IvanP
Well, I think I found the main thread tying all these different bands that recorded Exotic.

Jim Waller & the Deltas ('62?)
Bob Vaught & the Renegaids (2/63)
The Sentinals ('63)
Dave Myers & the Surftones ('63)
The Original Surfaris ('63)
The Rhythm Kings ('63)

What's one thing they all have in common? Tony Hilder as producer!! I'd bet you anything that he owned the publishing on Exotic and therefore had all the bands (or many of them, anyway) that he was recording simply do a version of it during the sessions.

IvanP
Jim Waller & the Deltas and Al Garcia & the Rhythm Kings two versions are extremely similar. They both feature the sax on the lead, and have almost the same lead guitar break in the middle. My guess is that these two versions are the earliest ones (and John Blair's release date for the Deltas version - late '62 - would support that).

The Sentinals and Bob Vaught & the Renegaids (Renegades?) are extremely similar to each other, but fairly dissimilar to Deltas/Rhythm-Kings version. They both don't have the original 'b' section of the song, also, but rather after playing the verse a few times go to the bridge. (The Renegaids rhythm guitarist is WAY off in some parts of the song - what the hell??) Again, my guess is that this is the second version of the song, chronologically speaking, though who the hell really knows?

Finally, Dave Myers & the Surftones and the Original Surfaris versions are very similar to each other, but again fairly dissimilar to the other versions. My guess is that this is the final version of the song to be recorded.

ran
So after all is said and done (and thanks for the lab testing, Ivan), do you think that Exotic was basically a rip-off of Miserlou, written to ride the success waves of Dick Dale's version? That's what it always sounded like to me, but I have never conducted any research to backup this theory.

allright, using my RMSSS (retarded manual song search system, i.e. flipping through my collection) I found Waller's, the Sentinels, the Surfaris and Rhythm Kings's versions. (any pointers on where to find the others appreciated!)

I'll buy Ivan's producer theory, and also the chronolgy of versions, except maybe for the rhythm kings who might have done a earlier version but still record post-miserlou (and post the other versions)', you know offering something else then the Dick Dale sound at that time plenty available? I just dont know, So I'll just talk Waller now.

but here goes: The Jim Waller version sounds pretty much pre-surf instro, and in fact seems nothing like Miserlou, except for "that" scale which, with all due respect, was not exactly invented by Dick Dale. Wallers version has the sax of course, but also is much slower, has a cleaner sound, and a much more latin feel rhytm. If I would call that 'heavily influenced by' Id sooner hear lots of "night in Tunisia" or other 40's jazz in it than Miserlou. Anyway, seems more jazz and presurf instro influenced. Of course, Im neglecting preDD versions of miserlou, but in any case, the influence wouldn't have been DD's version of Miserlou, or the surfcraze in general.

But - the later versions do sound very miserlou-ish. So Im assuming what happened is, Jim Waller recorded the Tony Hilder-owned song, in a Jim Waller style and it had nothing to do Miserlou. but then Dick Dale's miserlou came along, and when Tony Hilder was recording with the later bands (I only have o. surfaris and sentinals though), he thought "okay, let's see what Ive got in my portefolio to cash in on the Miserlou popularitry, and which will fit these typical surfsound bands?"... and that's when exotic came back for a second round and got played Dick Dale style.

So, in response to Ran, I assume the song itself is in no way a DD rip off, or written as one, but the post waller versions in some respect are recorded as one, or at least might be intended to be.

I couldn't find the exact release dates, if anyone has those that might be interesting. also, is this Tony Hilder guy still alive? anyone got an e-mail adress? that would be totally cool to just ask him what happened!

WR

Rules to live by #314:
"When in Italy, if the menu says something's grilled, don't assume it is."

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thanks Klas - I have the strummin mentals... go figure, RMSSS is quite primitive

Rules to live by #314:
"When in Italy, if the menu says something's grilled, don't assume it is."

https://www.facebook.com/The-Malbehavers-286429584796173/

wooza
Has anyone else heard the "mariachi" version that Phil Dirt used to occasionally play on his show? ...

That wouldn't be the Rhythm Kings version, would it? It's heavily horn-based.

WR
So, in response to Ran, I assume the song itself is in no way a DD rip off, or written as one, but the post waller versions in some respect are recorded as one, or at least might be intended to be.

I sort of put Ran's observation down to the "unfamiliar genre effect." (Like me trying to keep two Robert Johnson pieces separate in my mind.) In songs from a genre that isn't familar, the characteristics of the genre outweigh the individual characteristics of the song. Another name for this is "all white guys look alike."

I don't mean surf music isn't familiar to Ran or anyone else, but only that the Flamenco malaguenas "palo," from which certain surf songs like Malaguena and Exotic take their inspiration isn't familar.

Actually, Misirlou isn't Spanish at all, though I think The Wedge fits the general pattern, especially in the Bakarat version, which inserts that Malaguena-derived bit. Misirlou is a Middle Eastern standard. It's just "also exotic," not "also Exotic."

I suppose my urge to classify The Space Victory Theme as a wild variant of Exotic might be something like Ran's reaction. "Similar characteristics" plus "one familiar riff."

Apart from that, it doesn't hurt that the standard surf version of Exotic, like the Bakarat version of The Wedge, inserts the (Lecuona) Malaguena "123 123 ..." modulation riff as, I think, the B part. (I notice this riff is often in what amounts to 3/4 time, as it was in the original.)

I couldn't find the exact release dates, if anyone has those that might be interesting. also, is this Tony Hilder guy still alive? anyone got an e-mail adress? that would be totally cool to just ask him what happened!

A little quick checking that I didn't pursue yet:

Tony Hilder
Bacchus Records
Al Garcia : Exotic and Rockin' Instrumentals, 1963-1964 (not responding)
Al Garcia

In the last, similar artists "Ray Campi" sure rings a bell!

Klas
It sure would be neat with an internet surf music database, similar to the Ugly Things garage comp database.

Not to derail this thread, but we've been thinking about creating a Wiki to compile a list of bands, etc.

Site dude - S3 Agent #202
Need help with the site? SG101 FAQ - Send me a private message - Email me

"It starts... when it begins" -- Ralf Kilauea

Exotic played live by OuterWave at the Surf Museum

http://www.outerwavesurfband.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/exotic.mp3

WR
yeah, we're agreeing here I think - Ran proposed specifically that exotic was written as a (DD-)miserlou copy, and my only point was that that doesn't make sense cause Wallers version isnt like DD-miserlou at all, and "might" predate it. but that of course doesn't conflict with possible Flamenco roots.

I like your explanation, that the later versions might have been produced to cash in on the success of Miserlou. I was looking for input about the earlier versions, as I havn't heard them. And Tuck, I hope you weren't suggesting that I can't tell the difference between different Flamenco numbers.

The Scimitars

IvanP
Anyway, John Blair's book gives the following band lineup: Art Rodriguez (lead), Freddy Mendoza (rhythm), Al Garcia (bass), Vincent Bumatay (sax) and Mal Garcia (drums). The band was from Delano, CA. They have a CD out on Dionysus. It's under Al Garcia and the Rhythm Kings. Exotic isn't on it, but there are 15 other tracks. It's pretty cool stuff, from what I remember. (the liner notes list some other band members on sax and trumpet, but apparently they were not at the recording session.)

Ivan

That's what I've heard, but I think I can hear trombone and organ. I don't see how that can be just guitar and sax in the rhythm section.

Danny Snyder

Latest project - Now That's What I Call SURF
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"With great reverb comes great responsibility" - Uncle Leo

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DannySnyder
That's what I've heard, but I think I can hear trombone and organ. I don't see how that can be just guitar and sax in the rhythm section.

The links above on Alan Garcia and the Rhythm Kings suggest that the band had a complex history between the draft and this and that and were also used by their label to front for various unrecoverable studio sessions.

http://www.answers.com/topic/al-garcia
... they billed as the Piltdown Men after that fictional studio group's "Brontosaurus Stomp" became a hit in 1960. ~ Jason Ankeny, All Music Guide

So I imagine the extra musicians weren't regulars. I gather that Hilder's studio was a traditional tin pan alley operation, with the producer mixing and matching names, songs, and musicians.

I finally got around to looking at reverb central. The version I was talking about is in fact by the Sentinals, off the album "Vegas Go Go." (I guess I knew all this already. It must've been sitting in the back of my head after reading it a couple years ago.) Having just heard the Rhythm Kings' version and after reading Phil Dirt's review (I can't figure out how to create a link to it with his new site setup) it's pretty apparent that the Sentinals were copying the Rhythm Kings. They're definitely not as polished, but I'm really partial to their version. It's got character oozing all over.