kisses..
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