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SurfGuitar101 Forums » Gear »

Permalink Vox AC10c1

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It's an epidemic! Laughing

First a bit of back story. I wanted something more in a small package that my '65 Champ wasn't giving me, and one of those things was the smoothness that simply comes from a push-pull 2-tube power stage. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad I got to own that superb 50-yr old little guy. Checked that box, someone else's turn. I'd also owned a Blues Jr awhile back & really like an EL-84 output section. Not having much money in it to begin with I'd done some mods and actually got it "almost" Vox-y, but it wasn't there. I'd even stiffened the enclosure with a piece of aluminum bar stock routed into one side of the baffle. Part of some small amp's afflictions are simply where they tried to put 5 pounds in a 3 pound sack with the small MDF cabinet & a 12" speaker.

Really liking the sound of a Fender when combined with EL-84's I went looking to see what Vox's were at Dave's Guitar Shop. I got to A/B the AC15 Greenback vs. the Alnico Blue (congrats again Jake!) first and, to my ear, the Blues were the only way to go. However, truly, I didn't want another 50-pound amp; antithesis of my search. Then my amp tech showed me something they were stocking very recently, an AC10c1; having trouble even keeping them in stock. Half the weight, more power than an AC4, less than an AC15. Here are the primary differences:

  • 10" speaker vs. the 12" in the AC15
  • 10w vs. 15 in the AC15
  • SS rectifier vs. tube in the bigger amp; the AC10 is a 2x 12AX7 & 2x EL84/6BQ5 configuration.
  • Top-Boost circuit, but without the Tone Cut (aka 'Presence') control in the bigger amps. For those who haven't seen one, like Fender's old Presence control, it dials some highs back into the output stage (except on a Vox the knob works the opposite, CCW puts the highs in).
  • On the street, a bit over half the cost of the AC15 with the Alnico Blue. (NOT a consideration)
  • For the AC10, 2/3 the size and at 27 lbs. nearly half the weight of AC15. (DEFINITELY a consideration)

The on-board reverb is nothing close to a spring pan, but is simply a very well-done digital on-amp reverb that would lend some ambience if playing otherwise sterile. It works very well within its intent; I have a tank after all & use echo & analog delay as well.

Soundwise, I'd already had the chance in the shop to A/B it against the AC15 with the Blue and knew that I would not miss the Tone Cut piece of the circuit. There is the typical interactive and effective Vox tone stack and plenty of bass & highs for anything I want to do. It can get very loud. I typically run a little master-volume style amp wide open (or near there) in a traditional fashion and use whatever gain knob there is as the volume control - same thing with this amp and it yields a nice chimey (but not ice-picky) tone, very full-bodied. After a couple days my preferred MV is at 3/4 open which enables turning up the signal to the pre-amp enough to get its full characteristics.

Just for grins I did turn down the MV and put the gain up around 10:00 (in a home environment this means barely cracking the MV (did I mention it was loud?). Plenty of bass as well, no boxiness as is often complained of in small packages of this size. It's just a pretty full sound. In fact, played with the Vibrolux matching overall volume there is almost the sound of just a hardworking amp if you vary your attack to go after it. No twiddling the volume knob, just back off your pick's enthusiasm, or jump on it. Of course, if you keep cranking the gain your gonna get full-on pre-amp distortion which is something I don't care for & don't do.

It takes anything on my pedal board and also blends VERY nicely when run alongside my Vibrolux with some echo and/or trem. Even when the pre-amp is starting to growl, notes are articulate and full finishing chords don't lose their crystalline quality. A mini pedal board with an FRV-1, Demeter Tremulator and MXR's EP boost pedal and the whole thing is Mazda friendly.

Still honeymooning but I'm liking it alot and think it will serve my 2nd amp needs for some time. I note that my (former) example of an April 1965 Champ didn't pop back up on Dave's website... I'll have to take a walk upstairs to his personal collection and see if it got "shang-hai'd" and is now hanging out with all the Showmans, Bandmasters, Supers, Bassman's, Deluxes & Princetons, tanks & lap steels, and tone ring cabs. (and that's just the Fender stuff)

These amps are cathode-biased, so pop the back & swap the power tubes and drive on. Speaking of the back; there is an extension speaker jack and most of the back of the cabinet is closed. A hunch, not confirmed, is that the more solid back & choice of a 10" speaker addressed some of the rigidity issues that other companies can't seem to figure out (you listening Fender?). There is a nicely done heat vent on the TOP of the amp. Don't set your favorite shred-sweat towel on top of that vent. Other than that, it does seem after 2 full afternoons of playing to be running very nicely. If you regularly haul an AC30 along for any reason & want something more portable just for jamming/rehearsing this might be worth consideration.

Pic when the G-Spring arrives so I can pose 'em both.
Now back to Jake's thread, awaiting any Vox lessons-learned from Ivan.
Laughing

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

Dude! Awesome. Congrats. Photos!

You guys are bad influence. I don't need a new vox amp but........

The Kahuna Kings

https://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Kahuna-Kings/459752090818447

https://thekahunakings.bandcamp.com/releases

Last edited: Dec 01, 2015 13:30:11

I'm not going to believe that either of your amps exist until you use them to create a submission to the SG101 2015 Compilation!

Ha Ha!

Congrats guys - you are truly bad influences,
in the best sort of way

Cheers,
Jeff

http://www.facebook.com/CrazyAcesMusic
http://www.youtube.com/user/crazyacesrock
http://www.reverbnation.com/crazyacesmusic

Unlikely! But we are in the early stages of writing the next 'Verb record!

stratdancer wrote:

You guys are bad influence. I don't need a new vox amp but........

Twisted Evil

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

JakeDobner wrote:

Dude! Awesome. Congrats. Photos!

Thanks man - the G-Spring is on the truck enroute from California; will do a portrait then.

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

CrazyAces wrote:

I'm not going to believe that either of your amps exist until you use them to create a submission to the SG101 2015 Compilation!

I'll see if my quadrennial original thought occurs; winters can get weird, never know.
Laughing

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

JakeDobner wrote:

Unlikely! But we are in the early stages of writing the next 'Verb record!

Well a new Verb record is a good thing for sure but come on...
there's got to be a sketch of something you can do with your Vox amp, great guitars, Logic software, Dobner musical sensibilities.....

and Wes,

Do It! Create some music and share it with us. I'd really like that.

O.K., I'm done with my challenges.
Sorry for the thread Hijack,
back to the Vox celebration.

Congratulations guys!

Cheers,
Jeff

http://www.facebook.com/CrazyAcesMusic
http://www.youtube.com/user/crazyacesrock
http://www.reverbnation.com/crazyacesmusic

It wouldn't be a surf song, though. It might have reverb and such, but I wouldn't do a surf song and release it on the comp before it was perfect.

There is one I want to re-record that would never be a 'Verb song. And it won't ever have drums, so that is a plus.

CrazyAces wrote:

and Wes,

Do It! Create some music and share it with us. I'd really like that.

Actually Jeff I have an idea (from something I uploaded before) that I realize now I wasn't thinking big enough and just dumping it off my head. Probably not to be realized for the '15 Comp, but something I'm going to work on while the snow flies so I'm shooting for '16. But, yes, there is something happening. Many of those here are compositional influences and redefined for me the art of the possible.

Now go hug your beautiful Princeton. Big Grin

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

ERRATA, also known as "72 hours in, and some further observations" aka "The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly" of changing power tubes on the current AC10c1.

GOOD: The lovely tone is still there. Looking closer from the inside, the cabinet is vented at the bottom front, not visible behind the grill cloth. A matching opening is in the back panel. Nice little detail the little neoprene booties at the top of the power tube holding springs that hold the top of the spring against the tube's nipple. Also, the entire cabinet is extremely solid, and probably helps the great frequency response of the speaker they chose. One unfortunate side-note (TINSTAAFL) about this rigidity is...

BAD (or at least a PITA): 17 screws, ALL of which have to come out in order to remove the back panel & change power tubes. CAUTION: The drilling & assembly are EXTREMELY well-done and these screws are IN THERE, sunk deeper than the Bismarck. I highly recommend you make sure you have THE RIGHT BIT screwdriver and, using good pressure, back these out the first time BY HAND before grabbing your little 20v Lithium-Ion helper. CAUTION #2: Take note of the 2 different types of screws that come out; the shorter ones are machine screws (inner panel & top-3 of the outer area) and the longer pointy ones sink into the perimeter wood.

UGLY: When the whole panel is off, particularly if you have the amp down on its face, the amp chassis/tray is going to want to swing away from you & rest itself on the speaker magnet - gravity has not been repealed. (Go ahead while you change tubes or whatever, the tubes etc. aren't what's resting on the speaker.) The issue is that the machine screws in the inner portion of the back panel (L-R, 10 o'clock & 2 o'clock to the AC and extension speaker jack openings) are going to be the ones you need (or perhaps the top inner 3) to help draw that chassis tray back straight and get the whole thing back together. (Fortunately unless you're an inveterate tube swapper you don't have to do this very often.) You can see below in a picture of the back panel the 2 screws I left in as reference that will help start the whole thing back on. You can also see the openings in the front-bottom of the baffle and the matching one at the back.

image
image

Here's how I got things back together:
Leaving the 2 screws mentioned in place on the back panel (they'll stay there), I tipped it up on its top and held it at about a 45° angle over toward its back to let gravity work the other way and have the amp tray hang straight rather than where it was resting before - it will, it's not "stuck" to the back of the speaker magnet. Holding it thus, you can then start one of the screws (don't go all the way), and then start the other one. Then snug both of them down & put the amp back however you were working on it & put the back panel back on, remembering to use machine screws where they were and the wood screws where they were. It actually took longer to type all this than to do it, once I had a sip of coffee & looked at it & said, "hmmm." So there you have it; just wanted to put that in here in case someone gets this amp & searches for this after doing a "WTF, over?"

The Lovely: Eastwood, Van Cleef & Wallach head off in the sunset. Now comes, perhaps, that lovely lady on Jake's cover or, one of my favorites, Ingrid Bergman in a rainy Paris.

I replaced the Chinese power tubes (no issues, they are a pleasant surprise actually) with a nice matched set of low-hour Russians (Tung Sols) I got awhile back that will draw 34.4 & 34.8mA of plate current (Ip). Simplistically, stay cleaner longer. Net result is that MV at 3:00 is now at 1:30, with the pre-amp just as before - so an overall clean volume gain & the tone is a little bit fuller. Still no ear-spiking highs; it is still attack-sensitive, which I like. When mixed with the Fender's circuit & 6L6's it just adds something that really lets notes articulate all the way up the neck.

Like this amp ALOT. (Just not gonna replace the power tubes again today, lol.) Now I'm gonna Tangaroa my butt downstairs & refill the coffee cup.
Cool

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

Last edited: Dec 02, 2015 12:01:54

Here's a (vocal) song that I play the guitars on and the only amp I used was a Vox AC10 (60s). It's one of the best amps I've ever heard.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySnm_TBOwjQ

Surfersaurus wrote:

Here's a (vocal) song that I play the guitars on and the only amp I used was a Vox AC10 (60s). It's one of the best amps I've ever heard.

Thanks Martin; sometimes little amps really get the job done. Still running the EF86 tube in the pre-amp?

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

Badger wrote:

Surfersaurus wrote:

Here's a (vocal) song that I play the guitars on and the only amp I used was a Vox AC10 (60s). It's one of the best amps I've ever heard.

Thanks Martin; sometimes little amps really get the job done. Still running the EF86 tube in the pre-amp?

Wes, I can't remember if that has the EF86 or not? I know we changed one of my original AC15 amps to a 12AX7 because it kept going microphonic and was unreliable. Hard to find a good EF86 tube. Also, once the amp was turned up 1/2 way I'd doubt you'd hear the difference.

Pretty sure that amp used an EF86 initially but many were changed to be able to use a 12AX7 (the pin-out voltages are different) for the exact problem you mention, glitchy/microphonic EF86 tubes. And, yeah, once turned up probably most people wouldn't notice. I was just curious. Smile

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

I had an amp (65 amps London) which used an EF86 and it was quite nice and harmonically rich with that tube. I found NOS (mullard / bugel boy) EF86 pretty good. I tried a EHX ef86 but was a bit noisy. The old ones seem to be less noisy. That being said those EF86 are prone to issues with amp vibration (amp travel and speaker vibration. Vox's with EF86 are fantastic sounding.

derekirving wrote:

I had an amp (65 amps London) which used an EF86 and it was quite nice and harmonically rich with that tube. I found NOS (mullard / bugel boy) EF86 pretty good. I tried a EHX ef86 but was a bit noisy. The old ones seem to be less noisy. That being said those EF86 are prone to issues with amp vibration (amp travel and speaker vibration. Vox's with EF86 are fantastic sounding.

Yes, I believe you. We've all heard plenty of evidence they sound great. I read something not long ago by one of the British tube gurus that said, on a design criteria level, Denney got it "wrong" with that tube in terms of the voltages the tube should've been operating at. But aren't we lucky for it? Smile

With either tube, Vox's pre-amp stack has always had a nice musical quality to it. And if you don't overdrive it, the EL-84 has a nice quality to it on the output - probably why audiophiles still like it for their stereos.

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

I've been kind of jones'in for a Vox even thought I'm a Fender 6L6 tweed diehard. There's a few current cats I listen too who get great tones with them. Kid Ramos and Matt Verta Ray (Heavy Trash) - though I think both may play AC30 I'm interested in an AC 15 (I don't need the AC30 volume or weight)

derekirving wrote:

I've been kind of jones'in for a Vox even thought I'm a Fender 6L6 tweed diehard. There's a few current cats I listen too who get great tones with them. Kid Ramos and Matt Verta Ray (Heavy Trash) - though I think both may play AC30 I'm interested in an AC 15 (I don't need the AC30 volume or weight)

When I was trying out all this stuff at the shop I thought the AC15 was outta hand in the tone department with the Alnico Blue. The Greenback I thought was a bit more mid-humpy but some folks obviously want that for their style. They're both worth a play.
Stir the Pot

Wes
SoCal ex-pat with a snow shovel

DISCLAIMER: The above is opinion/suggestion only & should not be used for mission planning/navigation, tweaking of instruments, beverage selection, or wardrobe choices.

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